Honda F1 project leader Yusuke Hasegawa has outlined a number of reasons why Honda has been struggling so badly in the beginning of the 2017 Formula One season. He confirmed that lots of problems were not discovered while running on the dynamo meter.
But if the level of analysis within the manufacturers and the big petrochems is that tight-knit, it's a shame so little is mentioned to the public. I mean after 4 years of development we're still speculating a lot as to what exactly they're doing without so much as a concrete morsel. Only shots of the engine and statements made in passing that could hardly classify as a solid source.
Then again a lot of this information is on a need to know basis, and we don't need to know it.
Well. At least we know they are still detonation limited. No ideal atomisation yet. And it rules out HCCI.
Detonation and pre-ignition same as any high performance engine. Granted I would love to just take a peek at what they're doing, or at least what kind of sensors are letting them get away with operating so close to the edge.
I'd guess they have more sensors on the test bench when fine tuning the combustion process then maybe just pressure/temperature sensors and a knock sensor on the PU?
I like to know what the differance would be on combustion level between normal operation and high power operation, like during a qualifying lap. Looks like Honda can increase ICE output for a single lap, like Ferrari and Mercedes can.
They had a fairly decent qualifying mode back with Mclaren but had to drop it when the new engine came in. Looks like it takes a lot of refinement to get that to work reliably.
If resonance, driveline, acoustic or otherwise, is enough to affect the combustion process then it makes sense why they wouldn't see these issues on the test bench but they would on track. Perhaps sensors on the power unit being less sophisticated than the ones on the test bench is the heart of their correlation issues. I'm guessing on track telemetry must be used to validate the way they develop the power unit from single cylinder models. Year 3 and now with closer partnership with the fuel and lube supplier, and a year to develop their methodology, it really seems like they're making progress.
If Ferrari and Mercedes fail to make significant progress next year, Honda could catch them by the end of the season.
“And it rules out HCCI”. The first indirect mention of HCCI kicked-off in-between the very first FP and race of the 2014 hybrid formula in Melbourne when a commentator said “These engines does not use spark-plugs”. Fast forward to 16 April 2016, another commentator said “ the buzz around the F1 paddock about the heavily upgraded Renault engine set to debut in Canada is that it will feature the same trick combustion technology that is believed to be employed by Mercedes, FERRARI and Honda. ‘Homogenous charge compression ignition (HCCI)”. Combines diesel-like compression ignition with a petrol-fired engine”. When somebody draw his attention to the fact that HCCI is not compatible with F1 rules because it uses VVT, on 24 April 2016 the same commentator said “Further to the earlier piece about the technology innovations in the combustion chamber of the hybrid turbo F1 engines, it’s now apparent that the technology being used is TJI and not HCCI concept”. Once again the same person draw his attention that the TJI combustion system might neither be compatible with F1 rules because both fuel injection and combustion is started in a pre-combustion chamber. Anyhow, having said/repeated all that everybody and his dog would very much like to know what the F1 manufacturers combustion process/system/s are actually being used. The 2014 Formula 1 hybrid engine rules forced manufacturers into using insane combustion pressures to be efficient. Central to design and being able to run such combustion pressures is the developed in-cylinder pressure sensors to prevent knock damage. they are the "sender-unit' to the control unit for knock control prevention. at these insane pressures, knock once, and a 2800 Euro sensor is itself broken, and that plus that then there is no knock prevention control. sensors that are mounted on the outside of block do the same job and do not break as often, but using them the engine would have to be designed and build much more on the safe side.
I like to know what the differance would be on combustion level between normal operation and high power operation, like during a qualifying lap. Looks like Honda can increase ICE output for a single lap, like Ferrari and Mercedes can.
Somewhere else on this forum it is stated that the extra power comes mainly from having less pumping losses on the turbo, as they run with the waste gate open and mgu-k energy comes from the battery for 100% (for this one lap).
I also wonder what else they can do with combustion. I guess running a bit hotter for this one lap to boost efficiency is not worth it. Efficiency increase would only work via mgu-h harvesting, which is down for this power mode, right?
Seriously man. What are you trying to say? Half of your posts are gibberish to say the least
Is it so hard to try being more reasonable?!
Adding some newlines can help too ...
“And it rules out HCCI”. The first indirect mention of HCCI kicked-off in-between the very first FP and race of the 2014 hybrid formula in Melbourne when a commentator said “These engines does not use spark-plugs”.
The is no pre-detonation with HCCI. The very name of it goes against that.
And didn't Hamilton have a spark plug cable failure in Australia 2014?
Didn't Ferrari also had a few "spark plug" changes over the season in 2015??
My appologies to the rest of the forum for bringing back up this topic!! But yeah back to the regular scheduled programme.
Seriously man. What are you trying to say? Half of your posts are gibberish to say the least
Is it so hard to try being more reasonable?!
Adding some newlines can help too ...
What I was saying was that first pushed-out as a combustion process/system being used in F1 was the HCCI combustion process, after that came the TJI as the combustion process/system as the one being used in F1. After all that time ‘some’ are still parroting one or the other as being used, if you don’t agree that neither one nor the other is being used, some will tell you somebody said so, some others will tell you “look at that engine picture and you will see what is being used”. but now not agreeing also risk one not being reasonable and half your posts would be regarded as gibberish.
Seriously man. What are you trying to say? Half of your posts are gibberish to say the least
Is it so hard to try being more reasonable?!
Adding some newlines can help too ...
What is your problem? This user is saying HCCI is not used and I agree, HCCI is not suitable for high load appications. All the scientific literature backs this up, even Mazda's road engine can only use it while at cruising loads.
This user is also saying that people are too gullible, and will instantly run with whatever concoction is pushed out by any journalist. Worse people will take this misinformation as gospel, and become toxic if this wrong but popular "knowledge" is challenged.
