The car would roll to the side. The only way you would get a car to sit perched in the roll hoop and halo is if you got a crane and carefully placed it like that.NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 10:16If I look back to the beginning my original problem was a driver not getting out if it was upside-down in the gravel and this one has not been cleared yet people dismiss it as if they have seen someone climb out in the gravel. Then people were saying F1 cars never catch fire and havent caught fire through an accident since Berger at Imola, so I posted a video of Schumacher crashing and catching on fire just over 10 years ago but that didnt count for some reason.Restomaniac wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 08:37
Can I be honest? It seems to me to be continuing due to some still finding reasons to find fault (due to the ultimate problem of it's look) and when they are disproven another reason is found.
I know this is a million to 1 shot but, if a car is upside down, dug into the gravel and possibly on fire at stavelot what would happen ? I'd rather have been Henry Surtees than Roger Williamson every single day of the week .
Which is understandable but wrong. Look at Alonso after is Australia crash. He wiggled his way out of his car with a collapsed lung and broken ribs, highten the risk of additional trauma severely. He should have got penalty points for that.NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 10:29last year the driver crawls out (imagining how senna crawled out his car in Mexico that year)
This year they Halo traps the driver in the car.
Once a driver has been in a huge smash like that, asking him to control his self and stay in the car is insane. Human instinct would be, get the hell out as fast as you can.Jolle wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 11:13Which is understandable but wrong. Look at Alonso after is Australia crash. He wiggled his way out of his car with a collapsed lung and broken ribs, highten the risk of additional trauma severely. He should have got penalty points for that.NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 10:29last year the driver crawls out (imagining how senna crawled out his car in Mexico that year)
This year they Halo traps the driver in the car.
NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 10:29last year the driver crawls out (imagining how senna crawled out his car in Mexico that year)
This year they Halo traps the driver in the car.
The car would be higher because if the halo so it could have rolled over further. Also F1 cars look nothing like that now plus every still we see like that we can find plenty that show how lucky those drivers were in other aspects at that time .NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 12:08@restomaniac what are you on about ? I know the car would roll to the side , of course the car would roll to the side, thats exactly what im talking about, as i mentioned earlier in the reference to Senna
NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 10:29last year the driver crawls out (imagining how senna crawled out his car in Mexico that year)
This year they Halo traps the driver in the car.
Senna would NOT have got out that car if he had a Halo. So a Halo CAN trap you in the car, yet guys like Jolle will not accept this, and here we are weeks later still talking about it.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/iwWUgdINNgU/hqdefault.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/OzP6nFYdXkE/maxresdefault.jpg
The video the FIA show of someone crawling out with a Halo is flawed,
1 - it had no wheels, if a car still has suspension and wheels attatched it would hold the car so there would be less room to escape.
2 - It was on a hard floor, which is fine if you roll on a tarmac run off. If you roll on gravel or on grass, the roll hoop can dig in and you have less room to escape.
It's less ugly than other parts of the car so in the grand scheme of things it's not even currently at the top of that list.AJI wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 12:27The safety aspects of the Halo can be argued forever from many different perspectives, and apparently, as the human population of the planet earth is the most precious thing of all and critically low at a mere 7billion, we need to do everything we can to save every life... I get that, we're awesome, but my question is; why does the Halo have to be so goddamed ugly?
The Halo would just dig into the gravel as well. Its not like a closed canopy. And yes the cars are not like they were back then, They have more protection around the drivers head making it even harder to get out of the cars.Restomaniac wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 13:04The car would be higher because if the halo so it could have rolled over further. Also F1 cars look nothing like that now plus every still we see like that we can find plenty that show how lucky those drivers were in other aspects at that time
definitely the cars of the 80's/90's looked better, but I think everyone on the planet will say the Halo looks bad or ugly.Restomaniac wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 13:29It's less ugly than other parts of the car so in the grand scheme of things it's not even currently at the top of that list.AJI wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 12:27The safety aspects of the Halo can be argued forever from many different perspectives, and apparently, as the human population of the planet earth is the most precious thing of all and critically low at a mere 7billion, we need to do everything we can to save every life... I get that, we're awesome, but my question is; why does the Halo have to be so goddamed ugly?
This is what I don't understand. The current cars are messy as hell. Yet people are fixated with something less ugly than parts of the rest of the car.
If the current F1 cars had the clean lines of the cars from the 80's/90's I would get it but they don't.
It could have hindered Senna indeed. But, with the current understanding of safety, it's safer to stay in the car until the safety crew gets you out. What if he had dislocated his neck or spine in the crash? I know you go back to the "driver wants to get out as fast as possible", but that is not the safest way.NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 14:28The Halo would just dig into the gravel as well. Its not like a closed canopy. And yes the cars are not like they were back then, They have more protection around the drivers head making it even harder to get out of the cars.Restomaniac wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 13:04The car would be higher because if the halo so it could have rolled over further. Also F1 cars look nothing like that now plus every still we see like that we can find plenty that show how lucky those drivers were in other aspects at that time
How can anyone say the Halo wouldn't have hindered Senna's exit from that car in the pictures above! its insane!
Also all of the accidents you mentioned, how many would the Halo have helped ? I'll help you out, it starts with a 0.
I was just injecting a little levity in to an otherwise dull and cyclical argument about the halo.
well.. not if your house is on fire. Health and safety 101 is getting yourself removed from the hazardous situation first. If anything blocks that, its unsafe. Ok, not here to start a debate on fire dangers in modern f1, but this argument is (again) not correct.Jolle wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 14:33It could have hindered Senna indeed. But, with the current understanding of safety, it's safer to stay in the car until the safety crew gets you out. What if he had dislocated his neck or spine in the crash? I know you go back to the "driver wants to get out as fast as possible", but that is not the safest way.NathanOlder wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 14:28The Halo would just dig into the gravel as well. Its not like a closed canopy. And yes the cars are not like they were back then, They have more protection around the drivers head making it even harder to get out of the cars.Restomaniac wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 13:04The car would be higher because if the halo so it could have rolled over further. Also F1 cars look nothing like that now plus every still we see like that we can find plenty that show how lucky those drivers were in other aspects at that time
How can anyone say the Halo wouldn't have hindered Senna's exit from that car in the pictures above! its insane!
Also all of the accidents you mentioned, how many would the Halo have helped ? I'll help you out, it starts with a 0.
Even in the most simple first aid course, book, whatever: don't move!!! wait for professionals.