2017 AMG Mercedes F1 Team - Mercedes

[Jolle]

I argue on that.

I'm not sure the systems are perfect and I'm aware that other issues affect the car's performance but...

Paddy Lowe:

“If drivers from the past got into these cars they’d been mind-blown by how well balanced they are. We can build the car far more precisely and repeatably these days – and the degree to which we’re tailoring the aero and mechanical platforms almost corner by corner, or even within the corner through brake balance, all these different things, gives a car where you can get to point in the weekend where the drivers is saying, ‘There’s nothing to tune. It’s a perfectly balanced car.’ It’s not quite like that – because the tyre is moving around – but it’s vastly better to how it was 20 years ago when you had to take a really very crude approximation of getting a balance at as many corners as possible whilst accepting the others would be rubbish.”

The systems really seem to be close to silver bullet territory.

This is also the main reason why the difference between teammates are getting closer. One of the main assets of drivers is how they handle a certain unpredictability and unbalance. If there isn't any, there are less moments to excel.

[Just_a_fan]

This is also the main reason why the difference between teammates are getting closer. One of the main assets of drivers is how they handle a certain unpredictability and unbalance. If there isn't any, there are less moments to excel.

Indeed so. Some drivers are quick all the time, some only when the car is just right. One of the Button's failings is his need for the car to be spot on. If it's not, he loses a lot of time.

[KeiKo403]

Excuse the off topicness but while how long did RBR have their solution for? If it was post Russia would be have seen a totally different Kvyat on par with Ricciardo?

I would post this in RBR thread but would seem out of context there so sorry

[PlatinumZealot]

REdBull's was probably from the onset of the season. But the RedBull one seems to aimed at lowering the rear end of the car at high speeds and rasing it up at low speeds, enhancing the aerodynmics of the car. It's an interesting topic and deserves it own thread in the aerodynamics section.

[Webber2011]

REdBull's was probably from the onset of the season. But the RedBull one seems to aimed at lowering the rear end of the car at high speeds and rasing it up at low speeds, enhancing the aerodynmics of the car. It's an interesting topic and deserves it own thread in the aerodynamics section.

Great idea !

This topic interests me a great deal, and I'd love to learn more about it

[KeiKo403]

sorry if I've missed it but if Paddy is moving to Williams who's taking over from him, or is a replacement not required?

[GPR-A duplicate2]

sorry if I've missed it but if Paddy is moving to Williams who's taking over from him, or is a replacement not required?

While it is still a rumor that Paddy is moving to Williams, the rumor is also that Mercedes has done some sort of pre-agreement with James Allison to replace Paddy.

[PlatinumZealot]

I rate paddy slightly higher than James Allison in regards to leading an engineering team. Paddy had more convincing cars. james had one really good one. The 2012 lotus, which i thought was the fastest car in 2012 but the drivers werent good.

[Silent Storm]

I rate paddy slightly higher than James Allison in regards to leading an engineering team. Paddy had more convincing cars. james had one really good one. The 2012 lotus, which i thought was the fastest car in 2012 but the drivers werent good.

The only thing good about that Lotus was that it was good on its tyres and had good pace on medium downforce tracks.
Low and high downforce tracks its pace was average at best.
IMO 2012 McLaren was the fastest car.

[Facts Only]

The McLaren was the fastest car but if we are talking semantics we could say Kimi's Lotus was the fastest car as it completed the largest distance in the allotted race times? It was certainly the fastest car to complete every race doing all but one lap of the season.

[PlatinumZealot]

In 2013 the lotus was also quick.
I really do think in the hanfs of a tier one driver that car was championship material. But, i digress.

[Silent Storm]

2013 Lotus was fast as the season came to an end and could have won another 2-3 races in the hands of Kimi, but couldn't have won the championship even in the hands of Lewis or Fernando.
In 2012 yeah could have won more races as Kimi was rusty and Romain was inconsistent, but 2013 Lotus was a decent performer or an allrounder car IMO.

[astracrazy]

Would Paddy have any influence on car design anyway? I know his in charge of that side of the team, but I was under the impression thats what Costa and Willis were in charge of?

[iotar__]

2013 Lotus was fast as the season came to an end and could have won another 2-3 races in the hands of Kimi

This thread , completely wrong and against basic facts, Warning: off topic:
- Name those races. I'm not holding my breath
- No, they could not win the race "in the hands" of Raikkonen. He was no where in India, Japan, etc., Singapore (safety car bailed him), Korea (safety car bailed him)
- they could have won one race on merit but not in the hands of KR, Germany '13. They didn't want to win and used team orders in the most disgusting and stupid way, on top of safety car.

- They didn't get fast "as the season came to an end". They were the most competitive early in the season when in the hands of Raikkonen running one driver team they were losing races to Alonso/Ferrari (Barcelona, China) during the first laps. They won one race because of extreme tyres combination that didn't repeat itself
- They didn't get fast "as the season came to an end" Reason in one direction: see above and Red Bull dominating, reason in the opposite: they started maximizing results (qualifying , starts - like Japan)
- admittedly they coped fine with post GB tyre changes but the media stories of their development to excuse Hamilton/Mercedes getting outraced (Japan, Korea) were unfounded. Their last big development was longer wheelbase tried IIRC at Monza and introduced in Korea (plus see below*). More balance, tyres than pure performance. Mercedes was still quicker over one lap, probably because of evil tyres (temperatures).

To go back on dubious on topic: choosing between Allison and Lowe as if it was voting reality show without:
A. considering circumstances like size of the team, money, personnel (co-workers), technical rules etc.
B. thinking about the impact of one person (or lack thereof) on teams in different seasons and stages including engines and competition
is as pointless as it gets. Anyway if you care (I don't) I can add two rather forgotten events.

- 2013 - (this is *'see below') - The Device. Alison wasn't there any more but he was in '12 and it was his choice. Lotus wasted large chunk of development during two seasons, time and resources including free practise sessions, straight line tests and full scale wind tunnel tests on something that never worked.
- 2011 - front exhaust, affected also '12 and '13 - their best chance of success.
It works both ways ofc , very likely approach of risking brought some great results too.

[Manoah2u]

wall of nonsense.

why on earth did i get you off my ignore list again?