Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑15 Apr 2019, 20:39
the last 2 posts show the bigotry and mendacity of those who denounce the 52%
my guess is that people saw the collective incompetence & unaccountability of the EU in recent years
news !!
you can't (if you believe in democracy) decide that the votes were a mistake and so must be replaced
got to love the people-hating anti-democratic liberals !!
liberal loony Tony Blair let into the UK 2 million 2004-accession EU migrants in 7 years when other countries didn't let in any
without this mad vanity-freak policy in the UK there would have been no traction for the Brexit movement to start
Brexit won't affect F1 because (if it is ever allowed to happen) there will be a customs union
the Withdrawal Bill is built on a CU or equivalent which will become permanent as the EU unilaterally determines this
65% of Labour MPs were elected by leave-voting constituencies - but the Party won't let them vote for that Bill
Are really so sure it's good to take such fate in Your people's wisdom as a whole?
I've spent a total of 1 year in UK, back in the day, when I was merely a MSc student. I've never met so many people unrightfully full of themselves out there. You know the kind - we're British, we're better, we're entitled, we hate imigrants, even though we have absolutely no ground to feel superior. Some of them were so incredibly stupid (not as a lack of inteligence), that I thought it's fascinating how it's possible for them to function in society with such enormous ignorance. And it has not been a "lower class" only problem. For instance, when I was going back to Poland, my GFs manager said she feels for us having to endure a whole day travel. She concluded that she is a smart woman, she watches discovery at times and they said Australia is very far and she took the effort to look on the map and concluded somehow that Austria must be the same as Australia - so with Poland being a similar distance away we have a full day travel ahead of us. Go figure. She was one of those replaying "immigrants are taking our jobs" tantrum, even though 8 out of 10 of her higher staff have been from abroad, on merit. After that we made a quiz in the pub to draw europe on napkin. It has been sad, seriously. Most people had absolutely no clue how europe looks like, even remotely. Quite a few were even convinced that UK is not in europe at all, more like far away from it. I've worked in few places back then and in most of them, getting news has been mostly looking at pictures in Daily Mail or the Sun. Everyone skipped the parts with text somehow, even though these are hardly a demanding lectures. Once in a team, where I have been the only foreigner, I got to fill the papers, as I made the least spelling mistakes and my English certainly isn't perfect... How many languages do a statistical Englishman know? Last time I checked 62% knew only English. To some degree. Do You really have such faith in economical and political wisdom of an entire nation? I'd imagine that in many cases of low voter turnout, the highest attendance would be within those easiest to manipulate. Those on the right side of certain distribution chart tend to have doubts more often.
Don't get me wrong, I've met quite a few fantastic, wise people out there. Absolutely amazing people, who had their ambitions and means to pursue them. One of them, incredibly smart engineer in Milton Keynes wanted me in his team, he took 2 days to check my skills at all the fields he would see me involved in, only for another man, who happened to have such power, to refuse me based on my nationality alone. He said that being Polish, I'm probably a thief and most definitely can't comunicate or have any skills whatsoever. it's not that it's all wrong in UK, it's just there's a lot of complacency, based on high living standard accessible without much effort or ambition mixed with impression of greatness based on glorious (imperial) past and weird sense of conservatism. Like with two tap sinks - It's not 19th century anymore, mixers were invented long ago and rat plague isn't really an issue, yet still You can see two taps in many places. Rem(a)inders of past greatness.
There's a lot of good in Britain and a lot of bad. From outsider's perspective, most of the bad things get from refusing to acknowledge that traditional British way is not always the best way (this, and the wide spread ignorance). UK is not as influential anymore nor the modern times allow for stubborn isolationism.
Do You, such an intelligent person, really think that British society as a whole have a solid ground to recognize "the collective incompetence & unaccountability of the EU" other than the narrative from the media? Do You think, it can do better job themselves? Do You think, UK can cope on their own? Should UK get rid of all of the migrants, including foregin professionals already living in UK in the process? You know that despite of whats on the news, 2004-accession EU migrants went not only to UK? Quite the contrary, actually. I should know, I'm from Poland. The first waves of immigration took some of the best people from developing countries and spread across the "old UE" in search for better opportunities. Do You really think, You'd be better off without those talented, brave and determined enough to seek chances far away from home? There were of course plenty of less respectable specimens in the mix, but that's the price of such bargain. One last question to consider - do You really think EU, a force much greater than UK alone, would happily bend the knee before UK and offer every economical freedoms and benfits UK like in EU, while conveniently leaving out everything that isn't liked? There's no logical scenario where UK would be in a position to negotiate successfully such deal, let alone processing the negotiations without a solid plan and even inner consensus of it's shape!
). It has worked nicely for Germany with Turks and eastern Europeans. As there is not much movement from those directions nowadays, they thought bringing people from further regions would work as good. This obviously backfired very badly, as cultural differences are too steep to mix societies as painlessly and newcomers weren't exactly as they were advertised. Large portion have their minds set on exploiting the system rather than contributing to it, To make things worse, its in interest of EU competitors to destabilize it economically and politically so they fuel the conflict by strenghtening xenophobia and polarisation of European societies. Local governments all across the europe won't risk doing the wise thing, as it's much safer and easier to play either of the extremes and fuel it with populistic BS, than look for solutions acknowledging that neither side of "conflict" is actually right. It's always politically risky to inform the society that world isn't actually black and white as that would mean they need to exit their comfort zones and rethink their position. That's not something that ordinary voter wants to hear and You can't win any election counting on intelectual's votes.
