Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[ispano6]

In Honda's diagram, there are two turbos.....

The rules state only a single turbo (1 turbine, 1 compressor) is allowed.

You don't really understand what you are looking at.

Sorry I forgot to distinguish between the two parts. Not two turbos, but the two parts and the side that utilizes the single crystal blade.

[_cerber1]

Sorry I forgot to distinguish between the two parts. Not two turbos, but the two parts and the side that utilizes the single crystal blade.

What do you mean when you say "single crystal blade"?

[63l8qrrfy6]

In Honda's diagram, there are two turbos.....

The rules state only a single turbo (1 turbine, 1 compressor) is allowed.

You don't really understand what you are looking at.

Sorry I forgot to distinguish between the two parts. Not two turbos, but the two parts and the side that utilizes the single crystal blade.

That makes no sense at all.
There's no nice way of saying this (sorry mods) but you really have no clue what you are talking about so I'm not surprised you misread the entire article.

This is meant to be a technical forum, you can't really make a point if you can't distinguish between major turbocharger components.

[subcritical71]

The rules state only a single turbo (1 turbine, 1 compressor) is allowed.

You don't really understand what you are looking at.

Sorry I forgot to distinguish between the two parts. Not two turbos, but the two parts and the side that utilizes the single crystal blade.

That makes no sense at all.
There's no nice way of saying this (sorry mods) but you really have no clue what you are talking about so I'm not surprised you misread the entire article.

This is meant to be a technical forum, you can't really make a point if you can't distinguish between major turbocharger components.

Additionally, I'd be really surprised if they are using a nickel based superalloy single crystal blade cast in the turbocharger. 1) Single crystal is expensive vs other methods, 2) the exhaust temperatures simply don't justify the single crystal material (the first stages of a gas turbine are well over 2,300F), 3) there are other materials which are lighter and more appropriate for the application. This technology has been around since the 60's, it's hardly a secret.

[HPD]

Tanabe only said:
* "This time it was the aerodynamic area of ​​the turbine".
* "I think there's very common technology there."

This development was made with the people of Honda Jet and that's it, the rest is speculation. "single crystal blades" is just Scott Mitchell's speculation.

Anyway, it's the first time I've seen Honda so excited about an update. And that for me is the strangest thing.

[loner]

i have to agree , they are boasting about this update while it just a slight increase in power
i didn't see Mercs say oh look we are the best PU because we collaborate with Airbus or Ferrari with Boeing for example
what so special about this update ? its still inferior to the other two
they even posted a pic of the famous RA168-E .. missed calculations or hinting about something yet to come?!!

[TNTHead]

May be they want emphasize that it's an all Japanese party, or are excited because this update lays the foundation for the long awaited and promised power boost. Who knows, time will tell.

About the split turbo concept, does anyone know how you can create a shaft stiff enough to avoid torsional vibrations and in meantime have a very low intertia to avoid lag? Or is the turbo spinning at a more or less constant speed in the hybrid setup?

[godlameroso]

I'd imagine the point of failure isn't the shaft, but the bearings.

[gokarter]

Sometimes you wonder if this new turbo will be better in high altitude condition like austrai and mexico

[Stef]

If it is developped by airplane guys, it should be better at high altitudes, obviously.

[izzy]

Max is beginning to sound not quite satisfied, I think. How well will it pull up the hill?

[bigblue]

I think everyone is reading way too much into this aero-division stuff, in terms of the characteristics of the new turbo. I think simply the F1 team had quite a few hard to solve problems in this area, the aero-engine team has applicable expertise, they helped significantly, and it's about crediting them for their help publicly. It's also about publicising that Honda has some diverse and cool operations and it's really nice when they collaborate cross-division to sort something out. Nothing to do with hinting that it's a turbo for high altitude with single crystal blades a la aero-engine, blah blah blah.

[subcritical71]

I think everyone is reading way too much into this aero-division stuff, in terms of the characteristics of the new turbo. I think simply the F1 team had quite a few hard to solve problems in this area, the aero-engine team has applicable expertise, they helped significantly, and it's about crediting them for their help publicly. It's also about publicising that Honda has some diverse and cool operations and it's really nice when they collaborate cross-division to sort something out. Nothing to do with hinting that it's a turbo for high altitude with single crystal blades a la aero-engine, blah blah blah.

If anything, I believe the aero division (this is a Honda/GE joint venture btw, GE having the largest market share of aviation turbine engines in the world) is providing inputs on the airfoil shapes of the turbine and compressor. The aero industry has really excelled here in the last 10 years, especially now that additive manufacturing is being used.

[hollus]

Would the temperature change between just before and just after the blades? Would this result in a compressible air CFD problem? Can this be the expertise from the jet department?
Just thinking aloud, might be way, way off.

[63l8qrrfy6]

Would the temperature change between just before and just after the blades? Would this result in a compressible air CFD problem? Can this be the expertise from the jet department?
Just thinking aloud, might be way, way off.

I think the expertise of a gas turbine manufacturer in aerodynamic (rotating domain CFD) and thermodynamic design of rotating machinery is unparalleled in other industries. I dare say that the mechanical aspects are trivial by comparison.

Going back to your question - not sure about temperature but it is not uncommon to have local Mach numbers in excess of 1 in turbines. The shockwaves produced are a source of aerodynamic load and noise.