2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[marmer]

Mercedes engine has won every wdc and wcc since reg change even in a manor last season on occasion it was better than honda in a McLaren. Renault managed to retro fit an engine and be similar level to McLaren honda which was designed for its engine if they know they are switching for next season they will have no issues getting better performance. Good enough to win perhaps not but does anyone need reminding currently they are last in the wcc and pointless.

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk

[mrluke]

Full steam ahead into another "transition year"

[SameSame]

For all those people that say the integration will be difficult, remember when Torro Rosso made the extremely late switch to the Ferrari PU. They had a good chassis that year. I have a feeling the chassis will be even better due to Merc having better heat rejection and packaging. They can focus on those aspects more than Honda as Honda are still in the infancy of development.

[Vasconia]

For all those people that say the integration will be difficult, remember when Torro Rosso made the extremely late switch to the Ferrari PU. They had a good chassis that year. I have a feeling the chassis will be even better due to Merc having better heat rejection and packaging. They can focus on those aspects more than Honda as Honda are still in the infancy of development.

A even better example, Brawn and the Mercedes PU. When something is really good everything is easier.

[Vasconia]

Only option now.

Honda have cost McLaren and Fernando 3 years now and there is no sign of a turnaround.

And no, McLaren having a good chassis over those three years is not down to Honda money, the change was drawing Prodromou from Red Bull to head up aero direction.

You need money to develop a competitive chasis. Even Newey needs a legion of engineers and the most advanced technics to make it real.

[Vasconia]

This is teamwork. What Mclaren forgot..

.

HONDA: WE CONTINUE TO WORK AS ONE TEAM WITH MCLAREN

Amid reports that a split between McLaren and Honda is a done deal, the Japanese manufacturer are not commenting on what they term speculation and insist they are committed to overcome the problems together with the Woking based outfit.

When approached for comment by GP247, with regards to a split, a Honda spokesman said, “We do not comment on media speculation. We continue to work as one team with McLaren to overcome this tough situation together.”

He explained the problems, “One of the issues we are facing is with reliability. We have faced more reliability issues this season than we would have hoped, but we have reached the cause of all these issues and have countermeasures in place.”

“It is our intention to banish these on-going reliability issues completely as soon as possible so we focus on improving our performance.”

As for a solution to the woes, that most recently caused Fernando Alonso to retire while looking good for a top ten finish, the spokesman said, “We will not comment on any specific solutions.”

“We are continuing our development with the team and we believe we will conquer this situation. We have many resources dedicated to this, and we are 100% commitment to our Formula 1 project.”

Whatever the case there is no denying that patience has run thin among McLaren fans, sponsors and staff. Three years of no podiums and a woeful run this year, that has yet to yield a point, has done the image of Honda no favours.

“We appreciate all of the support the fans have been giving us, especially during this challenging situation,” acknowledged the team spokesman.

McLaren chiefs Zak Brown and Eric Boullier ramped up their criticism of their engine supplier before and after the race in Montreal, suggesting that a ‘divorce’ may well be in process.

But apparently, behind-the-scenes, the situation may not be as dire as it seems, the spokesman revealed, “We have good daily communication with McLaren, and we are committed to overcoming these problems together as one team, therefore we do not feel it is necessary to send them a message through the media.”

http://www.grandprix247.com/2017/06/14/ ... h-mclaren/

Yest, but team work means too to accept some advice and technical help from the other side, and it seems that Honda has problems to accept this.

[GhostF1]

This is teamwork. What Mclaren forgot..

.

HONDA: WE CONTINUE TO WORK AS ONE TEAM WITH MCLAREN

Amid reports that a split between McLaren and Honda is a done deal, the Japanese manufacturer are not commenting on what they term speculation and insist they are committed to overcome the problems together with the Woking based outfit.

When approached for comment by GP247, with regards to a split, a Honda spokesman said, “We do not comment on media speculation. We continue to work as one team with McLaren to overcome this tough situation together.”

He explained the problems, “One of the issues we are facing is with reliability. We have faced more reliability issues this season than we would have hoped, but we have reached the cause of all these issues and have countermeasures in place.”

“It is our intention to banish these on-going reliability issues completely as soon as possible so we focus on improving our performance.”

As for a solution to the woes, that most recently caused Fernando Alonso to retire while looking good for a top ten finish, the spokesman said, “We will not comment on any specific solutions.”

“We are continuing our development with the team and we believe we will conquer this situation. We have many resources dedicated to this, and we are 100% commitment to our Formula 1 project.”

Whatever the case there is no denying that patience has run thin among McLaren fans, sponsors and staff. Three years of no podiums and a woeful run this year, that has yet to yield a point, has done the image of Honda no favours.

“We appreciate all of the support the fans have been giving us, especially during this challenging situation,” acknowledged the team spokesman.

McLaren chiefs Zak Brown and Eric Boullier ramped up their criticism of their engine supplier before and after the race in Montreal, suggesting that a ‘divorce’ may well be in process.

But apparently, behind-the-scenes, the situation may not be as dire as it seems, the spokesman revealed, “We have good daily communication with McLaren, and we are committed to overcoming these problems together as one team, therefore we do not feel it is necessary to send them a message through the media.”

http://www.grandprix247.com/2017/06/14/ ... h-mclaren/

Yest, but team work means too to accept some advice and technical help from the other side, and it seems that Honda has problems to accept this.

This is a tired argument as well. Honda themselves, Hasegawa himself! Have said on multiple occasions they have no idea why people assume this is a truth. They have "outside Honda" help right now, they even did with Gilles Simon with previous engines. So can we put to bed the assumption they are steadfast refusing any assistance other than Japanese internal workers. It's nothing but presumptuous media chatter exemplified by others who believe that twaddle in the first place.

I can't comprehend why a Toro Rosso using a Ferrari unit as a late decision can be comparable to the rumours of McLaren attempting integration of a Merc PU, and even then, yes it was ok, but ok is not what anyone is aiming for.. None of these engines are the same and it's been noted several times the McLaren chassis is tight at the back, something they designed with Honda and their PU specifically around. So if there was to be a chassis that dislikes integration with a different unit, it'd be a McLaren.

[Vasconia]

This is a tired argument as well. Honda themselves, Hasegawa himself! Have said on multiple occasions they have no idea why people assume this is a truth. They have "outside Honda" help right now, they even did with Gilles Simon with previous engines. So can we put to bed the assumption they are steadfast refusing any assistance other than Japanese internal workers. It's nothing but presumptuous media chatter exemplified by others who believe that twaddle in the first place.

I can recall some comments coming from McLaren pointing out that Honda was quite reluctant to receive some technical assistance. But it could be media garbage.

[SameSame]

I can't comprehend why a Toro Rosso using a Ferrari unit as a late decision can be comparable to the rumours of McLaren attempting integration of a Merc PU, and even then, yes it was ok, but ok is not what anyone is aiming for.. None of these engines are the same and it's been noted several times the McLaren chassis is tight at the back, something they designed with Honda and their PU specifically around. So if there was to be a chassis that dislikes integration with a different unit, it'd be a McLaren.

Not much to comprehend really, quite a simple illustration that it's not doomsday to switch PUs late in the season.

And since when would Torro Rosso make an outstanding chassis with their budget? Yes James Key and his team are good, but they will never compete with the best chassis around especially as development goes on through the season.

I'm sure McLaren will sacrifice the so called 'size zero' (as if Merc doesn't have a slim rear) for an additional 100bhp that comes with the PU. Quite a no brainer.

[GhostF1]

I can't comprehend why a Toro Rosso using a Ferrari unit as a late decision can be comparable to the rumours of McLaren attempting integration of a Merc PU, and even then, yes it was ok, but ok is not what anyone is aiming for.. None of these engines are the same and it's been noted several times the McLaren chassis is tight at the back, something they designed with Honda and their PU specifically around. So if there was to be a chassis that dislikes integration with a different unit, it'd be a McLaren.

Not much to comprehend really, quite a simple illustration that it's not doomsday to switch PUs late in the season.

And since when would Torro Rosso make an outstanding chassis with their budget? Yes James Key and his team are good, but they will never compete with the best chassis around especially as development goes on through the season.

I'm sure McLaren will sacrifice the so called 'size zero' (as if Merc doesn't have a slim rear) for an additional 100bhp that comes with the PU. Quite a no brainer.

My point is this is all just as speculative as all the other nonsense. I didn't even remotely allude to the notion it'd be doomsday to change PU's, just that it could be a risky manoeuvre and not bring the "change" everyone is so eager to believe it would for next season, so as I said earlier, no matter which way you cut it, either choice (staying or changing) will have its risks.
I also didn't suggest the Merc didn't have a small rear but I can be pretty certain they aren't identical either. My main suggestion is that swapping PU's could essentially not bring this huge leap forward that everyone assumes. There's more to appreciate than just the power figure and reliability here right now (see previous posts).

[SameSame]

Forums would quiet places without speculation. I agree it's a risky move, and assessing those risks will be key to any potential change.

I hear what you are saying about it not all being about power and reliability, but it's pure speculation that the Honda PU is lighter and has a lower COG (if that's what you are referring to). I'm sure all front running cars are at the minimum weight. It's hard to imagine McLaren would be doing worse with a Merc PU.

On another note, it will be interesting to compare the differences in PU between cars if McLaren bring the updated PU (however large that may be) for Alonso and keep Vandoorne on the old spec in Baku.

[ronanharris09]

IMO Media have been successfully change the points of view of some people here =D> . .
I found myself that Japanese press is being a little more reliable at this time, neutrality is important . .
I do agree that switching to Merc PU will (at least) increase the possibility of finished in the top 5, but that won't be an effective solution for McLaren . . . IMO they should give Honda some bags of money to improve their dyno, instead of wasting their money to do the transition. .

[McL-H]

IMO Media have been successfully change the points of view of some people here =D> . .
I found myself that Japanese press is being a little more reliable at this time, neutrality is important . .
I do agree that switching to Merc PU will (at least) increase the possibility of finished in the top 5, but that won't be an effective solution for McLaren . . . IMO they should give Honda some bags of money to improve their dyno, instead of wasting their money to do the transition. .

Imo, Honda should throw some more money at McLaren for losing on sponsorship money and prize money due to Honda's incompetence.

Let's be honest. There is no indication whatsoever that Honda is able to make this engine formula a success. The other manufacturers are too far ahead. Honda could close in on them eventually (I may hope) but they will never compete with them directly. Surpassing Mercedes and Ferrari is out of the question. McLaren switching to Mercedes engines will not win them the championship for obvious reasons, but will make them competitive again. That is almost guaranteed. Sticking with Honda is a gamble. It's dream you have, like when you buy yourself a lottery ticket.

Therefore, I see no other viable option than to use a Mercedes PU from 2018 onwards. Meanwhile they should try to partner up with a European manufacturer, like Volkswagen, for 2021. Then they can fight for the championship again. It is the best option for McLaren.

[flynfrog]

Looks like Honda is out next season. Mac Merc is back?
http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/mclaren-p ... 1796116763

[mclaren111]

Only option now.

Honda have cost McLaren and Fernando 3 years now and there is no sign of a turnaround.

And no, McLaren having a good chassis over those three years is not down to Honda money, the change was drawing Prodromou from Red Bull to head up aero direction.

Agree.

And Matt Morris was brought in from Sauber and he is also very highly rated. They seem to work well together now.