Amazon Prime "Grand Prix Driver"

[NathanOlder]

2. EB said a month ago that the "merge" of the new Renault PU and chassis went smooth, and we saw in this that the actual merge actualy happens 2 or 3 days before the launch of the car, so that's a bit confusing to me?

I've not seen the documentary but I'm sure EB said the renault PU and chassis went smooth because he's talking about 2018, you know, the year they switched to Renault.

In this documentary it was all about 2017 and Honda PU's.

So 2 completely different years.

[GoranF1]

2. EB said a month ago that the "merge" of the new Renault PU and chassis went smooth, and we saw in this that the actual merge actualy happens 2 or 3 days before the launch of the car, so that's a bit confusing to me?

I've not seen the documentary but I'm sure EB said the renault PU and chassis went smooth because he's talking about 2018, you know, the year they switched to Renault.

In this documentary it was all about 2017 and Honda PU's.

So 2 completely different years.

So? What does this has to do whit my question. How is it possible that last year they merged the engine and the chassis 2 days before launch(and all others do this all the time including this year) and EB said 40 days ago that the merge of Renault and chassis went smooth? It't too soon for him to said it...he was liying.

[adrianjordan]

2. EB said a month ago that the "merge" of the new Renault PU and chassis went smooth, and we saw in this that the actual merge actualy happens 2 or 3 days before the launch of the car, so that's a bit confusing to me?

I've not seen the documentary but I'm sure EB said the renault PU and chassis went smooth because he's talking about 2018, you know, the year they switched to Renault.

In this documentary it was all about 2017 and Honda PU's.

So 2 completely different years.

So? What does this has to do whit my question. How is it possible that last year they merged the engine and the chassis 2 days before launch(and all others do this all the time including this year) and EB said 40 days ago that the merge of Renault and chassis went smooth? It't too soon for him to said it...he was liying.

Or....Renault provided a mockup of the PU to allow Mclaren to make sure it fits.

[the EDGE]

2. EB said a month ago that the "merge" of the new Renault PU and chassis went smooth, and we saw in this that the actual merge actualy happens 2 or 3 days before the launch of the car, so that's a bit confusing to me?

I've not seen the documentary but I'm sure EB said the renault PU and chassis went smooth because he's talking about 2018, you know, the year they switched to Renault.

In this documentary it was all about 2017 and Honda PU's.

So 2 completely different years.

So? What does this has to do whit my question. How is it possible that last year they merged the engine and the chassis 2 days before launch(and all others do this all the time including this year) and EB said 40 days ago that the merge of Renault and chassis went smooth? It't too soon for him to said it...he was liying.

What Eric said was that the intergration went well, he didn’t stipulate the actual car had been built. Whose ever engine they have, all parts are designed to fit way in advance of the actuall build

[McMika98]

The only likely scenario is that they bolted a conceptual gearbox onto the 17 renault engine like Toro rosso did with Honda. Maybe mated the parts in CAD. Aint no way the Renault engine bolts onto the mcl33 chassis, bad enough that the engine designed for the chassis did not fit properly. The new chassis maybe just about to be rolled out and the new engine hasnt been fired yet. Why would you waste production hours to test fit on 17 engine?

[Rodak]

I'd never really seen much of Stoffel before, comes across as a really nice guy. Will be good to see how he does in a (hopefully) much more competitive car this season.

As expected, the series isn't very technical, but that was not a surprise as it's aimed at a non-technical audience. The series IS titled 'Grand Prix Driver".

For me the most interesting part was seeing how a driver new to F1 is suddenly thrust into pr tasks he probably had no idea he'd be doing or experience doing them. I can understand why a young, immature driver might fail with all the stuff besides driving that's being thrown at him. Stoffel seemed to be handling it pretty well.

The lack of communication between the McLaren techs and the Japanese Honda guys was eye opening; I don't think the Honda guy had any idea about what he was being asked. Just nodded yes and agreed........ It should also be remembered that this series was started before the season got underway; it was initially to be about the drivers, but that soon changed with testing and a few ....... problems. Actually a pretty good segue to the Honda departure.

Edited to add: When I comment about lack of communication ("I don't think the Honda guy had any idea about what he was being asked") I meant and should have been clearer that I didn't think the Honda person understood English very well. Ignoring the discussion about who should learn whose language, it just seems smart to send Honda personnel to England who speak good English. I could be wrong about this, of course. Anyway, well worth watching.

[McHonda]

2. EB said a month ago that the "merge" of the new Renault PU and chassis went smooth, and we saw in this that the actual merge actualy happens 2 or 3 days before the launch of the car, so that's a bit confusing to me?

I've not seen the documentary but I'm sure EB said the renault PU and chassis went smooth because he's talking about 2018, you know, the year they switched to Renault.

In this documentary it was all about 2017 and Honda PU's.

So 2 completely different years.

So? What does this has to do whit my question. How is it possible that last year they merged the engine and the chassis 2 days before launch(and all others do this all the time including this year) and EB said 40 days ago that the merge of Renault and chassis went smooth? It't too soon for him to said it...he was liying.

McLaren engineers have been working in Viry too so they likely had a very good idea how it would integrate for a while.

But McLaren's Matt Morris believes experience is also a huge asset at Renault.

"I think the big difference, speaking with all the guys at Renault, is they have got more experience," said the outfit's chief engineering officer.

"Those guys on the ground have been doing it for a lot longer than Honda, that is just a fact, and that is what allowed us to get the packaging done so quickly.

“It is just their experience and the same is true in their factory at Viry. It is more mature than Honda. It might not have as many fancy dynos, but they just have more experience.

"We are over there at the moment doing some work on the dyno with them, and that has just been seamless."

http://en.f1i.com/news/291797-mclaren-t ... e-way.html

[Talisman]

I'm on episode two so far and I've found it fascinating.

Firstly its clear that 2017 was meant to be a completely new era not just from a performance point of view but as year 1 post-Ron. I don't think the programme showed how important this might be for the organisation beyond splitting his role into three though we get some clues. Ron WAS McLaren. The kind of acrimonious split that happened would have left internal political ruptures in the organisation. This was understandably hidden.

Secondly the livery seemed to be designed with little input from those whose job it is to weave a story around McLaren to use to sell to sponsors. Zac Brown who has responsibility for that job seemed to see the livery quite late in the process and is shown to point to a part of the car and say "that part can't be black". I had thought that there would be a little more coordination for something which contributes nothing to performance but is extremely important for team identity, especially since it was intended to set the Mcl33 apart from the MP4s that preceded it.

Thirdly its pretty clear that before the engine arrives the McLaren engineers have no clue whatsoever that the incoming engine might be a dud. That is probably the most damning bit because the Honda team would have known obviously that in terms of power the engine still fell short, although some of the bigger issues such as the vibrations weren't yet known about (they haven't fired up the engine up to the point I've seen). That they weren't told about the lack of performance beforehand is a serious failing on Honda's part.

Fourthly despite the supposed 'works' status there is little Honda representation at Woking which I doubt is the case for Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes. I understand that it is in McLaren's interests to keep Honda completely shut out of the chassis development process to ensure minimal information transfer to Japan but that approach has costs attached.

Fifthly despite Boullier's recent comments about switching to Renault allowing pitstop practices the programme shows the mechanics practicing again and again with a dummy car with very respectable times. Why then does McLaren have problems translating this into real world performance?

Very interesting so far and definitely recommended. Its a shame Liberty prevented filming continuing into the season.

[Talisman]

The lack of communication between the McLaren techs and the Japanese Honda guys was eye opening; I don't think the Honda guy had any idea about what he was being asked. Just nodded yes and agreed........ It should also be remembered that this series was started before the season got underway; it was initially to be about the drivers, but that soon changed with testing and a few ....... problems. Actually a pretty good segue to the Honda departure.

The Japanese guy who was being spoken to was clearly engaged in a conversation with other Japanese engineers and responded to the McLaren engineer once he got a reply from his own team, ignoring him until then. I thought he was merely being polite.

As for the form of English being used, I thought it was due to the linguistic issues arising from talking to people who don't have a strong grip of English.

Agreed though about the lack of integration between the two companies. However I think the gearbox not fitting has been overblown, the pins are the wrong shape but there isn't a fundamental problem with the mating itself. The new pins are designed and made overnight and the two units fit together. Also interestingly a bigger issue at that point is that the chassis simply isn't ready and they have to cancel a shakedown at Silverstone, thats an entirely McLaren problem.

I also agree with the poster above about being surprised by how late the chassis and PU are mated. All this talk about the Renault integrating perfectly with the chassis is clearly nonsense, I bet there isn't a Renault 2018 PU in the UK yet. But then again Boullier has shown himself to be full of BS. However it also raises the question, what data do they use for the PU in the simulator (SVD is shown to be in the simulator driving the 2017 car)? What data did Honda supply them?

[Talisman]

The use of English was simply terrible, how can you expect to work together if you're working with these zombies. I'm surprised that the relationship lasted three years. Hasegawa was assigned to be the leader of the project, come on how is that even possible. The guy clearly isn't a leader and looks nervous all the time (he probably already knew that they created a sh!t stain). Zak Brown said to him "big day today", he didn't even respond. McLaren should have run the Honda project.

I often have to communicate with very intelligent people who don't speak English well but are highly respected in their fields. The kind of simple English spoken by the McLaren engineers is exactly what I use to minimise miscommunication. Don't mistake the poor English with technical ability.

As for McLaren judging from the programme if they had developed the engine it would simply not have been built and delivered at all. The programme is hardly complementary about the team's organisation.

[McMika98]

The use of English was simply terrible, how can you expect to work together if you're working with these zombies. I'm surprised that the relationship lasted three years. Hasegawa was assigned to be the leader of the project, come on how is that even possible. The guy clearly isn't a leader and looks nervous all the time (he probably already knew that they created a sh!t stain). Zak Brown said to him "big day today", he didn't even respond. McLaren should have run the Honda project.

Dude id be ashamed to have Rondennis as username and label Zak B as some sort of leader. The guy is a salesman who failed miserably, was not only unable to find a title sponsor but lost more on his tenure (obviusly Hondas fault). I dont think he has leadership qualities, in fact all three directors have fraction of what Ron had in terms of leadership. Johnatan appears to be the guy managing the team so the other two fat cats arent pulling their weight. I was pleasantly surprised how Hasegawa defended Honda and had a positive attitude after a disastrous testing unlike the two so called leaders who tried best to please a fading star desperate to shine brightly in his twilight. To them the season was over preseason. So much for the #believe and all other bulls they keep coming up with.

[Redragon]

After seen the 4 episodes what it is most shoking is not to have a proper translator japanese english and english to japanese from both sides, specially after 2 years working together. All this thing of we are resolving our communication and cultural problems are bullshit. Then the speeck all the fault is Honda, Mclaren hit all targets is a bit --- excuse when you can see clear on documental that the car wasn't ready for testing when Alonso decides to stop because the car is not secure. I think is time for both side to admit their mistakes

[proteus]

Dude id be ashamed to have Rondennis as username and label Zak B as some sort of leader. The guy is a salesman who failed miserably, was not only unable to find a title sponsor but lost more on his tenure (obviusly Hondas fault). I dont think he has leadership qualities, in fact all three directors have fraction of what Ron had in terms of leadership. Johnatan appears to be the guy managing the team so the other two fat cats arent pulling their weight. I was pleasantly surprised how Hasegawa defended Honda and had a positive attitude after a disastrous testing unlike the two so called leaders who tried best to please a fading star desperate to shine brightly in his twilight. To them the season was over preseason. So much for the #believe and all other bulls they keep coming up with.

The season was over right from the start.

[McHonda]

Dude id be ashamed to have Rondennis as username and label Zak B as some sort of leader. The guy is a salesman who failed miserably, was not only unable to find a title sponsor but lost more on his tenure (obviusly Hondas fault). I dont think he has leadership qualities, in fact all three directors have fraction of what Ron had in terms of leadership. Johnatan appears to be the guy managing the team so the other two fat cats arent pulling their weight. I was pleasantly surprised how Hasegawa defended Honda and had a positive attitude after a disastrous testing unlike the two so called leaders who tried best to please a fading star desperate to shine brightly in his twilight. To them the season was over preseason. So much for the #believe and all other bulls they keep coming up with.

Who did Zak lose? CNN(Replaced by CNBC),Johnnie Walker(Already decided to leave),Michael Kors(Replaced by Kimoa),Santander(Left F1 altogether).

You can pin Star Sports Network on him at a stretch and obviously the Honda one(s) but he's also brought in Dell and Airgain so I'm not sure what you mean.

And he's brought those despite finishing 2nd last in the WCC last year and before the new McLaren-Renault car has touched tarmac to offer any sort of indicator of future competitiveness to put any would-be sponsors mind at rest.

The exposure that so-called fading star brings and the known performance benchmark he brings for the technical department is too valuable to lose if they want to remain a team seen as a top team in the paddock. Not just to those outside but arguably more importantly to those inside some of their own departments that may be thinking of moving on if they want to compete at the top.

[Chicane]

This series technically, may not be on a superlative level which is understandable as it dedicated to a wider f1 audience but it has been really well put together and incredible amount of access has been given. One thing is crystal clear that this partnership was doomed to fail with the amount of reliability issues Honda faced during preseason testing and if you couple that with the lack of power then Mclaren simply were left with no choice. Third year in to the partnership and it was staggering to hear a Mclaren mechanic say while preparing a chassis to send it to Sakura as to how all their aim for the the season was to avoid embarrassment.

People were so vitriolic against Alonso for being so outspoken about Honda but it is clear after watching the documentary that Stoffel too was bewildered, despondent and disappointed with the Honda power unit. Vibrations, oil pickup issues, poor drivability, engine braking issues and poor power output the list of issues were endless. Mclaren knew they were in trouble during preseason testing that they were in massive trouble as Zak has mentioned.

Mclaren have been candid enough to admit they were overrunning the schedules to get the car done in time but once the car got on track it was the Honda power unit which was responsible for the car spending more time in garage than on track. Honda have the knowledge and expertise but after watching the series i seriously got the season 1 vibes from them and not someone already in to the third year of a partnership. Honda cannot be written off as they will be out to prove that they can build a competitive power unit but there was no way Mclaren could go in to yet another season based on pure trust/hope as Neale says in the documentary. Honda turning it around would be great for the sport but will they actually manage to do so we will find out this season.