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Thanks Snorked. I didn't stumble on that information. I wonder what they mean by 2nd phase. What time in the last three years was the 2nd phase? The 2nd year? Or was that the 2nd part of this past season?
I can’t read Japanese but perhaps the 2nd phase could be a bad translation of the 2nd time Honda entered into F1
Good point...I didn't think about that. You're probably right.
I think that RBR experience in working together with the Japanese Culture and Mentality is a big plus.
Tost, Hartley and Gasly have experience in working alongside Japanese Engineers.
And not the least, but most important, Jos Verstappen has surfaced in a more intensive role at RBR. He has hands on experience with a Honda F1 racing team.
Al in all it looks the pieces of the puzzle falling together or Honda to get this Program firmly on 'wheels'.
First of all with RBR/STR the Honda engine gets its milk back: Exxon Mobile.
The engine was developed alongside Exxon Mobile as liquid supplier...
McLaren making a last moment switch to another brand was not helping at all.
With the precarious balance of designing an engine, changing fuel suppliers was setting back Honda back to square one.
Second, Honda also gains access to RBR racing technology. Most important they get access to (the first and till now only) Full simulator connected to a full car test rig.
How important is that testbed? Ask Renault, they know it outperforms theirs....
RBR is also assisting with F1 specific expertise through a diversity of side doors towards Honda.
This close cooperation indicates a teaming up more intensive then visible to the outside.
To finish. As I understand from the Dutch Forum; Honda has been given 'free hand' to use STR as a live engine testbed in the first half year.
STR will take any penalty deemed necessary to help Honda forward. In the long run this is beneficial for both Honda and RBR.
The rumor is that/when Honda is able to develop the engine to be more reliable as the Renault, RBR can take the blunt move to incorporate the Honda Engine in the 2nd half of the 2018 season.
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he rumor is that/when Honda is able to develop the engine to be more reliable as the Renault, RBR can take the blunt move to incorporate the Honda Engine in the 2nd half of the 2018 season.
i love to see it but i dont think its allowed to change engine suppliers half way. where did u get this rumour?
The rumor is that/when Honda is able to develop the engine to be more reliable as the Renault, RBR can take the blunt move to incorporate the Honda Engine in the 2nd half of the 2018 season.
That would be an amazing mid-season twist. But banking on finishing the rest of your season with only one or two Honda engines would be quite a gamble (3 power units max next year). Having access to the Honda PU should keep Renault honest in terms of giving RB the same engine as their factory effort. Would look bad if RB switch to Honda in '19 or mid-'18 and become more competitive.
Last edited by roon on 15 Dec 2017, 01:41, edited 1 time in total.
Nobody's going to switch mid season. Red Bull are expecting to be fighting for the title next year so obviously a major change like that, if even allowed, would be a massive no-no for them. Unless Renault delivers their worse engine since 2014 with their 2018 effort which is highly unlikely and Honda do something they haven't done yet and completely nail everything and surpass Renault in 1 winter, again highly unlikely. it's just wishful thinking.
Getting into a position by summer where Honda can look a similar or better proposition than Renault for 2019 has to be the target. A tricky one itself but I don't think highly unlikely. But they'll need their best winter and in season development so far to do it, but fingers crossed.
Since when is the Renault Reliable? Did people not see all of those Renault PU failures throughout the 2017 season for Max, Daniel, Jolyon, Nico, Carlos, Dani and poor Hartley in his first 4 F1 races. While at the end of this season while still down on some power the Honda PU only had a single failure. Some people think the Honda will need more development to pass Renault but if Wazari's numbers were right the spec 4.0 was already close to the 2017 Renault and the 2018 is an even further evolution which should put it equal with the 2018 Renault. The first week of testing will be important as if the Renault is blowing up then look to Red Bull to get out of their contract and move to Honda in 2018.
As it was at this years testing... All eyes (media and scrutiny) will be on Honda, again. Hopefully we don't have to listen to Ted dribble smart-ass comments throughout and actually provide unbiased and not backhanded commentary. Give me facts, not your personal, snide opinion.
Did a patent search for Yasuaki Asaki. Most patents relate to: Variable cylinder management for V6's. Intake control for V6's (incl. variable volume intake). Combustion/knock control/detection.
For what reason. The whole of 2018 is a test session for STR. They don't need sponsorship as they have Red Bull and Honda money. Teams run light in pre season testing for one reason only and that is to get sponsorship.
I am talking about McLaren
I don't think Mclaren will run light even though they need sponsors. They better hope that the Renault isn't a hand grenade in 2018 or else it could be the end of Mclaren.
As I said I am sure about it. You may think different I understand. But I think this is what they will do. Especially at first test days they will try to look very fast. Maybe because of that they will brake somethings.
I don't think Mclaren will run light even though they need sponsors. They better hope that the Renault isn't a hand grenade in 2018 or else it could be the end of Mclaren.
As I said I am sure about it. You may think different I understand. But I think this is what they will do. Especially at first test days they will try to look very fast. Maybe because of that they will brake somethings.
you are sure or you think so? that's a big difference. and i do hope they'll do brake, or they'll definately break something.
But perhaps somebody can explain how Mclaren's pre season testing runs have anything to do with Honda knowing fully well they won't be running Honda engines ever again.
yes break other part is not that much important. We will see what will happen in near future.
Since when is the Renault Reliable? Did people not see all of those Renault PU failures throughout the 2017 season for Max, Daniel, Jolyon, Nico, Carlos, Dani and poor Hartley in his first 4 F1 races. While at the end of this season while still down on some power the Honda PU only had a single failure. Some people think the Honda will need more development to pass Renault but if Wazari's numbers were right the spec 4.0 was already close to the 2017 Renault and the 2018 is an even further evolution which should put it equal with the 2018 Renault. The first week of testing will be important as if the Renault is blowing up then look to Red Bull to get out of their contract and move to Honda in 2018.
This! It went under a lot of peoples noses that Honda out-devleoped Renault on their reliability! I know less horsepower means less wear and tear; but! Honda was looking rock solid at the tail end. If I remember correctly, they finally got like 4 race distances from one of their engines...
To clarify something
There were many problems with the Honda engine thread and the Mclaren Honda thread. (publications that do not correspond to the theme of the thread).
Then, as a temporary solution, the Mods created this thread to be able to debate without damaging other "technical" threads.
They grant us a special permission for Mclaren fans to debate with Honda fans (about the engine, the chassis, etc.). It's not what McLaren will do in Season Season, Renault reliability, etc. As he said @Thunder.
Comments that do not contribute to the discussion, or to the topic, I'm sure the Mods will eliminate it. That's why @ turbof1 asked us to control our emotions.
