Team: Paddy Lowe (CTO), Rob Smedley (Head of Performance Engineering), Dirk De Beer (HA), Ed Wood (CD), Jakob Andreassen (HE), Steve Nielsen (SM), Claire Williams (DTP), Frank Williams (TP), Mike O'Driscoll (Group CEO), Luca Baldisseri (RE), James Urwin (RE), Andrew Murdoch (RE), Paul Williams (RE) Team name: Williams Martini Racing Drivers: Lance Stroll (18), Sergey Sirotkin (35), Robert Kubica (reserve)
A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
The small frontal area of FW41 sidepods is what is so diffirent to last year Ferrari car and Hass. Granted, Hass sidepods are a bit narrower at the top, but below the inlets, there is a big diffirence.
the difference is the radiator volume
the aero efficiency of mercedes radiators was already better
thats why if ferrari and nnew has improved williams cut everythin
of course now it s up to ferrari to compare ( but radiators are the limiits )
But, as far as I know the radiators are not part of the PU and Williams is making there own in house. So Williams made a big jump in radiator efficiancy this year it seems. But the outlet for hot air seems bigger than last year on a Williams. Am I right then to assume that last year they had bigger radiators with less airflow throu them (les hotter air at the back) and this year they have smaller radiators with more flow (more cooler air at the back)?
Take a look again at FW40 and see where and how radiators are positioned. Almost the same position as on FW41, and the same size. Bodywork is a lot tighter, and there is a significant difference in radiator intake shape (based on the outer shape od the sidepods). Internal aero work is probably where De Beer helped the team the most, something Ferrari have bee doing a few years now.
In fact, looking at FW40 now, it seems it has a nice undercut, but it was overshadowed (figuratively and literally) by chunky sidepods.
That FW41 looks good. But if the undercut is like that in real life, then it's massive. I can't believe they figured this out (as in cooling and placing parts) without any help from the silver star. Chances that Merc has the same solution is over 50% for me.
It's nice to seethat there are plenty of cool cooling solutions on the grid... Ferrari/Haas 'V' shaped rads + multiple winglets in the sidepods, Ferrari/Merc water intercooler near the engine, STR engine rads outside the sidepods etc.
@Vanja #66 and the others: do you think the F70 sidepod design helps the team decrease the radiator size inside?
Seems to me that, with the shape and size at which the shark fin is still allowed, this isn’t going to hurt rear wing performance too much. Given the wing is now relatively low, the fin still extends just as far at that height, so conceptually I don’t see it should be a much/at all different in terms of what they’re trying to do here.
What say you oh f1tech forum? There’s been much talk of McLaren only blocking the retention of full shark fin to block something clever RB were supposedly doing, but is the difference really enough?
(btw I realise this isn’t specific to the Williams but the above pics are the best examples we currently have)
@Vanja #66 and the others: do you think the F70 sidepod design helps the team decrease the radiator size inside?
I don't think so. Radiator size depends on how efficiently you can take away the heat from coolant (this is mostly dependent on radiator design) and how much heat you have to take care of in the first place. More efficient ICE will result in smaller radiator, of course. You can reduce the size of the radiator with a properly designed intake, but I believe this was mastered in F1 a long, long time ago. There can be subtle improvements with internal aero pieces in the intake, but it depends on those pieces, not the external design. There is a certain mass flow of (clean, non-turbulent) air you need to go trough the intake inlet, but it depends solely on radiator size, design and intake efficiency to slow the air down and maximize static pressure in front of the radiator core. External aero depends on the intake and radiator(s), not the other way around.
I'm calling this car the Dark Horse until testing proves otherwise. There simply is too much positive convergence lining up at Williams to completely dismiss the possibility.
Honestly, doesn't look too different to me compared to FW40, at least the contour of the side pod on the floor. Lighting is known to play tricks with us for years now, so I definitely want second opinion...
Vanja, this is how I see the difirent countor of the sidepod on the floor betwin FW41 and FW40. Of corse we need images of the real car to cofirm this, it is all speculation at this point.
Honestly, doesn't look too different to me compared to FW40, at least the contour of the side pod on the floor. Lighting is known to play tricks with us for years now, so I definitely want second opinion...
Check out the link to the 360 video on the ESPN website. It shows up pretty well there.
with all due respect, there's a whole bunch of lighting and blacked parts that hamper good judgement.
without any doubt there is gonna be influence from both mercedes and ferrari due to paddy lowe and ferrari's former employee there. stroll money has made things more possible so it's all but logical that there has to be an improvement.
but to be fair, it's not like the williams was doing so well last year. if it already was a contender for podiums last year on it's own merit, then this could bode well.
fact is, they were far from that, so they have a 'long way' to make up. and then this is 'just' the launch spec, non-real-life verison. we'll see at testing and melbourne what they come up with BUT overall; we haven't seen the top contenders.
all we have seen is a Haas, and this williams, and both look pretty similar in certain aspects, both are quite a 'copycat' of the 2017 Ferrari. And that was last year, we're in for 2018 now so i could be negative nancy and say they're both a year behind. at best judgement right now i'd say the haas and williams look like they could be competitive at eachother. but we'll have to await all other teams first, mostly, RedBull [tomorrow], Ferrari, Mercedes. and then there's Mclaren, Renault, etc.
so calling this a 'dark horse' is really being early. The Toro Rosso looked fast last year and expectations were high - it was far, far from that.
the only thing i'm more surprised with is how ugly the halo looks on the williams. massive and chunky. i'm curious to redbull tomorrow.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"
@Vanja #66 and the others: do you think the F70 sidepod design helps the team decrease the radiator size inside?
I don't think so. Radiator size depends on how efficiently you can take away the heat from coolant (this is mostly dependent on radiator design) and how much heat you have to take care of in the first place. More efficient ICE will result in smaller radiator, of course. You can reduce the size of the radiator with a properly designed intake, but I believe this was mastered in F1 a long, long time ago. There can be subtle improvements with internal aero pieces in the intake, but it depends on those pieces, not the external design. There is a certain mass flow of (clean, non-turbulent) air you need to go trough the intake inlet, but it depends solely on radiator size, design and intake efficiency to slow the air down and maximize static pressure in front of the radiator core. External aero depends on the intake and radiator(s), not the other way around.
According to my observations Ferrari’s V-shape radiator design since 2016 helps reduce the length of main part of the sidepod and thus leave a larger space for the coke-bottle undercut. Although the highly positioned sidepod intake massively increase the mass-flow under the undercut, the V-shape radiator doesn’t really allow them to have an undercut as deep as Williams do. You have to make your undercut bulky to contain the secondary radiator.
In terms of the radiator design between FW40 and FW41, the position is quite similar indeed, but there are still some important differences in detail. The FW40 has a shorter and bulkier radiator, which is completely off the undertray. However the radiator of FW41 is pulled all the way downto the undertray and has a narrower bottom. As a result the bodywork is kept slim despite a similar cooling area.
Comparison between sidepod shape of FW40 and FW41:
Lord. This must be the biggest undercut I've seen in a while. I mean, she looks like a bleached sewer rat but she sure looks fast!
