Mercedes Power Unit Hardware & Software

[gruntguru]

Good point TC although I do recall some threads here where it was claimed that some but not all tracks allow sufficient braking energy recovery to exceed the per-lap limit set in the rules.

[Zynerji]

I believe that drivers should have full control of the power delivery and recovery settings.

In my view, allowing the computer to automatically change schema's for performance gain based upon track position is a driver aid.

Full control by the driver is not practical because of the complex energy transfers but the drivers do control the mode of the system by turning a switch. The mercedes has 7 modes and the Honda has at least 5. It is not clear how many Renault and Ferrari have yet. But yeah, basically the driver turns the mode switch to shift the balance of energy harvesting and deployment strategy. I think that's enough additional work for them in the cockpit. It would take away from racing if they had to control every single energy transfer IMO.

Are we against a parc ferme rule about software maps? Would probably condense the field in qualifying almost immediately.

[Juzh]

I believe that drivers should have full control of the power delivery and recovery settings.

In my view, allowing the computer to automatically change schema's for performance gain based upon track position is a driver aid.

Full control by the driver is not practical because of the complex energy transfers but the drivers do control the mode of the system by turning a switch. The mercedes has 7 modes and the Honda has at least 5. It is not clear how many Renault and Ferrari have yet. But yeah, basically the driver turns the mode switch to shift the balance of energy harvesting and deployment strategy. I think that's enough additional work for them in the cockpit. It would take away from racing if they had to control every single energy transfer IMO.

There's 16 settings on the STRAT rotary:


These ones are more or less confirmed:
start 1 - inlap/cooldown
strat 2 - Q2, Q3 only.
strat 3- ...? race settings
In 2014 when rosberg cut hamilton's wheel in spa, hamilton was advised strat postition 12 while he limped in the pits.

[PlatinumZealot]

I believe that drivers should have full control of the power delivery and recovery settings.

In my view, allowing the computer to automatically change schema's for performance gain based upon track position is a driver aid.

Full control by the driver is not practical because of the complex energy transfers but the drivers do control the mode of the system by turning a switch. The mercedes has 7 modes and the Honda has at least 5. It is not clear how many Renault and Ferrari have yet. But yeah, basically the driver turns the mode switch to shift the balance of energy harvesting and deployment strategy. I think that's enough additional work for them in the cockpit. It would take away from racing if they had to control every single energy transfer IMO.

There's 16 settings on the STRAT rotary:
http://wescrutinize.com/wp-content/uplo ... 721504.jpg

These ones are more or less confirmed:
start 1 - inlap/cooldown
strat 2 - Q2, Q3 only.
strat 3- ...? race settings
In 2014 when rosberg cut hamilton's wheel in spa, hamilton was advised strat postition 12 while he limped in the pits.

Yes. Some of the settings a re unused. of the race modes we know about seven. Strat seven is a " joker" mode that is changed to pretty much anything depending on what is planned for a particular race. Sometimes the teams are not told what it does and it is barred unyil permission is given. Williams thought it ended at strat 6 for Monza unyil they requested more power for Massa. They were then given instruction to turn to strat seven. Stronger than the setting they had for dry qualifying. (qualli was wet). They were pleasantly surprised the power they had! But it is a setting that changes race to race.

[Zynerji]

Full control by the driver is not practical because of the complex energy transfers but the drivers do control the mode of the system by turning a switch. The mercedes has 7 modes and the Honda has at least 5. It is not clear how many Renault and Ferrari have yet. But yeah, basically the driver turns the mode switch to shift the balance of energy harvesting and deployment strategy. I think that's enough additional work for them in the cockpit. It would take away from racing if they had to control every single energy transfer IMO.

There's 16 settings on the STRAT rotary:
http://wescrutinize.com/wp-content/uplo ... 721504.jpg

These ones are more or less confirmed:
start 1 - inlap/cooldown
strat 2 - Q2, Q3 only.
strat 3- ...? race settings
In 2014 when rosberg cut hamilton's wheel in spa, hamilton was advised strat postition 12 while he limped in the pits.

Yes. Some of the settings a re unused. of the race modes we know about seven. Strat seven is a " joker" mode that is changed to pretty much anything depending on what is planned for a particular race. Sometimes the teams are not told what it does and it is barred unyil permission is given. Williams thought it ended at strat 6 for Monza unyil they requested more power for Massa. They were then given instruction to turn to strat seven. Stronger than the setting they had for dry qualifying. (qualli was wet). They were pleasantly surprised the power they had! But it is a setting that changes race to race.

Proof that non- manufacturer teams are literally just making up the numbers, and selling advertising space.

How can they possibly compete like that? What if Massa was second to Lewis? Would he have gotten Strat7? I guess maybe, since Lewis may also have Strat8....

This is the part I hope they level for 2021.

[Maritimer]

There shouldn't even be modes. Hybrid should be set to engage/disengage at a set rpm range and that's it, you get your 160hp from x to y and outside that it's all engine.

[Just_a_fan]

Proof that non- manufacturer teams are literally just making up the numbers, and selling advertising space.

How can they possibly compete like that? What if Massa was second to Lewis? Would he have gotten Strat7? I guess maybe, since Lewis may also have Strat8....

This is the part I hope they level for 2021.

This is the difference between buying an engine for $5m each and spending $100s of million developing that engine. Mercedes (and Renault, Honda and Ferrari) should all benefit from being the engine supplier rather than customer. They risk the big bucks developing the technology. The rest just buy a commodity.

[Zynerji]

Proof that non- manufacturer teams are literally just making up the numbers, and selling advertising space.

How can they possibly compete like that? What if Massa was second to Lewis? Would he have gotten Strat7? I guess maybe, since Lewis may also have Strat8....

This is the part I hope they level for 2021.

This is the difference between buying an engine for $5m each and spending $100s of million developing that engine. Mercedes (and Renault, Honda and Ferrari) should all benefit from being the engine supplier rather than customer. They risk the big bucks developing the technology. The rest just buy a commodity.

So, you agree, and are comfortable with a 2 tier system? Those that build and sell crippled hardware, and those that have no choice but to pay for it?

That sounds terrible.

[Just_a_fan]

So, you agree, and are comfortable with a 2 tier system? Those that build and sell crippled hardware, and those that have no choice but to pay for it?

That sounds terrible.

The alternative is an FIA standard engine for all teams. One supplier, fixed price, identical units.

Or the teams that choose to buy "crippled hardware" could make their own, of course. Do Williams have $500m lying around somewhere to use?

[Zynerji]

So, you agree, and are comfortable with a 2 tier system? Those that build and sell crippled hardware, and those that have no choice but to pay for it?

That sounds terrible.

The alternative is an FIA standard engine for all teams. One supplier, fixed price, identical units.

Or the teams that choose to buy "crippled hardware" could make their own, of course. Do Williams have $500m lying around somewhere to use?

Or, include the software in the "identical spec" part of the engine rules...

I don't think that any team should have that level of direct control over another.

That's not competition, that's fake sport.

Now it makes perfect sense why Ron signed with Honda, since he knew Merc would never allow them to challenge the factory team during the race.

[OO7]

There shouldn't even be modes. Hybrid should be set to engage/disengage at a set rpm range and that's it, you get your 160hp from x to y and outside that it's all engine.

I agree integration/deployment should be far more simple.

[PlatinumZealot]

There shouldn't even be modes. Hybrid should be set to engage/disengage at a set rpm range and that's it, you get your 160hp from x to y and outside that it's all engine.

I agree integration/deployment should be far more simple.

Drivers are always wanting more tools at their disposal. So i think the current level is good. It is the fuel limits that's the problem. Give me 20,000 rpm and 160kg of fuel for the race and i will be giggling like a little school girl.

[dren]

So, you agree, and are comfortable with a 2 tier system? Those that build and sell crippled hardware, and those that have no choice but to pay for it?

That sounds terrible.

The alternative is an FIA standard engine for all teams. One supplier, fixed price, identical units.

Or the teams that choose to buy "crippled hardware" could make their own, of course. Do Williams have $500m lying around somewhere to use?

Or, include the software in the "identical spec" part of the engine rules...

I don't think that any team should have that level of direct control over another.

That's not competition, that's fake sport.

Now it makes perfect sense why Ron signed with Honda, since he knew Merc would never allow them to challenge the factory team during the race.

It is competition. Williams is buying a heavily subsidized (by Mercedes) PU for relative pennies instead of developing their own, which they are more than welcome to do. I think it's wrong to force a cost on the PUs for the smaller teams.

[dren]

'going back to something like the original KERS'

kinetic energy recovery means turning some of the loaded car's speed and only that into electrical and electrochemical energy
I look forward to the implementation of genuine KERS, and to its supervision by the stewards

the present ERSs and all the KERSs that ever scored a point largely tap fuel energy not kinetic energy
so they emulate a large and totally illegal fuel accumulator in effect to evade the fuel rate limits
over limit fuel rate use at lowish speeds would save more laptime than that lost at corresponding high speed fuel saving rate

ok such Rsystems also can save fuel by power diversion, improving ICE efficiency when partial powers are applied to the road

The regulations could state that MGUK generating can only take place during brake pedal actuation. You'd want some sort of clause that prohibits the use of both pedals together for extended periods of time to side skirt the rules.

[Juzh]

Full control by the driver is not practical because of the complex energy transfers but the drivers do control the mode of the system by turning a switch. The mercedes has 7 modes and the Honda has at least 5. It is not clear how many Renault and Ferrari have yet. But yeah, basically the driver turns the mode switch to shift the balance of energy harvesting and deployment strategy. I think that's enough additional work for them in the cockpit. It would take away from racing if they had to control every single energy transfer IMO.

There's 16 settings on the STRAT rotary:
http://wescrutinize.com/wp-content/uplo ... 721504.jpg

These ones are more or less confirmed:
start 1 - inlap/cooldown
strat 2 - Q2, Q3 only.
strat 3- ...? race settings
In 2014 when rosberg cut hamilton's wheel in spa, hamilton was advised strat postition 12 while he limped in the pits.

Yes. Some of the settings a re unused. of the race modes we know about seven. Strat seven is a " joker" mode that is changed to pretty much anything depending on what is planned for a particular race. Sometimes the teams are not told what it does and it is barred unyil permission is given. Williams thought it ended at strat 6 for Monza unyil they requested more power for Massa. They were then given instruction to turn to strat seven. Stronger than the setting they had for dry qualifying. (qualli was wet). They were pleasantly surprised the power they had! But it is a setting that changes race to race.

I think a similar scneario happened in 2015 spa gp with grosjean and lotus. He was told by engineer to go after Vettel and switch to strat 7.