Scuderia Ferrari SF90

[hollus]

https://media.giphy.com/media/1yTgcCeZM ... source.gif

That looks like the suspension sits down at the rear as speed, and downforce, increases. That it "unloads" in a single "jump" might get them looked at by other teams. A protest on the basis that the suspension steps between two positions would be on the grounds that is doing so solely for aerodynamic reasons and so is illegal. If the rear sits in a single step and then lifts back up in a single step (as it appears to do in that gif) rather than doing both gradually and proportionately to the applied downforce, then they will get told to remove it.

Another sequence
https://imgur.com/gallery/kVpeiOP

It lifts the nose after DRS closes and then it stays there. Only a while later it dives the nose as braking starts, then it stays there. There seems to be a gap where the driver has closed DRS but is not really braking?
It seems to follow the drag of the rear sail and then the inertia of the car as it has to be convinced to slow by the tires.
It has the dynamics of seesaw with the stiffness of a standing punching bag.
Kind of like this (pardon the red horses):

[LM10]

Thank you hollus, this illustrates it the best. And that's also my thought, as I've mentioned it in my last post.

Now, why would this be illegal or banned?

[Zynerji]

I would expect this to be a by-product of the bound/rebounf settings on the front and rear 3rd spring dampers...

[roon]

Perspective is playing a role in these gifs as well. Notice how more of the rear tires is revealed above the top of the front tires. As well, more of the upper mid-wing is revealed. As the car approaches the camera, the perspective will shift to a more top-down angle, away from a flatter horizon-oriented angle. This will exaggerate load transfer and the apparent increase in height of the RW.

[MartijnA3]

Off course we also don’t know the brake pressure built up. What if the RB is not pushing so much and brake is just aplied more gentle

DRS closes when they hit the brakes, right? There's a delay before the back jumps up.

[roon]

Thank you hollus, this illustrates it the best. And that's also my thought, as I've mentioned it in my last post.

Now, why would this be illegal or banned?

I think it's just normal behavior. Rear end squats when DRS closes. Front end squats as the brakes are applied. Any delay may be due to differences in the endpoint of the DRS zone and the start of the braking zone, or simply a delay in applying the brakes or a progressive increase in braking force by the driver. This was testing, not a race.

In those same gifs: look how much the T-wing bounces!

[Mr.G]

What's so strange about that? Leclerc closes his DRS, but doesn't brake yet, meaning the airflow towards the RW makes the car lean back and at the point he starts braking it leans forward...

Dosn't the DRS deactivates automatically when the driver starts breaking?

[jjn9128]

Dosn't the DRS deactivates automatically when the driver starts breaking?

DRS has to shut when driver applies any brake pressure. They generally prefer to shut it a little before the brake zone though to allow the air to reattach under the wing for brake stability.

[LM10]

Thank you hollus, this illustrates it the best. And that's also my thought, as I've mentioned it in my last post.

Now, why would this be illegal or banned?

I think it's just normal behavior. Rear end squats when DRS closes. Front end squats as the brakes are applied. Any delay may be due to differences in the endpoint of the DRS zone and the start of the braking zone, or simply a delay in applying the brakes or a progressive increase in braking force by the driver. This was testing, not a race.

In those same gifs: look how much the T-wing bounces!

https://media.giphy.com/media/1yTgcCeZM ... source.gif

I also think it's normal behavior. But going a bit more into detail. These are the regulations:

10.1.2 Any suspension system fitted to the front wheels must be so arranged that its response results only from changes in load applied to the front wheels.
10.1.3 Any suspension system fitted to the rear wheels must be so arranged that its response results only from changes in load applied to the rear wheels.

So, the rear end squats when DRS closes, meaning that load is applied to the rear wheels. But what about the visible lift of the front wing at this moment? Can it just be seen as a consequence of the rear diving? Of course, it would make sense that the front needs to lift when the rear dives as both are interacting with each other. But then it means the regulations above are open for funny interpretations. I mean, when DRS closes, load is applied to the rear wheels through RW, but is as per regulation also load applied to the front wheels?

And yes, that T-wing bounces massively!

[Tzk]

When the rear squats, the car will pivot around the front axle, raising the frontwing. It‘s not that simple, but basically works like this.

That this rule doesn‘t state though: you can do whatever you want inside the dampers, as long as the only input to the dampers is the load. Now, what about a rear heave damper which squats when the car is going straight (no sideways load applied) and the load reaches a certain amount? You could even hold some hydraulic valve open till the car breaks...

I‘d love to see all three solutions... the merc, rb and the current ferrari solutions

[matteosc]

Thank you hollus, this illustrates it the best. And that's also my thought, as I've mentioned it in my last post.

Now, why would this be illegal or banned?

I think it's just normal behavior. Rear end squats when DRS closes. Front end squats as the brakes are applied. Any delay may be due to differences in the endpoint of the DRS zone and the start of the braking zone, or simply a delay in applying the brakes or a progressive increase in braking force by the driver. This was testing, not a race.

In those same gifs: look how much the T-wing bounces!

https://media.giphy.com/media/1yTgcCeZM ... source.gif

I also think it's normal behavior. But going a bit more into detail. These are the regulations:

10.1.2 Any suspension system fitted to the front wheels must be so arranged that its response results only from changes in load applied to the front wheels.
10.1.3 Any suspension system fitted to the rear wheels must be so arranged that its response results only from changes in load applied to the rear wheels.

So, the rear end squats when DRS closes, meaning that load is applied to the rear wheels. But what about the visible lift of the front wing at this moment? Can it just be seen as a consequence of the rear diving? Of course, it would make sense that the front needs to lift when the rear dives as both are interacting with each other. But then it means the regulations above are open for funny interpretations. I mean, when DRS closes, load is applied to the rear wheels through RW, but is as per regulation also load applied to the front wheels?

And yes, that T-wing bounces massively!

Those regulations are for avoiding teams to link front and rear suspensions with hydraulic systems (or in any other way). Mercedes with the FRIC was doing that. Of course the car is a body and what happens on the back has influence on what happens on the front, so that what Ferrari does should be perfectly legal (Red Bull does the same).

[GrizzleBoy]

I retain my opinion that all this is just a product of "spring" settings and the latest loop with the "DRS closes car leans back > brakes applied car leans forward" sequence solidifies that belief.

Also for those asking, yes brakes automatically closes the DRS but as you'll see in Hamilton's pole laps last year, he will regularly close the DRS manually before the end of a straight to limit the amount of instantaneous forces applied to the car before he starts braking.

Effectively turning the braking zone into a two phased operation.

First phase is aero braking, using the closed rear wing to stabilise the aero load across the car and to make the diffuser suck the car down to the floor harder at the rear.

Second phase is the mechanical braking with the pedal, aided by the now already hard working diffuser and rear wing which is needed to balance against the large load the front brakes are about to endure.

I know it's not a direct comparison, but we saw with Ricciardos Renault the importance of aero reattachment in a heavy braking zone. If flow does not reattach at the same time as braking occurs, the braking distance becomes longer

Thinking abiut it like that, closing the DRS before braking seems like a way to actually shorten the braking distance due to the fact that the moment the largest amount of braking force is applied (immediately after they hit the brake), the car doesn't need to wait for the air to reattach in its normal fashion. It's already working in conjunction with the full downforce of the car, allowing more brake force to be applied with less chance of locking up.

[Cedo]

Here is Marc Priestley explaination to someone asking him what going on with the Ferrari pitching stuff..

[f1316]

So here’s the direct comparison with DRS for both:

This is no direct comparison! DRS on RedBull was open! If you have some basic understanding of this cars you cannot use this as a baseline for comparison.

Eeeeer... it’s open on both cars...

[miguelalvesreis]

When the rear squats, the car will pivot around the front axle, raising the frontwing. It‘s not that simple, but basically works like this.

That this rule doesn‘t state though: you can do whatever you want inside the dampers, as long as the only input to the dampers is the load. Now, what about a rear heave damper which squats when the car is going straight (no sideways load applied) and the load reaches a certain amount? You could even hold some hydraulic valve open till the car breaks...

I‘d love to see all three solutions... the merc, rb and the current ferrari solutions

I've proposed something like that yesterday A hydraulic pressure "switch" on the heave element



Enviado do meu SM-T820 através do Tapatalk