Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[saviour stivala]

The lower the RPM the lower the power supping friction, the higher the RPM the higher the power supping friction. Running these present turbo engines at lower max power speed, of which I am sure would have been the first chose of the present manufacturers/designers if it wasn’t for the imposition of the max RPM for a given mandated max fuel flow, would have meant the manufacturers/designers being able to run at a correspondingly richer air/fuel ratio with correspondingly more power extracted with the same boost and with the same fuel load as mandated.

[Tommy Cookers]

I suggest that you find out about heat dilution engines
actually read the posts of the past few years that you claim to have read

and in attempting to refute my post you might even respond to what I actually wrote

though it pains me to say this, the current rules are in all respects ingenious and nothing is accidental or sloppy

[subcritical71]

I highly doubt that the stoich AFR in a modern F1 car is 14.7:1. While the misconception is sometimes that F1 fuel is pump gas there are differences to what you and I can buy at the pump. There are differences even in straight pump gas vs high octane racing fuels you can buy 'at the pump' for your commuter car (down to a stoich AFR of 13.4). With where Honda and others are running their engine maps this difference in stoich AFR is substantial for reliability and desired operation.

The different maps the Honda will use different lamda (λ) targets depending on what the purpose of the map is. Ideal λ being the AFR at which complete combustion occurs, all the fuel is burned with no excess air equally 1. Here is a graph for a gasoline engine which shows the different points for power / efficiency / stoich.

[godlameroso]

“Honda plans 2019 experiments in remaining races”. Honda are in a position (having nothing to lose) to do just that on track, but I am sure that all others are also doing just that in their dyno rooms, experimentation and developments never stops. Depending on how the remaining six race to the end develops between the top two contenders I will not be surprised to see a 2019 specification power unit being introduced in these last six/five races by one or both of the title contenders (teams).
Re the phenomenal ICE power outputs achieved at the maximum mandated fuel flow at maximum RPM (max power speed), in my opinion if the maximum fuel flow wasn’t mandated at the present maximum RPM (max power speed) these ICE’S will still be producing more power than at present because I am sure that they would have chosen to run at a much lower max power speed (max RPM) and in so doing eliminated a lot more power supping friction. Another thing, am I correct in believing that the current mandated maximum fuel flow is actually a shade higher than what the previous 2.4l NA V8’S were using.

If nothing else, if they were to remove the fuel flow/rpm you'd get a much broader powerband.

[godlameroso]

The lower the RPM the lower the power supping friction, the higher the RPM the higher the power supping friction. Running these present turbo engines at lower max power speed, of which I am sure would have been the first chose of the present manufacturers/designers if it wasn’t for the imposition of the max RPM for a given mandated max fuel flow, would have meant the manufacturers/designers being able to run at a correspondingly richer air/fuel ratio with correspondingly more power extracted with the same boost and with the same fuel load as mandated.

I'm sure they're measuring for example the resistance in the spark gap among other things, and have predictive algorithms to maintain a target spark gap resistance.

[maguetox]

Well its official, Spec 3 is here.

https://twitter.com/HondaRacingF1/statu ... 5328694272



Edit: According with Albert Fabrega, this evolution is going an increase around the 40 hp if they can extract all the potential of the evolution. They are changing all the PU parts but the battery assembly.

[HPD]

Albert Fabrega: La nueva evolución d Honda se calcula q puede aportar hasta unos 40 cv si pueden sacarle todo el potencial. También tiene mejoras para fiabilidad. Mañana estrenan todos los componentes menos batería. Objetivo Suzuka, pero sobretodo 2019

T: The new evolution of Honda is estimated q can contribute up to 40 hp if they can get the full potential. It also has improvements for reliability. Tomorrow they release all the components except the battery. Suzuka goal, but above all 2019

[subcritical71]

Well its official, Spec 3 is here.

https://twitter.com/HondaRacingF1/statu ... 5328694272



Edit: According with Albert Fabrega, this evolution is going an increase around the 40 hp if they can extract all the potential of the evolution. They are changing all the PU parts but the battery assembly.

It’s quite amazing they are still gaining ~5% at a time! Any news or rumors on what has changed?

[Bill]

They could pass Mercedes if the 30 hp deficit was true

[ivanlesk]

They could pass Mercedes if the 30 hp deficit was true

If all "news" and "predictions" around Honda were true they would be far ahead of everyone.

[godlameroso]

I'm glad that they haven't forgotten about reliability either, that's a big jump. Let's say conservatively half of that would put them ahead of the Renault spec B. So the Honda engine that was so horrible that McLaren though they were better off without it is now better than the engine that's currently in their car. Irony doesn't even begin to describe it.

[Bill]

The Honda had more power than people give ,just take statements from redbull, & what other teams says.but this a technical forum

[godlameroso]

Well its official, Spec 3 is here.

https://twitter.com/HondaRacingF1/statu ... 5328694272



Edit: According with Albert Fabrega, this evolution is going an increase around the 40 hp if they can extract all the potential of the evolution. They are changing all the PU parts but the battery assembly.

It’s quite amazing they are still gaining ~5% at a time! Any news or rumors on what has changed?

The rumors are in the cylinder head I'm guessing they reworked other parts, it wouldn't make sense to go through the trouble of taking penalties if there weren't enough changes at once.

A lot of gains can come from reducing friction, pumping losses, both from the ICE and it's ancillaries, while also improving the combustion process, and the efficiency of the ERS and it's integration with the ICE. So if you add up a lot of small improvements it can add up to a big one.

[Jolle]

I'm glad that they haven't forgotten about reliability either, that's a big jump. Let's say conservatively half of that would put them ahead of the Renault spec B. So the Honda engine that was so horrible that McLaren though they were better off without it is now better than the engine that's currently in their car. Irony doesn't even begin to describe it.

I've been attacked here stating last year that McLaren would go from the worst engine to the worst engine... I think RedBull has made a pretty good choice!

[etusch]

They could pass Mercedes if the 30 hp deficit was true

I also don't expect Honda pass ferrari and Mercedes in short term. But we must know that it is very possible something. For me, it is just a matter of time