Todt wants to bring back refueling in 2021

[Dr. Acula]

Refueling was nice when there were teams that thought it bad sportsmanship to use tactics like Williams vs Benneton in 94. However f1 has never been duller then when all teams got the hang of tactics with zero overtakes in races.. Never again I hope, F1 is running in circles if this makes it to the rules. What's next.. TC? I remember being very very happy when the FIA got rid of these things.

They didn't overtake because it wasn't possible. Remember, they had no DRS back then and this problem was exactly the reason DRS was introduced in the first place.
Also what do we see now often enough? Overcuts and undercuts are exactly the same thing. The Teams try to overtake an opponent in the pits. If you would bann DRS, you would immediatly see a huge reduction in overtaking, probably even worse than it was back then, if you think of what happend at the french GP this year overtaking wise, despite DRS...

[browney]

I just think they need to see if they are actually able to reduce downforce and wake in the 2021 rules before we talk about anything else.

It's like how they keep wanting to mess around with the qualifying format... Even though that is something that works.

I wish they would keep there eye on the obvious (to everyone who didn't write the 2017 rules, anyway) problem, fix that, then worry about everything else.

[AJI]

Remove the 2MJ K recovery rule and reduce down force to the point that K recovery is significant.
Up the max SoC to 6~8MJ and the reintroduction of refuelling effectively becomes a good way to charge the battery more often.
I think JT has suggested refuelling because he knows it's nigh on impossible for all manufacturers to develop a new engine formula for 2021.

[ENGINE TUNER]

After watching much of the 95 season yesterday I want V12s back and simple aero.

Only Ferrari ran a v12 in 95, and they soon switched to v10. V12 was proven obsolete in the late 70s, no reason to bring back dinosaur tech.

[ENGINE TUNER]

and while they're at it show us fans the ES state like they used to with KERS

They never showed the ES state, only how much of the 6s was used. Did you really think that the ES became magically filled just as the car passed over the start/finish line?

[ENGINE TUNER]

Some interesting ideas presented. None of them will increase on-track racing / overtaking. Guaranteed.

Want more on track action? Ban tire changes, ban refueling and set the grid in reverse wdc position order. Everyone's brain will explode every race. Giving the faster cars a head start is absurd beyond comprehension.

[izzy]

and while they're at it show us fans the ES state like they used to with KERS

They never showed the ES state, only how much of the 6s was used. Did you really think that the ES became magically filled just as the car passed over the start/finish line?

Oh yeah, mea culpa, "after all they used to show ES usage and availability", well spotted

[siskue2005]

Refueling was nice when there were teams that thought it bad sportsmanship to use tactics like Williams vs Benneton in 94. However f1 has never been duller then when all teams got the hang of tactics with zero overtakes in races.. Never again I hope, F1 is running in circles if this makes it to the rules. What's next.. TC? I remember being very very happy when the FIA got rid of these things.

They didn't overtake because it wasn't possible. Remember, they had no DRS back then and this problem was exactly the reason DRS was introduced in the first place.
Also what do we see now often enough? Overcuts and undercuts are exactly the same thing. The Teams try to overtake an opponent in the pits. If you would bann DRS, you would immediatly see a huge reduction in overtaking, probably even worse than it was back then, if you think of what happend at the french GP this year overtaking wise, despite DRS...

True

Association is not causation (golden rule of research)

Just coz in the early 2000s we had more passes in pitlane, will not automatically make the refuelling the culprit.
same way we cannot blame marlboro sponsorship in the ferrari for all the passes made in the pitlane! (just coz both happened together).

The passing pitlane in early 2000s was due to poor aero and almost zero possibilities to pass on track!
With the DRS we have now it wont be an issue and the cars are also more compliant to make a pass aero wise than before

[strad]

Only Ferrari ran a v12 in 95, and they soon switched to v10.

Did you really think I didn't know that?
The Matra was a dinosaur as you call it as well but that doesn't change that they made beautiful music.

[astracrazy]

- Bring back refueling and let the teams decide the starting fuel after qualifying.
- Get rid of the Q2 top 10 starting tyre rule and replace it for all drivers all sessions: Knocked out in Q1 then you start on the tyre you did your Q1 time on, Q2 the same and Q1 the same.
- Instead of two of the three tyres in the race needing to be used, make it all three.

Strategy is becoming to set, predictable and boring. We will never get drivers going flat out in this era because of the allocation engine rules, but we can make it unpredictable which normally makes for great racing.

[DutchDopey]

I have to agree with Toto that these big changes like refuelling will only stretch up the field, with some teams getting it earlier under control than others. Stabilising the rules without too much changes will make the races much more interesting. This is far too big a change and will create a couple of years with teams trying to manage it and take advantage of it.

[ENGINE TUNER]

Only Ferrari ran a v12 in 95, and they soon switched to v10.

Did you really think I didn't know that?
The Matra was a dinosaur as you call it as well but that doesn't change that they made beautiful music.

It's just noise, wasted energy, get over it, move on.

[ENGINE TUNER]

- Get rid of the Q2 top 10 starting tyre rule and replace it 6 all drivers all sessions: Knocked out in Q1 then you start on the tyre you did your Q1 time on, Q2 the same and Q1 the same.

How many Q1s do you want?

[ENGINE TUNER]

We will never get drivers going flat out in this era because of the allocation engine rules

HAM won in Abu Dhabi with a 7 race old PU against drivers with much fresher PUs. HAM did it again in Monaco. The PU'S have absolutely NO effect on how hard the drivers are pushing during the race. The tires are what hold them back. The engines have never been able to be run in qually mode for the entire race, even during refueling.

[strad]

Only Ferrari ran a v12 in 95, and they soon switched to v10.

Did you really think I didn't know that?
The Matra was a dinosaur as you call it as well but that doesn't change that they made beautiful music.

It's just noise, wasted energy, get over it, move on.

Is that you Gugs?