Ferrari Power Unit Hardware & Software

[apexcontrol]

There no 4Mj max per lap saviour stivala. Plz go look and see the difference between KW and KWh

There is no 33 sec limit and there is no Mj limit h to k.

120kw is not the limit how long you may generate 161bhp. Its the max limit of horsepower given at any time to the crank.


H generates as much KWh/Mj as you can do no limit. The k uses KWh/Mj from the H as much as it likes no limit. But the K may not make more the 120KW at once

KW and KWh are not the same
A electro motor uses KWh and generates KW

The limit of deployment of in terms of time is unlimited...you only need the Mj for it ...and h can make and send as much as you can


The k uses Mj/KWh and gives in return KW/BHP to crank

[munudeges]

The biggest clue is in the sound of the Ferrari engine onboard.

[subcritical71]

The biggest clue is in the sound of the Ferrari engine onboard.

The whine of the MGU-K seems more pronounced, and active for much longer than the others. Here’s hoping they’ve figured out 100% MGU-K deployment (when full throttle of course).

[roon]

Between 17 and 18 s in the linked vid, a distinct rising 'whirp' sound is made. It is audible on other low speed corners. It is distinct from geartrain whine and engine exhaust sounds. It is constant across gear changes. Edit: thought it was the turbocharger, probably just gear noise.

The biggest clue is in the sound of the Ferrari engine onboard.

The whine of the MGU-K seems more pronounced, and active for much longer than the others. Here’s hoping they’ve figured out 100% MGU-K deployment (when full throttle of course).

Which sounds do you interpret as the MGU-K?

[subcritical71]

Between 17 and 18 s in the linked vid, a distinct rising 'whirp' sound is made. It is audible on other low speed corners. It is distinct from geartrain whine and engine exhaust sounds. It is constant across gear changes. I'm guessing this is the compressor/turbine increasing in angular velocity. Could be the final drive gears being particularly loud passing through a certain frequency range, I suppose.

https://youtu.be/Bs_LIBPTAdg

The biggest clue is in the sound of the Ferrari engine onboard.

The whine of the MGU-K seems more pronounced, and active for much longer than the others. Here’s hoping they’ve figured out 100% MGU-K deployment (when full throttle of course).

Which sounds do you interpret as the MGU-K?

Basically anytime he’s under full throttle. I would think the turbo would be spooled to its qualy rpm and stays there. It could be gearbox whine, but doesn’t seem to me to be gearing as it’s too high pitched. And the K would also follow the speed changes during the shifts which the whine seems to follow. But dunno, this is all a guess as somehow Ferrari are doing something no one else has figured out yet.

[roon]

edit: think it's just the final drive gear sound.

[godlameroso]

Some people on here seems to not being able to understand the difference in design and scope between a normal run of the mill/off the shelve turbocharger as used on a road going engine and that of the formula one turbocharger design and scope of use. The normal turbocharger as found on a road going engine have the waste gate build-in into the scroll housing and when it opens is meant relieve the exhaust gasses pressure and so the exhaust gasses energy by bypassing a controlled amount to the scroll exhaust outlet. The turbocharger as used in formula one is totally different in scope and design, the waste gates are not part of or build into the exhaust scroll, they are separate, they are situated at the end of each of the exhaust manifold and before the exhaust scroll, when open they are meant to bypass exhaust gasses away from the scroll and directly into each of their own dedicated and separate exhaust pipes.

You act like none of us know that external wastegates are a thing, even run of the mill turbo kits on Honda Civics work better with external wastegates. I've sent enough down the track to know papi.

[cheeRS]

Between 17 and 18 s in the linked vid, a distinct rising 'whirp' sound is made. It is audible on other low speed corners. It is distinct from geartrain whine and engine exhaust sounds. It is constant across gear changes. I'm guessing this is the compressor/turbine increasing in angular velocity. Could be the final drive gears being particularly loud passing through a certain frequency range, I suppose.

https://youtu.be/Bs_LIBPTAdg

The biggest clue is in the sound of the Ferrari engine onboard.

The whine of the MGU-K seems more pronounced, and active for much longer than the others. Here’s hoping they’ve figured out 100% MGU-K deployment (when full throttle of course).

Which sounds do you interpret as the MGU-K?

IMO, that whine/high pitched "warp drive" sound is just the MGU_K being deployed. It would make sense to use it out of the low speed corners more than any other time, due to the instant torque and fixed gearing of the motor. For instance, both the Porsche 918 (road car) and Porsche 919 LMP1 car deploy their motors at lower speeds, and cut them off completely at higher speeds. They sound quite similar to the Ferrari...



Listen starting around 21 seconds in when the 919 exits La Source.

[saviour stivala]

Some people on here seems to not being able to understand the difference in design and scope between a normal run of the mill/off the shelve turbocharger as used on a road going engine and that of the formula one turbocharger design and scope of use. The normal turbocharger as found on a road going engine have the waste gate build-in into the scroll housing and when it opens is meant relieve the exhaust gasses pressure and so the exhaust gasses energy by bypassing a controlled amount to the scroll exhaust outlet. The turbocharger as used in formula one is totally different in scope and design, the waste gates are not part of or build into the exhaust scroll, they are separate, they are situated at the end of each of the exhaust manifold and before the exhaust scroll, when open they are meant to bypass exhaust gasses away from the scroll and directly into each of their own dedicated and separate exhaust pipes.

You act like none of us know that external wastegates are a thing, even run of the mill turbo kits on Honda Civics work better with external wastegates. I've sent enough down the track to know papi.

You still don’t understand or cannot differentiate or your ego want let you, between the design working scope of a normal road going turbocharger waste gate and that of a formula one.

[saviour stivala]

Funnily enough my copy of prof Limebeer’s paper doesn’t refer to free load mode. Can you point me at a copy that does please?

Profs Limebeer and his research team were the poeople that first termed the electric supercharging with waste gates fully open "free load mode" i will try later on and trace the orriginal papaer/report and post the link.

Thanks. That will be helpful.

Linebeer first research paper november 2013. at around the same time, a presentaion of work at matlab (vidio). secoond paper (faster, higher and greener) adition futuring SPA published april 2015. all this can be downloaded for free, papers in PDF. by visiting "McCabism: optimal control theory and FERRARI'S turbo-electric hybrid" and follow instructions as were to click to download, the McCabism report is initself a must read to fully understand what and how things undolded.

[LM10]

Does anyone know if the twin-battery arrangement of Ferrari has been a known fact for years now or was it revealed after FIA's investigations? In one of the videos of Scarbs where he describes the twin-battery they told that thank to the investigations now they know that Ferrari is using that battery and has been using it since 2014. That's why I'm asking.

If yes, why was Ferrari OK with it being revealed?

Yea, after doing a little bit of research I’ve the feeling that prior to investigations this year it was not known that Ferrari has been using this battery system.

Why is it even being revealed/being made public? Who knows which further, possibly important informations came to light this way. If investigations lead to such information leakage, then just let the FIA investigate every aspect of the cars.

[saviour stivala]

Does anyone know if the twin-battery arrangement of Ferrari has been a known fact for years now or was it revealed after FIA's investigations? In one of the videos of Scarbs where he describes the twin-battery they told that thank to the investigations now they know that Ferrari is using that battery and has been using it since 2014. That's why I'm asking.

If yes, why was Ferrari OK with it being revealed?

Yea, after doing a little bit of research I’ve the feeling that prior to investigations this year it was not known that Ferrari has been using this battery system.

Why is it even being revealed/being made public? Who knows which further, possibly important informations came to light this way. If investigations lead to such information leakage, then just let the FIA investigate every aspect of the cars.

There is no doubt the FIA is in control of every aspect of the F1 car as regards the car being in compliance with regulations, and that includes the so called twin battery system, this leads one to believe that this here push for the FIA to investigate every aspect of the car, presumably that of FERRARI, the cheat speculators although convinced that FERRARI must be cheating, are this time totally at a loss as to were and how FERRARI are cheating, if this wasn't the case there is no doubt that they would already had fired all their guns from the hip.

[giantfan10]

Does anyone know if the twin-battery arrangement of Ferrari has been a known fact for years now or was it revealed after FIA's investigations? In one of the videos of Scarbs where he describes the twin-battery they told that thank to the investigations now they know that Ferrari is using that battery and has been using it since 2014. That's why I'm asking.

If yes, why was Ferrari OK with it being revealed?

Yea, after doing a little bit of research I’ve the feeling that prior to investigations this year it was not known that Ferrari has been using this battery system.

Why is it even being revealed/being made public? Who knows which further, possibly important informations came to light this way. If investigations lead to such information leakage, then just let the FIA investigate every aspect of the cars.

Not thanks to the investigation... you should thank James Allen and the other ferrari member that switched to Mercedes...they obviously knew...Mercedes went to the FIA or rather through Amus to the FIA knowing the answer to the question they were asking...they were trying to get whatever ferrari was doing banned and failed at it...

[LM10]

Does anyone know if the twin-battery arrangement of Ferrari has been a known fact for years now or was it revealed after FIA's investigations? In one of the videos of Scarbs where he describes the twin-battery they told that thank to the investigations now they know that Ferrari is using that battery and has been using it since 2014. That's why I'm asking.

If yes, why was Ferrari OK with it being revealed?

Yea, after doing a little bit of research I’ve the feeling that prior to investigations this year it was not known that Ferrari has been using this battery system.

Why is it even being revealed/being made public? Who knows which further, possibly important informations came to light this way. If investigations lead to such information leakage, then just let the FIA investigate every aspect of the cars.

There is no doubt the FIA is in control of every aspect of the F1 car as regards the car being in compliance with regulations, and that includes the so called twin battery system, this leads one to believe that this here push for the FIA to investigate every aspect of the car, presumably that of FERRARI, the cheat speculators although convinced that FERRARI must be cheating, are this time totally at a loss as to were and how FERRARI are cheating, if this wasn't the case there is no doubt that they would already had fired all their guns from the hip.

It's the job of the FIA to make sure that everything going on on the car is legal. But I don't understand why the whole world needs to know such things afterwards. F1 engineers are very intelligent people. They will take every detail with deep greatfulness. Then it's just a matter of time for them sooner or later to figure out what the opponents are doing.

[henry]

Profs Limebeer and his research team were the poeople that first termed the electric supercharging with waste gates fully open "free load mode" i will try later on and trace the orriginal papaer/report and post the link.

Thanks. That will be helpful.

Linebeer first research paper november 2013. at around the same time, a presentaion of work at matlab (vidio). secoond paper (faster, higher and greener) adition futuring SPA published april 2015. all this can be downloaded for free, papers in PDF. by visiting "McCabism: optimal control theory and FERRARI'S turbo-electric hybrid" and follow instructions as were to click to download, the McCabism report is initself a must read to fully understand what and how things undolded.

Thanks again. I already have the first 2 so I’d be grateful if you could simply cut and paste from your copy of the third the definition of “free load mode”.

While you’re at it could you possibly do me the favour of revisiting this post. viewtopic.php?f=4&t=18874&start=12660. It’s the excellent Japanese article translated for us by user Hino. Last time you looked at it it was in connection with ERS. This time I’d like you to look at the pictures showing the wastegate(s). Usefully there is a caption next to one of the images of the 2016 motor labelled “wastegates”.

I hope you will see in that image that the wastegates are directly connected to the scroll housing of the turbine.

Thanks