Brazil GP 2008

[donskar]

I'm not sure where this should be posted, but I think it is important.

First, full disclosure: I hate Mosley and Ecclestone, separately or together. I believe both did a great deal for F1 many years ago, but that both have been seduxced by money and power. Now the point:

SPEED TV's broadcast of F1 is barely adequate, but I respect Steve Matchett. He and his colleagues reported that Ron Dennis boasted that McLaren spent $7.5 MILLION dollars preparing for Brazil in order to improve the McLaren .015 seconds per lap.

Astonsishing. Repulsive. Fascinating.

[mahesh248]

I really felt bad for Massa's Family and fans , beacause at a point they were celebrating , and Glock was struggeling with Slicks in the wet and Hamilton went past him .Probably thats the moment that decided this years championship, Poor Massa won most of the races this season and yet not a champion .

[shir0]

I hate it, I wish he was fighting for the win, rather then running thru the motions trying to maintain position in forth.... This points racing is crap and it shortchanges the fans... I want to see all the drivers all out all the time, balls to the wall. Points racing is for suckas!... the regs need to change, driver with the most wins should be WDC... point blank period.

EH??! If what you wished for had been the case this 2008 season, your LH God would not be all-jumping-happy-while-squeezing-Nicole's-racks-flat because of his 1-point-WDC-title after that race. And I don't think they could have played the "play-for-the-win" strategy for this race...not with that low downforce set-up that his team ahd conjured up for him. Ferrari had them shaded in terms of race set-up at Interlagos.

Anyways...why spoil what we've just experienced? It was great racing...down to the last turn of the last lap of the last race of the season!

[ISLAMATRON]

I really felt bad for Massa's Family and fans , beacause at a point they were celebrating , and Glock was struggeling with Slicks in the wet and Hamilton went past him .Probably thats the moment that decided this years championship, Poor Massa won most of the races this season and yet not a champion .

The way I count it I saw Hamilton cross the finish line first 6 times(Austrailia, Monaco, Silverstone, Germany, SPA & China) and MAssa only finished 1st 5(Bahrain, Turkey, France, Valencia & Brazil). HAmilton is the rightful champion by any and all measures. I even think that if the championship was wrapped up after China(as it should have been without the FIA's interference on Ferrari's behalf in SPA) Hamilton would have won this round as well. McLaren's overly cautious approach to this Grand Prix surely cost them at least a couple positions.

[shir0]

"Then Nakajima and I finished off our crashing love affair, and he took off my front corner." - DC

Put this guy on the BBC F1 coverage NOW!

Now that'll add character to BBC's F1 coverage! He explains on-track-foul-ups (especially his) beautifully!

Although, I have to say, I can't stand Scottish accent. It's not discrimination on my part and i apologize for sounding that way. I guess it's just down to how my genes have programmed my brain on how to percieve that kind of accent. It's like, scratching nails on the black board or a hand rubbing an inflated balloon.

[ISLAMATRON]

I hate it, I wish he was fighting for the win, rather then running thru the motions trying to maintain position in forth.... This points racing is crap and it shortchanges the fans... I want to see all the drivers all out all the time, balls to the wall. Points racing is for suckas!... the regs need to change, driver with the most wins should be WDC... point blank period.

EH??! If what you wished for had been the case this 2008 season, your LH God would not be all-jumping-happy-while-squeezing-Nicole's-racks-flat because of his 1-point-WDC-title after that race. And I don't think they could have played the "play-for-the-win" strategy for this race...not with that low downforce set-up that his team ahd conjured up for him. Ferrari had them shaded in terms of race set-up at Interlagos.

Anyways...why spoil what we've just experienced? It was great racing...down to the last turn of the last lap of the last race of the season!

Great racing for 5th place? I guess thats like when those NAscar boys say "wow I definatly had a top 25 car today"... you may be happy with 5th place but some others aim for excellance, win all the time everytime in dominating fashion. Not limp home in fifth place. And I still contend that if a winningest driver takes all format was in place the spineless stewards at SPA would not have had the balls to overturn a race finish as they did.

[panchito401]

Full disclosure: I'm a tifosi and have been for 40+ years.

Each of the two contenders -- Massa and Hamilton -- had to accomplish a difficult but straight forward task:

1) Massa had to win the race; drive mistake free on track and in the pits, and he had to do so in wet conditions, where he has proven (Silverstone) to be more than a little inconsistent

Massa succeeded completely. A great drive in every way. =D>

2) In the closing stages, Hamilton had to do ONE thing to win the WDC - he had to hold off Vettel, then failing to do so, pass Vettel. Hamilton failed. He won the WDC, NOT through his own efforts, but through Glock's failure.

Hamilton deserved the WDC =D>, he broke no rules, did not cheat, did not drive carelessly or dangerously. But the way he won the championship - through Glock - leaves a bitter taste.

I'll start out by saying that I'm not really that passionate about any one team or driver anymore, I just love the sport - mostly the technology I guess.

I agree with just about all of what you usually post, but to say that glock has you left with a bitter taste I think is a bit unwarranted. Both teams have had their share of hiccups throughout the season. Glock didn't have anything to do with Massas refueling mishap, or his numerous spins in the wet. Glock didnt have anything to do with the Ferrari engine letting him down 3 laps from a victory. Glock didn't have anything to do with Massa being #2 to Raikkonen to start the season. Massa just plain outclassing the reigning world champion - in a ferrari pulling no punches about team orders no less - to take the #1 spot is a great achievement to begin with.

If you take a look at the lap times on the last lap, you will see that Glock and Trulli (the only cars in the top 10 with dry tires fixed) both ran 1:44's. To say that glock failed is a bit harsh. He took the gamble to climb the grid and he lost. If he did take wet tires like anyone else, Glock would be nowhere near P5 Vettel or Hamilton. I actually think its the other way around. If Glock wanted to hand Hamilton the championship on a silver platter, he would've stopped for tires.

I think once you let it sink in a bit (trust me, I can't believe the last 45 seconds of this race either!) you'll be a bit more objective. Hamilton did not win the championship on the last corner to one driver, or even in the last race. You win a championship over the course of the whole season. Unfortunately for Massa, he drove a great season but came up a hair short over the entire schedule.

I guess I also don't agree with your criticism of Speed TV coverage either! I think those guys are great. You've got bob the professional, david hobbs is pretty funny most of the time, and matchet brings a bit of the technical side to light for the newcomers, although I think he's missing out that the majority of the audience already knows most of his stuff. I think windsor is pretty funny as well and kinda ties it all together because he's actually at the race. To each his own I guess.

-f

[andartop]

For all the "what if scenario" lovers out there, some simple mathematics:

LH 10+2+4+6+10+10+10+2+6+4+4+10+2=80
FM 10+6+10+4+2+10+4+10+10+1+6+10=83

(PS for all the moaners: based on official results)

[ernos5]

For all the "what if scenario" lovers out there, some simple mathematics:

LH 10+2+4+6+10+10+10+2+6+4+4+10+2=80
FM 10+6+10+4+2+10+4+10+10+1+6+10=83

(PS for all the moaners: based on official results)

=D> =D> =D> =D>

for all you people out there that are like "omg hamilton he's so good, he deserved it blah blah blah" just keep starring at the above post, one day u'll come to ur senses

[monkeyboy1976]

Despite all of the waffle and in depth analysis going on in this thread about "what if"s and "if only"s, the only conclusion I can come to is that F1 is something we all dearly love and have great passion for. We all have our favourites and quite rightly also shout out when justice is not seen to be done.
There's nothing in the race in Brazil that suggests foul play, that is for sure. The result is as it is and everyone must accept that. What has happened earlier in the season is done and closed. The result stands.
You only need to look at poor old Felipe to really see how to deal with a situation such as this. He is the one who has sat in that car, focussed his mind and body to the maximum and dug deeply into his heart and given everything to live his dream. In the end, he lost out. And all he does is accept it. "That's racing" he said. The one guy who this means the most too has reacted with the uttmost dignity. He is an example for all us to follow and true sporting gentleman. I think we can all learn a lot from the young fella.
When balanced against his reaction, in the actual moment, to all that has gone on, quite frankly, some of the comments here are worthless.

Enjoy Formula One for what is. Be greatful that we have the opportunity to witness feats of bravery, skill and pure passion from all involved (including the 1000s of people who design and develop these feats engineering excellence). The people such as Tomba and Principessa that give a large part of their lives to bring us this story should also be congratulted. Without them, we'd miss out on all of it.

With now at least 5 drivers and 4 teams capable of winning in the seaons to come, F1 is entering a golden age. Cheer for who you want. Boo who want. Just remember that's it's ultimately F1 we all love (if you are true fan) and the drama and intrigue is what makes it great.

[ben_watkins]

For all the whingers... Just take a leaf out of Massa's book..

"We finished in front and we have to be very proud of that but unfortunately we missed [the championship] by one point.

"But that's racing - we need to be proud of our job, our race, our championship.

"We need to congratulate Lewis because he did a great championship and he scored more points than us, so he deserves to be champion.

"I know how to lose and I know how to win and it is another day of my life from which I am going to learn a lot."

[from BBC Sport http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 705310.stm]

Massa did a great job but is graceious in defeat. Congrats to both him and Lewis Hamilton for being great race drivers this season. =D> =D>

[axle]

For all the whingers... Just take a leaf out of Massa's book..

"We finished in front and we have to be very proud of that but unfortunately we missed [the championship] by one point.

"But that's racing - we need to be proud of our job, our race, our championship.

"We need to congratulate Lewis because he did a great championship and he scored more points than us, so he deserves to be champion.

"I know how to lose and I know how to win and it is another day of my life from which I am going to learn a lot."

[from BBC Sport http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 705310.stm]

Massa did a great job but is graceious in defeat. Congrats to both him and Lewis Hamilton for being great race drivers this season. =D> =D>

Indeed it seems that Massa is the best loser around. He might have tried it on on the track but off it he's been reasonably well behaved and polite about his opponent.

I hate what if arguments...what if Spa blah blah what if old points system blah blah...what if the moon crashed into the earth blah blah... it's over.

The driver that won the championship in its current guise was Hamilton, with arguably an inferior car to the F2008. Massa is damned quick and it's been a great battle.

[tinhouse]

Massa did a great job but is graceious in defeat. Congrats to both him and Lewis Hamilton for being great race drivers this season. =D> =D>

+1 for that. Massa has been the very model of dignity and sportmanship. He drover a perfect weekend and it must have been crushing to have spent about half aminute thinking it had paid off, only to have it whisked away.

I also agree that the thing we can agree on is that we're all passionate about tis sport, and the outlook is great. There are now three drivers on the grid who have proved that they can be world champion, plus Massa who I'd now love to see get his due at some point and at least two others I'd be happy to venture could take the title too. That has to be great for our sport.

Roll on next season!

Matt.

[axle]

Indeed - I think F1 had some deadwood in terms of drivers, but in 2 seasons a whole new group have joined an IMO overall are a success.

Without a stellar, enthusiastic, driven year in 2009, Button could well end up on the deadwood list.

[G-Rock]

Helloooooo!!
I've been looking at all the sports networks this morning and no one has mentioned Vettel.
I think he is more than worth mentioning since he passed Hamilton on the last few laps of the race, taking the championship away from Lewis. His pass of the Hamilton was more significant than anything else that happened in Brazil, more so than Glock losing grip on the last corner.
It was pure brilliance, a Toro Rosso passing a Mclaren and maybe a foreshadowing for next year.
Vettel took some sheen off Hamiltons championship victory and I'm sure it will be talked about in the near future.