Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[lio007]

For completeness:

[godlameroso]

The MGU-H has to be powerful enough to spin the turbo so it has to be at least ~60kW. Probably more, harvesting at a rate of 60kW for 66 seconds would give you 4MJ, Barcelona is ~80-85 seconds per lap say around 60% is full throttle, so ~30 seconds of MGU-H harvesting (being intentionally conservative as the MGU-H isn't harvesting all the time at full throttle) Meaning a little under 2MJ can be harvested per lap. I think it's a little more than that.

I think ~80kW net harvesting rate is possible from the H, that would give ~3.2MJ per lap in Barcelona. Might be more this year as they expect 20% more full throttle. Mercedes is rumored to have such harvesting potential.

[henry]

The MGU-H has to be powerful enough to spin the turbo so it has to be at least ~60kW. Probably more, harvesting at a rate of 60kW for 66 seconds would give you 4MJ, Barcelona is ~80-85 seconds per lap say around 60% is full throttle, so ~30 seconds of MGU-H harvesting (being intentionally conservative as the MGU-H isn't harvesting all the time at full throttle) Meaning a little under 2MJ can be harvested per lap. I think it's a little more than that.

I think ~80kW net harvesting rate is possible from the H, that would give ~3.2MJ per lap in Barcelona. Might be more this year as they expect 20% more full throttle. Mercedes is rumored to have such harvesting potential.

When I timed last year's qualy lap I got WOT at 36 seconds.

The figures Magnetti Marelli quote in their previews suggest MGU-H output at around 50kw.

Hope that helps.

[Brian Coat]

My money in the "Competitive 2016 maximum MGU-H output " sweepstakes was on 90 kW ... on the basis that this would (At a guesstimate?) allow 'sustainable-MGU-K-at-will' on any circuit.

Whatever the figure is, 2017 aero might increase it.

[roon]

For completeness:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/681/32375 ... 05b0_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/781/32497 ... bc88_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/386/31654 ... 1845_o.png

What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?

[henry]

My money in the "Competitive 2016 maximum MGU-H output " sweepstakes was on 90 kW ... on the basis that this would (At a guesstimate?) allow 'sustainable-MGU-K-at-will' on any circuit.

Whatever the figure is, 2017 aero might increase it.

90 seems about right. Spa is around 70 seconds WOT and 2MJ at 30kw is 67 seconds.

Around 1MJ goes into the ES from braking so you would need to find 1MJ from somewhere else. Probably wouldn't be difficult.

[sosic2121]

Around 1MJ goes into the ES from braking so you would need to find 1MJ from somewhere else. Probably wouldn't be difficult.

I guess they harvest from MGU-K during corners(if there is enough fuel).
Also they can start harvesting before actually breaking.

[alexa]

Honda's foray into the hybrid-turbocharged power-unit era has been a laborious endeavor, but the Japanese manufacturer still has its sights on bridging the gap with pacesetters Mercedes and Ferrari.

Honda's return to F1 was an unmitigated disaster in 2015 but since, progress has been steady and solid but Honda boss Yusuke Hasegawa knows what must still be accomplished.

"From the point of view of the power unit, our goal is to reach the numbers of Mercedes and Ferrari," the Honda chief told Spanish sports daily AS.

"But it is difficult to know how much they will gain as well," he acknowledged

Honda boosts prospects with engine overhaul

Honda is now rumored to approach the 1000 horsepower mark in 2017, although specific figures remain under wrap.

On a relative basis, it also remains to be seen how much more power Mercedes and Ferrari may have extracted from their engines over the winter.

"We do not have a specific objective and we do not reveal numbers or power and the like. Catching up with the rest of the manufacturers is the goal, but we still do not know how much Mercedes, Ferrari and Renault have improved."

http://en.f1i.com/news/87448-honda-aimi ... rrari.html

[godlameroso]

For completeness:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/681/32375 ... 05b0_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/781/32497 ... bc88_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/386/31654 ... 1845_o.png

What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?

Looks like anodized aluminum to me.

[daren_p]

For completeness:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/681/32375 ... 05b0_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/781/32497 ... bc88_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/386/31654 ... 1845_o.png

What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?

Looks like anodized aluminum to me.

Probably not much purpose to anodize a wastegate but I'm thinking possibly ceramic coating?

[godlameroso]

What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?

Looks like anodized aluminum to me.

Probably not much purpose to anodize a wastegate but I'm thinking possibly ceramic coating?

Not the wastegate the actuator or solenoid or whatever it is, an aluminum wastegate would simply melt at those temperatures.

[PlatinumZealot]

For completeness:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/681/32375 ... 05b0_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/781/32497 ... bc88_o.png

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/386/31654 ... 1845_o.png

What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?

Good spot.
Could it be some sort of material that has high lubricity. Like some brass based material. Or maybe it is a titanium alloy. Those things must get very hot there on the manifold.

[daren_p]

Looks like anodized aluminum to me.

Probably not much purpose to anodize a wastegate but I'm thinking possibly ceramic coating?

Not the wastegate the actuator or solenoid or whatever it is, an aluminum wastegate would simply melt at those temperatures.

Hey, I'm not the one that said it was anodized aluminum, that's was you

Its pretty typical for road cars to have aluminum actuator bodies on the wastegates, but yes, the valve body itself must be cast of something else because of the heat/durability. Who knows what material they use in F1, but I do know they make many "fancy" ceramic coatings, some which look just like that same colour.

[coco-bun]

Some interesting facts about Honda PU, from Muramassa again.

P.S. iam at work so this is just a quick copy/paste...pictures likely not to work.



bought recent edition of magazine called Motor Fan last weekend
it's really intriguing
here's except, it's rough summary so if there's anything unclear I'll clarify

Hey gang, long time lurker making my first post. I never felt that I could contribute to the discussions here so I didn't bother to make an account... until today .

Anyways, you can preview the magazine GoranF1 is talking about legally following the publisher's site. Click this link and click that light grey button I circled in green (yes, I know I am awesome at MS Paint), and the preview should pop-up. Also, here's the link to a preview of the December 2015 issue that covers similar topics.

The images aren't that large nor are the best quality, but hey, it's a free preview. I'd offer to help translate the article but the text is not legible from the preview and looks like GoranF1 was kind enough to translate it all. Motor Fan Illustrated magazine is a publication covering mostly technical topics (I think they even released an issue just on fasteners once) and I think they had a few F1 specific issues few years ago... I can dig around for the preview link if you guys are interested.

Hope this helps.

[godlameroso]

You realize that the original question asked about the solenoid actuator or whatever, not the pipe itself.

"What is the the yellowish coating on the wastegate actuator housings?"