2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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CjC
CjC
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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adrianjordan wrote:Does anyone have a link to the PP rumours or is it something which has originated within this very thread?
This thread/ BBC radio.

Don't care if they are true or not, it'all be a blow to Mclaren if he leaves but it certainly wasn't a blow to Red Bull When he left, they have carried on with supreme aero so it's not all PP.
Just a fan's point of view

R_Redding
R_Redding
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Joined: 30 Nov 2011, 14:22

Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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adrianjordan wrote:Does anyone have a link to the PP rumours or is it something which has originated within this very thread?
It was discussed on BBC Radio FP2 coverage as an aside to RDs issues. The commentators, Jack Nicholls and Mark Gallagher (the ex Cosworth boss) seemed surprised that they'd both heard the rumour independant of each other.

Jack Nicholls is on twitter ... Maybe someone could tweeet him for confirmation. (I'm not on twitter so I cant.)

https://twitter.com/Jack_Nicholls/

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mclaren111
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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BBC:
Andrew Benson, Chief F1 writer

Ron Dennis's 35-year tenure as the boss of McLaren is coming to an end.

The 69-year-old will be told by fellow shareholders on Tuesday that he must give up his position as chairman and chief executive of the McLaren Group.

He does not want to step down and failed in a High Court bid last week to prevent McLaren putting him on 'gardening leave' - but is likely to be left with no choice.

The exact nature of his departure is to be decided in talks with shareholders.

Dennis owns 25% of McLaren Group. Bahrain's Mumtalakat investment fund owns 50% and the remaining 25% is held by Dennis's long-time business partner Mansour Ojjeh, a Saudi-born Frenchman.

Dennis and Ojjeh fell out some years ago and the 64-year-old has sided with the Bahrainis in trying to remove his former friend.

It is felt that Dennis' autocratic style is ill-fitted to growing McLaren in the future.

It will be sad to see him go !!! :( :(

He still owns 25% of Group so maybe we will still see him at some races as VIP visitor

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Chuckjr
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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A McLaren without Ron Dennis...last time that happened they lost Lewis, put air dams on the rear suspension, and went from top 5 consistently to out of top 10.

Tragic he is gone. They had better get it right next year or Fred may follow Jenson into retirement. Smh.
Watching F1 since 1986.

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Unc1eM0nty
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Sad state of affairs this, he's old school, he's like a piece of the furniture, this circus won't be the same without him.

By all accounts he's a bit of a tw@#........... but he's our tw@#

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Shakeman
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Joined: 21 Mar 2011, 13:31
Location: UK

Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Unc1eM0nty wrote:Sad state of affairs this, he's old school, he's like a piece of the furniture, this circus won't be the same without him.

By all accounts he's a bit of a tw@#........... but he's our tw@#
Couldn't agree more. I used to love the Ronisms of old but he rarely appears in the coverage that I get to see now.

I'm sure he is a pain to work for and has unbelievably high standards that most of us would have difficulty attaining. Sometimes one got the impression that his misplaced OCD got in the way of results as the cleanliness of the garage floor appeared equally as important to winning races.

An F1 without Ron is a poorer F1 and a shame he couldn't have bowed out at the top.

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bauc
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Its official now, Ron Dennis is no longer at the top of Mclaren, and he has been put on gardening leave until his contract expires in January.

What a bad day for Mclaren, a bad day for the sport in general. I'm afraid that all of this power struggle battles at the top will have negative effect on the teams preparations for next year so at the moment I dont have a good feeling

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... laren-role
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Gaz.
Gaz.
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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mrluke wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:
ringo wrote:Mclaren's troubles are linked to the gamble to go with honda engines. The poor performance has put a lot of unwanted stress on an already struggling team.
When you compare them to Force India, you can see where FI has improved steadily while playing it safe and sticking to the evil they know. Ron should have kep the mercedes unit for another year and capture half decent results before switching to the very peculiar Honda.
Now they are in a very uncomfortable place. Honda MUST perform in 2017. I don't think Mclaren can take another mediocre year.
The chassis is an enigma, it's really hard to tell if it's crap or respectable, but Mclaren must get it right for 2017 as well.
It really seems clear to me that McLaren and STR both have chassis fairly close to Ferrari level(str optimised for high df while Mclaren optimised for efficiency at a lower df level), but both are saddled with ane engine penalty of something >.5 sec/lap.
I think the Mclaren is a much more "peaky" car to setup than the str. The str is able to perform consistently at nearly every grand prix whereas we saw this weekend, one Mclaren in top 10,the other in 17th with the driver saying he doesn't understand why the car doesn't work.
To be fair Button spent most of the summer of 2012 in exactly the same position. His season went pair shaped from Spain to Silverstone with a resurgence in Germany.
Forza Jules

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amho
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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Sasha wrote:Suzuka is all about being smooth and losing zero speed in fast and mid speed corners.So a great chassis(keeping it level to the ground at all times) and PU drivability(still must have great ICE power and great HERS at the sametime, KERS not as important at this track) is a must here.

Mclaren chassis doesn't keep level all the time and eats rear tires so sucks on mid to fast corners.Honda PU is behind everybody on drivability.
So gow do you explain this?

http://i.imgur.com/JGHtasS.jpg
once again u r talking about weak drivability, I can't understand?!
these days turbo engines almost have a flat torque-rev curve and only matter is when it reaches the desired boost (I mean turbo lag) and if u believe that Honda has a small compressor so it should have minimum moment inertia so it should have minimum turbo lag and more importantly by using mgh-h assist turbo lag must be zero...
There is no Might or Power except with Allah.

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nevill3
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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I think Ron has engineered this exit so he can have Bernie's Job now we have new owners of F1. When he heard that that other Mr. F1 (Ross) was lining himself up for the job he had to do something drastic to be able to leave McLaren to be available next year himself. :wink:

Seriously though I am more concerned now than I have ever been, it would be sad to see McLaren go the same way that Williams has. Without a strong leader McLaren could be in danger of losing focus and ending up having a succession of "team Principles" just like Ferrari
Sent from my Commodore PET in 1978

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bauc
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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nevill3 wrote:I think Ron has engineered this exit so he can have Bernie's Job now we have new owners of F1. When he heard that that other Mr. F1 (Ross) was lining himself up for the job he had to do something drastic to be able to leave McLaren to be available next year himself. :wink:

Seriously though I am more concerned now than I have ever been, it would be sad to see McLaren go the same way that Williams has. Without a strong leader McLaren could be in danger of losing focus and ending up having a succession of "team Principles" just like Ferrari
Ross said in a recent interview (http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/10/31/ ... a-f1-team/) that he would never go back to a team, so that is out of the cards
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Mansell89
Mansell89
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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I think McLaren have got this wrong.

Ron needed to see this Honda project through. It hasn't seen success yet but they laid the foundations this year and the push should come in 2017 and 2018.

I know Ron is a tw@ but surely you want him in your camp. He had to come in to get some big calls made- get rid of a customer Merc engine, bring in a works engine (Honda), get a top driver (Alonso), snap up Prodromou and get the management around him sorted (Boullier for the race team, Capito for the company). As far as i could see, Ron was setting it up so that he could be hands off and worry about business instead of racing.

It is a massive call and if they don't bring in a brilliant person then it could be catastrophic. Ron knows more and has forgotten more about F1 than those Bahrainis ever could, and it was Dennis' vision that brought Mansour Ojieh into McLaren as an investor instead of a sponsor.

If Dennis' sponsorship "failings" is the problem, why has Ojjehs (essentially) own company (TAG) switched to Red Bull?

Ron might appear on another planet but he has navigated McLaren through choppy waters to be race winners in a highly competitive environment, overseeing rebirths in in the early 80s late 80s, 1997-1998, and 2007-2012.

They have had to be brave enough to suffer the Honda embarrassment in search of success, because being points contenders in a Merc customer car isn't good enough for Ron and his team, and they should be applauded for their ambition.

Let's hope that the development is set in motion similar to when Ross Brawn left Mercedes.

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nevill3
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Mansell89 wrote:I think McLaren have got this wrong.

Ron needed to see this Honda project through. It hasn't seen success yet but they laid the foundations this year and the push should come in 2017 and 2018.

I know Ron is a tw@ but surely you want him in your camp. He had to come in to get some big calls made- get rid of a customer Merc engine, bring in a works engine (Honda), get a top driver (Alonso), snap up Prodromou and get the management around him sorted (Boullier for the race team, Capito for the company). As far as i could see, Ron was setting it up so that he could be hands off and worry about business instead of racing.

It is a massive call and if they don't bring in a brilliant person then it could be catastrophic. Ron knows more and has forgotten more about F1 than those Bahrainis ever could, and it was Dennis' vision that brought Mansour Ojieh into McLaren as an investor instead of a sponsor.

If Dennis' sponsorship "failings" is the problem, why has Ojjehs (essentially) own company (TAG) switched to Red Bull?

Ron might appear on another planet but he has navigated McLaren through choppy waters to be race winners in a highly competitive environment, overseeing rebirths in in the early 80s late 80s, 1997-1998, and 2007-2012.

They have had to be brave enough to suffer the Honda embarrassment in search of success, because being points contenders in a Merc customer car isn't good enough for Ron and his team, and they should be applauded for their ambition.

Let's hope that the development is set in motion similar to when Ross Brawn left Mercedes.
I agree totally, all the pieces are in place for a stellar season next year, lets hope it happens and the board decide that they were wrong and go begging to Ron to come back and captain the ship. However if next year does prove to be a success maybe people will say it is because Ron has left!
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Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Ron is very harsh as a businessmen, but not a bad person to be honest. I think it's really sad this happened, especially this way.
There was some discussion on Sky on the reasons why, but it's a bit vague to be honest. It does show that there is quite something going on with Mclaren,
and it seems Ron made a move that ultimately fell through and he got the worst of it.

I don't understand how they really treat Ron like this, he really made Mclaren into Mclaren. Let's face it, Bruce Mclaren was a cool guy, and had some fun stuff,
but it was Ron Dennis who turned Mclaren into what it is/was. It was Ron Dennis that turned Mclaren into the team that housed arguably the best ever F1 team,
car and driver in the history of F1 with Senna driving the Marlboro sponsored 1000+ BHP Honda powered screaming monster. It almost feels like kicking Enzo
Ferrari out of Ferrari. Speaking of Ferrari, Luca di Montezemolo being dropped has not done too much good for F1 still.

I don't know what the reasoning is here and what is the real reason Ron Dennis stepped in and made a move. IIRC the stock holders didn't enjoy much Ron trying
to get it in big Chinese hands, but i could be mistaken that that was actually the case where Ron wanted to block.

BTW, TAG and TAG HEUER are not the same.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

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Only Ron and the other shareholders know the real reasons...
Whatever happens to Ron, this will have a huge impact on Honda dealings with Mclaren.
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