2017 F1 general testing thread

[GPR-A duplicate2]

You're not going to see most teams even bolt on the final aero spec until Melbourne, why you think they'd show their hand before that I have no idea.

The cars were quicker in testing last year than they were at the Grand Prix despite the updates all the teams will have had.

I feel you are missing a lot of basics. It's not a negative statement. The big difference between testing and race is weather. Cars get slower in summer. Just to inform, last year Mercedes was faster in qualifying than in winter testing,, considering weather impact. They sandbagged. So there is every reason to believe they are doing same now. What you see is not what the are capable of, it's far from it.

[PhillipM]

No, testing is about correlation, reliability and finding your setup windows, outright performance doesn't really need to be tested so long as you're close, long run tyre degradation is more important, most big teams will only bring final spec parts and turn the engines right up come Melbourne, it's not exactly a secret, this happens every, single, year.
Even more so this year when you have a big aero and tyre change.

[Wass85]

You're not going to see most teams even bolt on the final aero spec until Melbourne, why you think they'd show their hand before that I have no idea.

The cars were quicker in testing last year than they were at the Grand Prix despite the updates all the teams will have had.

I feel you are missing a lot of basics. It's not a negative statement. The big difference between testing and race is weather. Cars get slower in summer. Just to inform, last year Mercedes was faster in qualifying than in winter testing,, considering weather impact. They sandbagged. So there is every reason to believe they are doing same now. What you see is not what the are capable of, it's far from it.

I know all that and Massa set his time in April so if he had done that run in Feb-March he would have almost certainly gone faster.

[Big Mangalhit]

No, testing is about correlation, reliability and finding your setup windows, outright performance doesn't really need to be tested so long as you're close, long run tyre degradation is more important, most big teams will only bring final spec parts and turn the engines right up come Melbourne, it's not exactly a secret, this happens every, single, year.
Even more so this year when you have a big aero and tyre change.

Disagree. They might bring small updates to melbourne but have you ever seen them bring a whole new FW without testing it first? That could be quite unpredictable no? Do you really think they will only turn the engines "right up" come melbourne and risking them to blow up there where they are already limited to 4 engines per year. Instead of doing extensive tests now when they can change them. They should even be turning the engines to modes which are not supposed to be raced all the time to test them in limit conditions

[Wass85]

No, testing is about correlation, reliability and finding your setup windows, outright performance doesn't really need to be tested so long as you're close, long run tyre degradation is more important, most big teams will only bring final spec parts and turn the engines right up come Melbourne, it's not exactly a secret, this happens every, single, year.
Even more so this year when you have a big aero and tyre change.

With this being an aero dependent era with low tyre degradation surely the teams should be pushing their cars close to qualifying pace as race pace won't be as vital with it being harder to overtake?

[digitalrurouni]

The cars were quicker in testing last year than they were at the Grand Prix despite the updates all the teams will have had.

Yes, the temperatures and conditions are much different, they're not comparable.

That puts Massa's 08 time in better light as he set that time in April.

With a much lighter car it has to be said. So if the heavier cars can match that sort of a lap time I'd say it's an achievement!

[marvin78]

The laptime for one lap is irrelevant. We need more and constantly high speed in races .

[PhillipM]

Disagree. They might bring small updates to melbourne but have you ever seen them bring a whole new FW without testing it first? That could be quite unpredictable no? Do you really think they will only turn the engines "right up" come melbourne and risking them to blow up there where they are already limited to 4 engines per year. Instead of doing extensive tests now when they can change them. They should even be turning the engines to modes which are not supposed to be raced all the time to test them in limit conditions

We've seen complete new sidepod packages, new floors, new exhausts, we saw Red Bull recently completely change sidepod and exhaust systems on the very last day of testing...and yes, we've seen updated front wings arrive for the first time in Melbourne before now too. Last year for one.

[dren]

Yes, recently Red Bull has pushed increased their aero development time and introduced parts very late in testing, or at the first race.

[Big Mangalhit]

At last day of testing sure. Also introducing new parts in melbourne that were designed after testing sure. But I doubt that it is recurrent that teams have new pieces designed and produced but opt not to test them and wait till melbourne. But especially the idea that they don't crank the engine up to 100% before the first GP that I find it even more preposterous.

[Unc1eM0nty]

I think we should look at Honda troubles as troubling for F1 as a whole. We need to look at the facts.

1: In 2010 3 teams entered F1 (LotusF1, Virgin Racing and Hispania) as of 2017 all of those teams are out of F1.
2: Honda re-entered F1 in 2015 as PU supplier and 3 years later they stil have not achieved reasonable performance.

F1 rules are therefore insufficient for new entrants. I don't know why the F1 fraternity lets this even happen. F1 needs manufacturers to successful in order to attract more new entrants. However, F1 lets Honda struggle for 3 years. Its just stupid and robs F1 fans of a team of the caliber of McLaren to be not competitive. This is situation were there are no winners.....

Let Honda and future new entrants to F1 test more in order to catch-up and make it more easier for new entrants to be competitive. I don't like artificial tricks like weight penalty ectera. But, give new teams or PU manufactures a 12 month testing period. Japanese companies have a lot of pride, I don't see Honda in F1 in 2018 if 2017 is as horrible as 2015. They will simply pull to plug and focus maybe on Formula E or WEC.

Ref point 2.
Not sure what Honda have to do with the teams mentioned, they were hardly giants of the motor industry were they.

Ref point 2
Both Honda & McLaren should have taken more time, McLaren should have kept the Merc engine for another year while Honda did development work in the background, they started 3 years behind everyone else, it was naïve at best to think they could catch up.

I agree that new teams / engine suppliers should be given a lot more freedom, but they're not, they knew this all along.

[Sevach]

Yes, recently Red Bull has pushed increased their aero development time and introduced parts very late in testing, or at the first race.

A number of teams will be introducing updates only in Melbourne, Williams and Mclaren among them.

I'm unconvinced about this direction, but let's see if it pays off.

[mrluke]

No, testing is about correlation, reliability and finding your setup windows, outright performance doesn't really need to be tested so long as you're close, long run tyre degradation is more important, most big teams will only bring final spec parts and turn the engines right up come Melbourne, it's not exactly a secret, this happens every, single, year.
Even more so this year when you have a big aero and tyre change.

Disagree. They might bring small updates to melbourne but have you ever seen them bring a whole new FW without testing it first? That could be quite unpredictable no? Do you really think they will only turn the engines "right up" come melbourne and risking them to blow up there where they are already limited to 4 engines per year. Instead of doing extensive tests now when they can change them. They should even be turning the engines to modes which are not supposed to be raced all the time to test them in limit conditions

+1.

If the first time you try turning everything up to maximum attack is Q3 you are going to be pretty stuffed if it doesn't work. Also you would have no time to tune the setup of your car / PU for this condition.

I think what we actually see time and again is that the top times from testing are actually genuine "how fast will it go" times. I suspect that Massa's recent lap was Williams testing their ultimate pace.

[Mr.G]

Kimmi did 1:20.xx and he is still ~6km/h bellow the top speed they did in previous days...

[kasio]

ENGINE CHANGE confirmed at Red Bull Racing