2017 Red Bull Racing Team - Tag Heuer

[Just_a_fan]

If the new car comes in on the numbers, the latter half of the season could get very interesting. Three or four quick drivers in similar pace cars will make for some good races. And lots of on-radio moaning...

[SR71]

I admit to being hypnotized by the simplicity of the RB13 - I *wanted* to believe Newey had found a silver bullet and those ultra tidy surfaces and lack of complex detailing would lead to raw performance.

I find often enough that the simplest solutions are often the most complex to execute and probably more so on an F1 car and I hope Red Bull continue to evolve this ultra tidy package.

BUT...

This B-Spec story seems to be gaining life or maybe its just the desperate press looking for some clicks. If the B-spec story is true then showing up at testing with the RB13 as was and barely upgrading it through the first 3 races makes quite a bit of sense. All resources must be being poured into a new car.

I doubt a B-spec will be dramatically different but I can see them changing the wheelbase length significantly for instance. Also, the new Renault PU might have different cooling requirements and perhaps RB could repackage cooling higher up?

Anyways, this story is the kind of stuff I live for in F1, even more so than the on track stuff which has been great so far in 2017.

[shady]

I believed too, I am still of the mind that the suspension situation is being downplayed wrt this car. I think that the change was significant, and I think the B-Spec if it exists is a response to that. We saw the car popping up under braking load during the Barcelona tests we know they had it there, and we know they used it through different races last year. We also so both RIC and VER complaining about the rear of the car not having enough downforce, when if ever have we heard of a direct Newey car not having enough at the rear? I think the car was designed around a few interdependent concepts, and having a conventional (bell?) springs though they were off the mark through out both tests. This is all speculation.

[djos]

I believed too, I am still of the mind that the suspension situation is being downplayed wrt this car. I think that the change was significant, and I think the B-Spec if it exists is a response to that. We saw the car popping up under braking load during the Barcelona tests we know they had it there, and we know they used it through different races last year. We also so both RIC and VER complaining about the rear of the car not having enough downforce, when if ever have we heard of a direct Newey car not having enough at the rear? I think the car was designed around a few interdependent concepts, and having a conventional (bell?) springs though they were off the mark through out both tests. This is all speculation.

There are pics in the RB13 topic showing RedBull testing a monkey seat - that's pretty telling imo.

[shady]

Eh, they have run w and w.o for a few years now. I cant really pull much from that, a monkey seat isnt 1.3 seconds worth of DF in the corners. Its something but, I dont think its telling that they are trying to pile on rear DF. I would lean harder towards dialing in a balance between the front and rear (6.. half dozen)

[djos]

Eh, they have run w and w.o for a few years now. I cant really pull much from that, a monkey seat isnt 1.3 seconds worth of DF in the corners. Its something but, I dont think its telling that they are trying to pile on rear DF. I would lean harder towards dialing in a balance between the front and rear (6.. half dozen)

If Danny ric says they have a downforce deficit, a monkey seat is a quick bolt on fix while they improve the car.

[gandharva]

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/inte ... o-q-a.html

We have two problems: Renault had some reliability issues, which have slowed them down in the development; and we didn’t deliver the chassis that we should have done.

HM: Yes, the chassis will be ‘revamped’ in Barcelona and Renault is planning something for Montreal.

[digitalrurouni]

I didn't for one moment think the Red Bull was going to be competitive at the beginning of the season. My suspicions got confirmed during the pre-season test. It sucks. I really wanted RBR to be in the mix but I am hopeful they will be with their B-spec car. I honestly was expecting after the tests they would have a massive upgrade package in Australia and we could see what the car could really do. I also agree with a fellow poster who said clean and simple solutions are preferred but it seems in terms of aero it's not necessarily the best case. I also agree the suspension changes affected them a lot more than it did the Mercedes cars. They really went to the extreme of the rake angle and the suspension helping with that it seems and perhaps then a clean looking car like theirs would have worked. I still find their car very attractive but such is reality! Bring on the B-spec!

[Restomaniac]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

[marvin78]

That was the case 2 times. Whoever says, RedBull dominated 4 years in a row has not seen all 4 seasons. They developed hard and came back stronger than ever after the summer break.

[GPR-A duplicate2]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

2012. A year where EBD was banned and they could not get their new exhaust design right. They copied sauber design and improvised it. A year that McLaren started and ended with the fastest car, only to have screwed themselves with wrong development path mid-season, bad pit stops, strategies and bad reliability.

[FW17]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

2012. A year where EBD was banned and they could not get their new exhaust design right. They copied sauber design and improvised it. A year that McLaren started and ended with the fastest car, only to have screwed themselves with wrong development path mid-season, bad pit stops, strategies and bad reliability.

Did they copy sauber? I though the ramp solution was unique to Red Bull

[Juzh]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

2012. A year where EBD was banned and they could not get their new exhaust design right. They copied sauber design and improvised it. A year that McLaren started and ended with the fastest car, only to have screwed themselves with wrong development path mid-season, bad pit stops, strategies and bad reliability.

Mclaren started and ended with the fastest car, but f***ed themselves over in the mid part of the season.

[Juzh]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

2012. A year where EBD was banned and they could not get their new exhaust design right. They copied sauber design and improvised it. A year that McLaren started and ended with the fastest car, only to have screwed themselves with wrong development path mid-season, bad pit stops, strategies and bad reliability.

Did they copy sauber? I though the ramp solution was unique to Red Bull

It was copied from Sauber, who were also the only other team using this concept (the ramp style coanda).

[Restomaniac]

Wasn't there one of Vettels title seasons where the Red Bull was a bit off at the start. So much so that people thought the Red Bull bubble had burst? Only for by the end of the season it being the car to beat so much so that it still brought a WDC + WCC.

2012. A year where EBD was banned and they could not get their new exhaust design right. They copied sauber design and improvised it. A year that McLaren started and ended with the fastest car, only to have screwed themselves with wrong development path mid-season, bad pit stops, strategies and bad reliability.

Thanks. I couldn't remember the details.
I just remembered that Red Bull the then current WDC + WCC couldn't get the car to work. The point is that it proves that they CAN and have fixed their car mid season. Even though McLaren screwed themselves if Red Bull hadn't fixed it they wouldn't have been in a position to capitalise.