2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

[godlameroso]

I like how you pick and choose. They were slower at Monaco and they were slower at Spain than Kvyat. Monaco is a chassis track. All Honda cars were slower at Canada. At Spain after such a big update, the team was slower than 2 Haas, Ricciardo and Kvyat, we just got lucky with the result because Lando's incident.

My point stands, with the number of updates McLaren has brought, they should be much further ahead in pace than they are right now. Even Zak Brown has said they are sixth fastest in the interview. Renault is bringing a major update and if it works, they are going to be clearly faster than McLaren is right now.

You might be looking at it wrong. They messed up the setup direction in Spain hence the pace. Monaco is a mechanical grip focused track and they did well to get into Q3 despite the circuit exposing their main weakness i.e low speed corners. Back on pace in Canada.

The irony is that none of the Midfield teams can differentiate themselves from the others via speed. Most of the time it comes down to the smallest thing in execution or being hurt by tire type they start the race on.

In the good rules gone bad category, The Q2 tire rule for those who make it into the Q3 is punishing the midfield teams that execute better in quali. It's getting to the point where at some races it's a distinct advantage to qualify lower. They either have to do away completely with that rule or just apply it to the top 6.

The closeness of the midfield, and field in general, makes it interesting because anyone can finish anywhere, the cars are closer so stealing 5th is more achievable than it was last year. And you're absolutely right, they're so close that the cars themselves aren't the only deciding factors. Tires, team preparation, weather, lucking into a good setup all play a part in the performance, furthermore, the drivers themselves can make a difference. They can seize critical moments should they present themselves, and small mistakes are punishing.

[godlameroso]

I think it will be smart to focus on 2020 quite early. Like I said before, it's quite hard to change the characteristic of the car during the season and after last year they probably went for a concept that lacks a bit of downforce, but reaches high speeds on the straights. Not saying the current chassis doesn't have potential, but with a new chassis the gains will be much bigger than adding some elements to the bargeboard area.

I very much see this car as a study in aerodynamics validation. This car is setting the ground work to a new philosophy, naturally I assume they made this car as modular as possible in order to properly define the aero direction they'll pursue.

I honestly think 2021 will largely carry the same car concept with some small tweaks, particularly because the people making decisions(FIA FOM Teams and Liberty) cannot seem to make one and follow through. Dragging their feet because they're afraid of making drastic changes.

[rogazilla]

...

...furthermore, the drivers themselves can make a difference. They can seize critical moments should they present themselves, and small mistakes are punishing.

The way Sainz put in the time he needed to come out ahead of STR in Monaco is the perfect example. Great team strategy, great execution and all involved there.

[Andres125sx]

Focusing on next year car as soon as posible is normal in a long term project like this. If they´re not aiming a great result in current season, only evolving a concept, with 9 GPs (after june) they´ll have more than enough data to judge if it´s working as expected and what changes are needed. If some of those changes cannot be done on current car, wich is very plausible on a new car, the sooner they start the new car design the better

Obviously it will depend on how big are the modifications needed, but since it´s a new concept, I´d say it´s almost a certainty they will need to do some big changes. Specially when they were caught with an understeer problem they didn´t expect

[zoroastar]

I was looking at the Qualifying times from Canada the other day comparing Renault to McLaren being conscious they are likely in a race for best of the rest this year. Riccardo in particular got gradually faster through each session, pulling out a whopping half second in Q3. McLaren never really got any quicker from Q1 - Q3. Simple conclusion I drew was Renault works team having access to an improved qualifying party mode that McLaren didn't have access to or chose not to use. I can't believe he found a full half second without?

they cant release a party mode that isnt available to mclaren at the same time under the rules. i think that its down to sainz making a mistake in his q3 run. not that he would have been faster, but definately closer.

[diffuser]

I was looking at the Qualifying times from Canada the other day comparing Renault to McLaren being conscious they are likely in a race for best of the rest this year. Riccardo in particular got gradually faster through each session, pulling out a whopping half second in Q3. McLaren never really got any quicker from Q1 - Q3. Simple conclusion I drew was Renault works team having access to an improved qualifying party mode that McLaren didn't have access to or chose not to use. I can't believe he found a full half second without?

That mode would be illegal.

[martinbeiker]

I was looking at the Qualifying times from Canada the other day comparing Renault to McLaren being conscious they are likely in a race for best of the rest this year. Riccardo in particular got gradually faster through each session, pulling out a whopping half second in Q3. McLaren never really got any quicker from Q1 - Q3. Simple conclusion I drew was Renault works team having access to an improved qualifying party mode that McLaren didn't have access to or chose not to use. I can't believe he found a full half second without?

For what we know McLaren could have used the more powerful engine modes in Q1 an Q2, not just in Q3 like Renault (for example).

[_cerber1]

Telemetry Canada, Carlos's circle from Q2, it’s a pity that there was a mistake in Q3, because there was a qualifying mode, and the time would be closer to Ric.

Ricciardo vs Gasly vs Sainz (Q2)
https://unendinginsight.wordpress.com/2 ... -analysis/

[FittingMechanics]

If you watched story from Monaco, McLaren engineers (PU and race engineer) were asking Andrea Stella whether they should use up the engine in qualy and he approved it because it's Monaco. This probably means that McLaren can turn up the engine to the maximum, but that this carries trade offs in reliability and engine longevity. Situation in Canada may be that Renault has more "life" left in their engine than McLaren and that they could have run the engine at higher mode for a longer time.

This can probably explain variability in apparent engine power between races. If you are trading off engine life for power obviously sometimes you'll use it and other team will not.

[_cerber1]

I think that the use of the qualification regime is included in the general resource of the PU, and does not bring its end closer. Moreover, McLaren is already on the verge of a fine for PU, and most likely they will use 4 engines per season, there is not much point in saving resources.

[Ground Effect]

If you watched story from Monaco, McLaren engineers (PU and race engineer) were asking Andrea Stella whether they should use up the engine in qualy and he approved it because it's Monaco. This probably means that McLaren can turn up the engine to the maximum, but that this carries trade offs in reliability and engine longevity. Situation in Canada may be that Renault has more "life" left in their engine than McLaren and that they could have run the engine at higher mode for a longer time.

This can probably explain variability in apparent engine power between races. If you are trading off engine life for power obviously sometimes you'll use it and other team will not.

I believe they are limited on how many laps they can use the full power modes over a race weekend. I heard the engineer telling Andrea it would be expensive, so perhaps they would run out of laps for the weekend. Being Monaco, maybe Andrea felt it’s not really needed for the race and getting a good grid position would be more important. I’d be a bit surprised if McLaren have been running their engines harder than Renault. Besides, these engines only came in Barcelona, which was followed by Monaco, two tracks that are less of a strain on the engines. Canada was the first real test, so it’s unlikely McLaren are running out of performance.

[FittingMechanics]

I believe they are limited on how many laps they can use the full power modes over a race weekend. I heard the engineer telling Andrea it would be expensive, so perhaps they would run out of laps for the weekend. Being Monaco, maybe Andrea felt it’s not really needed for the race and getting a good grid position would be more important. I’d be a bit surprised if McLaren have been running their engines harder than Renault. Besides, these engines only came in Barcelona, which was followed by Monaco, two tracks that are less of a strain on the engines. Canada was the first real test, so it’s unlikely McLaren are running out of performance.

Thank you. I didn't know when the engines were installed and whether Renault installed their engines later or earlier. In any case, I wanted to say that there are many factors which could change perceived power of the engine. If what you say is accurate, that the engine is limited to number of "party laps" over a weekend, then perhaps Renault wanted to use it in qualifying and McLaren saved them for the race. That being said, I find it strange that engine would be limited to number of party laps over a weekend, I'd say it's more likely that it is limited to total number of party laps. If this is true, McLaren may have used up more so far due to Monaco, remember Sainz pushing hard to get ahead of that train after pitting. Renault on other hand was behind a train, running very slowly due to traffic ahead so their engine was probably not pushed at all in Monaco.

[Ground Effect]

I believe they are limited on how many laps they can use the full power modes over a race weekend. I heard the engineer telling Andrea it would be expensive, so perhaps they would run out of laps for the weekend. Being Monaco, maybe Andrea felt it’s not really needed for the race and getting a good grid position would be more important. I’d be a bit surprised if McLaren have been running their engines harder than Renault. Besides, these engines only came in Barcelona, which was followed by Monaco, two tracks that are less of a strain on the engines. Canada was the first real test, so it’s unlikely McLaren are running out of performance.

Thank you. I didn't know when the engines were installed and whether Renault installed their engines later or earlier. In any case, I wanted to say that there are many factors which could change perceived power of the engine. If what you say is accurate, that the engine is limited to number of "party laps" over a weekend, then perhaps Renault wanted to use it in qualifying and McLaren saved them for the race. That being said, I find it strange that engine would be limited to number of party laps over a weekend, I'd say it's more likely that it is limited to total number of party laps. If this is true, McLaren may have used up more so far due to Monaco, remember Sainz pushing hard to get ahead of that train after pitting. Renault on other hand was behind a train, running very slowly due to traffic ahead so their engine was probably not pushed at all in Monaco.

I’d have to concede that your scenario also seems plausible. In Barcelona, Ricciardo was pretty much stuck behind Carlos for a very long time as well. I guess it’s all part of the trials and tribulations of being a customer.
Edit: So, if your perspective is close to the actual situation with the engines, then I’d say that Renault could be back to a similar level of “power life” with McLaren, after their exploits in Canada. They did (Ricciardo, at least) quite a bit of defending against Bottas. So maybe they used up quite a lot of party laps allocation?

[M840TR]

The Renault made time in the corners not the straights. That's where the deficit is.

[martinbeiker]

The engine situation is very complex. Renault could want to do the rest of the season with 4 engines and McLaren with 3.