The 2016 F1 WDC Title Dumpster Topic

[turbof1]

TAG, easy on the personal comments. Disagreeing is fine, but it's not to call someone else his comments "BS", or " "proving" a supposition that comes with a tin foil sombrero". Especially the latter as that can be counted as mocking someone's culture.

Give us a little bit of slack, I thought that was pretty cheeky wordsmithing on my part. This is the thread where we're allowed to take the gloves off somewhat. It's why it was separated from the main thread. I know where the line is, and I promise never to 1) escalate it and 2) cross it.

It's fun having a little toe to toe every now and then. I would never behave in such a manner outside of the playground; Promise. Thank you for the notice though, maybe it will help to kind of set the expectation for the rest of what's to come in this thread over the next few months.

I did keep things factual in my counterpoint though right?

I don't allow involving someone's culture in this (well unless it is self-mockery). As you'll know, I can be quite playful myself and I do allow that. But you have to understand where to draw limits. Be personal but not too personal, if you know what I mean. Like this:




Now excuse while I am tagging you for my warhead. Watch the sky, birdy!

[Vasconia]

TAG, take it easy:

1. So Lewis has had 4 bad starts and Nico 2. I dont forget this as I have ALREADY mentioned that the main reason which explains why Lewis could loose the championship is exactly this one.

And why this fact makes look my comment about Nico´s perfomance false? because yo have quoted it, and if Nico has had fewer bad starts my comment about his performance looks even more logic.

2. A problem that Nico was able to fix it, while Lewis wasn´t . And yes, when someone has a problem and you win because of that, is taking your chance of winning a race.

3. Uhh okkkk 3 years. I guess this was enough to make such a stupid comment as the one you have done. Were you trying to insult me or something? dont worry I dont understand your supposed cultural reference.

4. I meant the credit by people like you, not by the team. It was obvious but ok. Its pretty clear that Mercedes gives Nico some credit, this is his sixth season with them.

I dont understand such an agressive response to my argumentation about Nico´s righ to be WC. Is that insulting the mere fact that someone can have a different opinion?

[TAG]

I'm Cuban so I reserve the right to the cultural reference; Cultural immunity if you wish, but I understand your point, it was meant in the most bro's talking smack over a beer sort of way imaginable, not in any other fashion.

@Vasconia,
It's not an aggressive response it's more of a sarcastic response to what you're trying to sell which when analyzed falls apart rather easily. When you've got an opinion, I'm cool with that but opinions do not supersede facts.

I'm done with the commentary, so no need for further rehashing especially when you're counter is that Mercedes have kept Rosberg for 6 years. That one made me chuckle actually.

I guess Ferrari didn't want him.

[turbof1]

I'm Cuban so I reserve the right to the cultural reference; Cultural immunity if you wish, but I understand your point, it was meant in the most bro's talking smack over a beer sort of way imaginable, not in any other fashion.

@Vasconia, I'm done with the commentary, I think my facts trump your opinion so no need for further rehashing especially when you're counter is that Mercedes have kept Rosberg for 6 years. That one made me chuckle actually. Ferrari didn't want Rosberg?

He is from Spain, so historically he actually reserves that right as they colonized Cuba .

In a pub this would indeed be normal talk. However, we neither have loud shattering mixed with music, brains dipped in an alcohol vinegar or a context that allows for such comradry smacktalk. However it's good you pointed out it is in good jest.

[ChrisDanger]

When you've got an opinion, I'm cool with that but opinions do not supersede facts.

You may draw on facts but it's still your interpretation of these facts that forms your opinion. So you can't actually claim to have any higher ground here, since you guys are simply interpreting things differently, and are equally entitled to do so.

What I find curious is that you claim to be ambivalent yet...

Personally I'd love it if Rosberg's engine blew up 3 laps before the end of the race; actually I hope he's actually leading the race and then just three laps to go, Kablammo! I'd love to see his hopes and dreams dashed...

[TAG]

When you've got an opinion, I'm cool with that but opinions do not supersede facts.

You may draw on facts but it's still your interpretation of these facts that forms your opinion. So you can't actually claim to have any higher ground here, since you guys are simply interpreting things differently, and are equally entitled to do so.

What I find curious is that you claim to be ambivalent yet...

Personally I'd love it if Rosberg's engine blew up 3 laps before the end of the race; actually I hope he's actually leading the race and then just three laps to go, Kablammo! I'd love to see his hopes and dreams dashed...

See that's a clearly stated fantastical wish and it has as much value as the other umpteen contrary comments we come across. It's meant only to counterbalance, perhaps even antagonize a little bit those with a nebulous air of hatred towards the one driver on the grid that irks them so. Did it bother you or are you just seeking clarification?

I mean can you have imagined this place if Hamilton had gone off on Charlie the way Vettel did?

[SparkyAMG]

I've said this elsewhere and I'll say it here too:

It's very clear that Hamilton has made peace with the fact that he won't be winning this year's championship. The odds aren't in his favour and he's had since Japan to come to terms with that.

What he has got is the chance to finish the season with more wins, more poles and a points difference that is virtually nothing considering his reliability problems this year. If he wins in Abu Dhabi (and even if he doesn't) he won't look back at 2016 and think "I got beaten fair and square by the better man"... instead he'll know that he still has the edge over Rosberg and probably always will do. It's not a fourth title, but for a man renowned for being one of the quickest in F1 it is some consolation.

I'm not saying Rosberg is undeserving because he has driven consistently all year and on a couple of occasions has clearly had the better pace, but it's also unfair to suggest he's been the better driver of the two, because had the pair had similar reliability the title would have probably been wrapped up two weeks ago in Brazil. By Hamilton.

[turbof1]

When you've got an opinion, I'm cool with that but opinions do not supersede facts.

You may draw on facts but it's still your interpretation of these facts that forms your opinion. So you can't actually claim to have any higher ground here, since you guys are simply interpreting things differently, and are equally entitled to do so.

What I find curious is that you claim to be ambivalent yet...

Personally I'd love it if Rosberg's engine blew up 3 laps before the end of the race; actually I hope he's actually leading the race and then just three laps to go, Kablammo! I'd love to see his hopes and dreams dashed...

See that's a clearly stated fantastical wish and it has as much value as the other umpteen contrary comments we come across. It's meant only to counterbalance, perhaps even antagonize a little bit those with a nebulous air of hatred towards the one driver on the grid that irks them so. Did it bother you or are you just seeking clarification?

I mean can you have imagined this place if Hamilton had gone off on Charlie the way Vettel did?

The thing is, the thread has done remarkably well without openly wishing for one of the drivers to have bad luck. Someone around expressed the wish that Rosberg only ended up fourth in Brazil so we could have one last race full of tension. I stand behind that: most people here aren't so much busy what is fair down to the letter, but rather want a situation of uncertainty.

Haven't we discussed what's fair or not, talked to death already? There is really nothing more to discuss on that front, no matter what your point of view is.

[Vasconia]

I'm not saying Rosberg is undeserving because he has driven consistently all year and on a couple of occasions has clearly had the better pace, but it's also unfair to suggest he's been the better driver of the two, because had the pair had similar reliability the title would have probably been wrapped up two weeks ago in Brazil. By Hamilton.

I think that no one is saying this. We all know that Hamilton is better and with 0 realiabity problems and good starts he could have won a few races ago, but realiability and starts do count so this is the current situation and everybody should face it. Still he can win and this is the best thing, anything can happen on Sunday! =D>

[TAG]

And I'm no different there, I'd love it if we had a situation where the winner of the race would be the winner of the championship but that's not the case is it? And why is it not the case? Some people claim it's because of Rosberg's skill and finesse and ability to take advantage of every situation where his teammate has slipped up.

I don't see it that way. I've provided quite a bit of detail (facts) as to why I don't see it that way, yet the focus is on my fantasy meant to counterbalance the comments we see so often from others?

I just don't have the vim and vigor to go back and cut/paste but I can guarantee you that in every race thread there's at least one or two wishful thinking posts. I made my hyperbolic to prove a point not because that's what I feel.

In both the fantasy games I play, I have or will chose a Mercedes 1-2. So when it matters, I'm very much a realist. Perhaps I'm more sensitive than most to comments that go out of their way to rebut the hyperbole while not offering any rebuttal to the facts.

[Vasconia]

I'm Cuban so I reserve the right to the cultural reference; Cultural immunity if you wish, but I understand your point, it was meant in the most bro's talking smack over a beer sort of way imaginable, not in any other fashion.

@Vasconia,
It's not an aggressive response it's more of a sarcastic response to what you're trying to sell which when analyzed falls apart rather easily. When you've got an opinion, I'm cool with that but opinions do not supersede facts.

I'm done with the commentary, so no need for further rehashing especially when you're counter is that Mercedes have kept Rosberg for 6 years. That one made me chuckle actually.

I guess Ferrari didn't want him.

Selling what? I say " Rosberg has had a good peformance" and you response is a graphic where it shown that Rosberg has had fewer reliability problems and better starts". In which universe having better starts is not part of the performance?. You accuse me of overlooking thing while you are ignoring facts.

I speak about giving credit to what Nico does, you speak about the team when I was refering to certain people on this forum who always are minusvalorating what Nico does. Anyway, I say that if a team keeps a driver for 6 years it must be because the team thinks that he has done a good. Then your answer is simply to say that my answer is ridiculous. Man, it seems that you ignore what I say or we simply live in different realities.

[FrukostScones]

Meeow.

[TAG]

Where woul dbe ROS without all the unfair penalty seconds? Miles ahead.

Which one the one that kept him in the same position after the penalty? That unfair one? Because I know you're not talking about the unfair penalty he got speeding through a yellow flags.

Selling what? I say " Rosberg has had a good peformance" and you response is a graphic where it shown that Rosberg has had fewer reliability problems and better starts". In which universe having better starts is not part of the performance?. You accuse me of overlooking thing while you are ignoring facts.

In the universe where you try to obfuscate fewer reliability issues by rolling it up neatly with better performance meaning or implying that Nico is inherently better at taking case of his car, that leading to the disparity of mechanical failures. I'm still awaiting the data that backs that statement up.

[Vasconia]

Where woul dbe ROS without all the unfair penalty seconds? Miles ahead.

Which one the one that kept him in the same position after the penalty? That unfair one? Because I know you're not talking about the unfair penalty he got speeding through a yellow flags.

Selling what? I say " Rosberg has had a good peformance" and you response is a graphic where it shown that Rosberg has had fewer reliability problems and better starts". In which universe having better starts is not part of the performance?. You accuse me of overlooking thing while you are ignoring facts.

In the universe where you try to obfuscate fewer reliability issues by rolling it up neatly with better performance meaning or implying that Nico is inherently better at taking case of his car, that leading to the disparity of mechanical failures. I'm still awaiting the data that backs that statement up.

I have NOT said that NIco has a better performance than Lewis. I have always said that his performance has been GOOD.

During the last six year Nico has had fewer reliablity issues than Michael(first) and Lewis(now). Obviously I dont have data from the team but one logic conclusion could be that Nico .. a) has an inmense luck or b) he probably is quite gentle with his car.

We can count how many failures each driver has had, I guess its the only data we can have unless you tell me that you have specific information from the team. If yo have it you can share it and we could see the specific reason for every technical failure.

The problem with the stars has not been related to any technical problem but more with a system which is not particularly easy to use it properly. Both drivers have been forced to work hard in order to solve their difficulties using it, and it seems that Nico has done a slightly better job.

[FrukostScones]

don't worry HAM will win.

And as I thought this was the official WDC final troll thread.