French GP 2008

[Scuderia Nuvolari]

"I'm a big Mclaren fan, but I am starting to doubt they can win this season's championship"


Maybe they should use more prudence on who they hire.

[The FOZ]

Hamilton's penalty was completely deserved.

Yes, he was past Vettel when he left the track, but it was the action of passing which led to him leaving the track. Had he stayed back on that turn, there's no way he would have left the track. Instead, he ran his line too deep, and the resulting line ran him into the grass. Fortune was with him, because he got back onto the track right away and could continue. But there is no question, had this happened at another point in the course, he might well have hit a wall or spun out in the grass. Or, had he stayed on the track, he most likely would have nosed into Vettel or had to brake early, either way resulting in him getting passed again.

So he didn't pass cleanly by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, here's the thing.

Hamilton's car is much faster than Vettel's. If he was smart, he would have allowed Vettel to pass him right after the incident, and then tried again next lap. Instead, he tried to get away with it.

If McLaren were REALLY paranoid that the FIA were "out to get them", wouldn't it be prudent to keep their noses extra clean and avoid any judgement calls on the part of the stewards altogether? That's what my sensibility tells me, anyhow.

[timbo]

LH has a great potential but all the media hype prevents him from seeing his weaknesses and improve.

You really have an amazing grasp of the inner workings of Formula One. Do you think Lewis' on track actions are decided by what he reads in The Sun because I don't?!

I don't think the Sun has anything to do with it. It's the constant ass kissing of F1 media the world over that's doing it. How can you compare a rookie that got a really good start to his career, a few wins and almost won a championship but choked massively at the end, to a man that many consider to be the greatest of all time and 3 time world champion at that?!?! You can't. Not in a million years. THAT's what I think Timbo is trying to get at. Everyone puts him on a pedestal where he's untouchable, and it seems to have permeated his attitude to the point where he thinks rules like red lights are silly and there is no way anyone could see them. That's all I have to say about Hammy, other than he done pretty damn good for starting so far back. Good to see that he can at least not freak out and crash.

Yes, that's what I'm trying to say, thanks!
What I see is LH has made many similar mistakes, well maybe there is attractive naiveness in his moves for someone but we're talking F1! And what McLaren and press say about them:
China - Macca says: "we've chosen wrong strategy, he lost his tyres"
Brazil - Macca: "He didn't press the wrong button!"
Bahrein - press: "Evil Alonso braketested him!"
Montreal - Macca: "It was our mistake not Lewis'"
and so on...
In the latest interview Lewis contradicts himself by first saying he saved a line for Vettel (what a generosity!) and later saying that he lost his rear.

[timbo]

double post.. sorry

[nae]

If he was smart, he would have allowed Vettel to pass him right after the incident, and then tried again next lap.

that i do agree with, it even looked , for a small moment, that is what he was going to do in the 180 hairpin but he didnt.

i do so wish there was a better view of the incident.

[andartop]

Hamilton's penalty was completely deserved.

Yes, he was past Vettel when he left the track, but it was the action of passing which led to him leaving the track. Had he stayed back on that turn, there's no way he would have left the track. Instead, he ran his line too deep, and the resulting line ran him into the grass. Fortune was with him, because he got back onto the track right away and could continue. But there is no question, had this happened at another point in the course, he might well have hit a wall or spun out in the grass. Or, had he stayed on the track, he most likely would have nosed into Vettel or had to brake early, either way resulting in him getting passed again.

So he didn't pass cleanly by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, here's the thing.

Hamilton's car is much faster than Vettel's. If he was smart, he would have allowed Vettel to pass him right after the incident, and then tried again next lap. Instead, he tried to get away with it.

If McLaren were REALLY paranoid that the FIA were "out to get them", wouldn't it be prudent to keep their noses extra clean and avoid any judgement calls on the part of the stewards altogether? That's what my sensibility tells me, anyhow.

If the FIA were indeed "out to get them", then McLaren would not have even been allowed to participate in the 08 Championship after what happened last year... They should just stop moaning and giving lame excuses for Lewis' mistakes and focus on the racing like everybody else.

[sharkie17]

Hamilton's penalty was completely deserved.

Yes, he was past Vettel when he left the track, but it was the action of passing which led to him leaving the track. Had he stayed back on that turn, there's no way he would have left the track. Instead, he ran his line too deep, and the resulting line ran him into the grass. Fortune was with him, because he got back onto the track right away and could continue. But there is no question, had this happened at another point in the course, he might well have hit a wall or spun out in the grass. Or, had he stayed on the track, he most likely would have nosed into Vettel or had to brake early, either way resulting in him getting passed again.

So he didn't pass cleanly by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, here's the thing.

Hamilton's car is much faster than Vettel's. If he was smart, he would have allowed Vettel to pass him right after the incident, and then tried again next lap. Instead, he tried to get away with it.

If McLaren were REALLY paranoid that the FIA were "out to get them", wouldn't it be prudent to keep their noses extra clean and avoid any judgement calls on the part of the stewards altogether? That's what my sensibility tells me, anyhow.

If the FIA were indeed "out to get them", then McLaren would not have even been allowed to participate in the 08 Championship after what happened last year... They should just stop moaning and giving lame excuses for Lewis' mistakes and focus on the racing like everybody else.

I agree.

I just dont like LHs attitude.

Quote:

"There's nothing you can do that can distract me.
You can keep on giving me penalties and whatever you want to do and I'll keep battling and try and come back with a result,"

The thing is, they are not giving him penalties to "distract" him... they are giving him penalties because hes making mistakes!

[Spencifer_Murphy]

I quite like Lewis' attitude actually sharkie, (not with regards to the penalties) but I saw an Interview with him on ITV's coverage where he was talking about the media slating him after the Montreal incident, he basically said "That's what they [the media] do, they build you up, then they break you down when you make a mistake. But try as they will they won't distract me or break me, I'm going to keep trying to deliver results".

Frankly I'm happy that a british sports person has publically said such this about our press. Our press here are disgusting. You know you've made it big here when the press use you to sell a story. Take lewis as an example, last year "The great lewis vs. that whiny sod Alonso" (I didn't like they way they treated Alonso in the press here tbh) but as soon as Lewis cocks it up "Bumbling fool crashes in the pits" - there was no need for that. Take David Beckham, Songs about "Goldenballs" but when he misses a Penalty in Euro 2004 "What's that comming over the hill, its Beckham's spot kick...it's beckham's sport kick." You just cannot please the press here. I reckon if the media here actually decided to GET BEHIND our sports men & women the UK as a whole might actually be GOOD at something!

Beack to the race, I'm delighted for Toyota & Jarno Trulli...the results seems just so fitting after the loss of Ove Andersson. And its nice to see Jarno pulling a result out of the hat, he appears to be a decent guy, and I don't know of many people that would begrudge him victory.

Lewis' penalty I think was deserved, you could argue it was harsh (on another day he might have gotten away with it) but I don't think there are any grounds to suggest the stewards were wrong to give him the penalty. The smart thing to do would have been to let vettel pasts and have a go again, I mean it was what, the 1st or 2nd lap? the field was still pretty bunched up at that point. It would have done negligable damage to his race by letting vettel past. Speaking of this though, on the ITV coverage James Allen was saying usually a guy from Mclaren (can't remember the name) would in that situation get on the radio to Charlie Whiting and say "Should we give the place back" its clear this didn't happen and I image that that's because they saw no need to ask Charlie as they viewed it as a legitimate pass. If that is the case, they need their heads examined!

I feel sorry for Kimi, he's beggining to get Rubens' syndrome (i.e ALL Ferrari problems will occur on HIS car...not his team-mates) lol. But I think Kimi's cool enough not to let things like that bother him too much...he's had plenty of preparation for that when he drove for Mclaren!

Finally I'm chuffed for Nelshino, hopefully this sort of result (and lest we forget he beat Fernando) should bouy him, and that coupled with a Silverstone circuit that he says is one of his favourites we might see a second-half-of-the-season resurection...like we did with Heikki last year. I hope so, for his sake, and tbh, I quite like the guy.

[Belatti]

Frankly I'm happy that a british sports person has publically said such this about our press. Our press here are disgusting. You know you've made it big here when the press use you to sell a story.

"La culpa no es del chancho, es del que le da de comer"

I´ll try to translate this popular said:

"The pig is not guilty, but the one who feeds him"

The press is the Pig. Society feeds them.

[WhiteBlue]

So did the whole, or part, of the header come off or was it just the bodywork? I followed the race on F1Live because, sadly, they don't aloow TVs at work for us to lounge and watch racing on.

In this picture you can see the end pipe of the V8 engine. This what came off below the sensors. I doubt that the whole thing weights more than 300 grams.

[Conceptual]

So did the whole, or part, of the header come off or was it just the bodywork? I followed the race on F1Live because, sadly, they don't aloow TVs at work for us to lounge and watch racing on.

In this picture you can see the end pipe of the V8 engine. This what came off below the sensors. I doubt that the whole thing weights more than 300 grams.

I dunno. The sensor and wire, plus that piece of pipe (especially if it had welding on it) could easily weigh 300g.

Props to that wire manufacturer as well, because it may have saved a life!

Chris

[nae]

i am no maths guru
but surely F=MA

f= 300g x 320 kmh

pretty heavy to hit you in the head i would guess


I dont actually know if thats even the right equation and fully expect some of you educated chaps to tell me the various forces that this part could have from the slowest speed on the track to the highest

ty ty

[The FOZ]

Force equals Mass times acceleration, you are correct.

However, acceleration is measured in distance/second^2.

So to accurately gauge the impact force, you'd have to determine the rate at which the part would decelerate from it's free flying speed.

At any rate, the kinetic energy the part would have had whilst flying through the air would have been significant, particularly if, say, you were another car, or driver.

i am no maths guru
but surely F=MA

f= 300g x 320 kmh

pretty heavy to hit you in the head i would guess


I dont actually know if thats even the right equation and fully expect some of you educated chaps to tell me the various forces that this part could have from the slowest speed on the track to the highest

ty ty

[ss.vamsikrishna]

Actually this is how it should be calculated in terms of momentum
so rate of change in momentum is the nett force exerted by this body
M = mass * velocity
so the body has already 320km/h velocity * 300 gms
and when it hits other body say it rebounces with 160 kms/h in 1 second
then nett force exerted is
F = (mv1- mv2)/t
M = 300 gms ( 320 - (-160))/1 second (as they are all vectors sign should be considered.so a negative sign.
please convert in to Metric units you will get force in Newtons (N)
Hope this helps...

[checkered]

F1 exhausts, as far

as I know, are manufactured from 1 to 1,5 mm thick Inconel which is pretty fancy stuff (think rocket science). Look it up and you could get pretty close to guesstimating the weight, dynamics and the effect of the modulus of elasticity of the object at different angles of impact to a helmet, for example. It certainly seemed to have some momentum, observing the velocity and trajectory it was on. Not a very common occurrence to consider though. As a matter of Kimi's famed "luck", more evidence after the manner of his winning the Championship that it has evolved beyond "good" or "bad" - it just is.