2019 Russian Grand Prix - Sochi Autodrom, 27 - 29 September

[dans79]

Perhaps it's the track that should be changed rather than the rules...

People always avoid that, I always want to change the rules,or come up with other gimmicks.

[Restomaniac]

You can tell it's a boring race with nothing other than some intra-team arguments, when people spend several pages arguing about whether a random rule is fair and/or should be changed.

Perhaps it's the track that should be changed rather than the rules...

Its also strange how posters who failed to mention it before suddenly find it upsetting when they had no problem with it previously.

That is something I try my best not to do. If I dislike something I dislike it consistently.

[zibby43]

MAN WITH BIGGEST HEART BREAK TODAY, IS "PAUL DI RESTA". That guy was so angry when VSC happened.

To then go and put up a smiling face for the interviews, is oh my god. I love that.

Post of the day.

What is his deal? I just started noticing his almost weekly digs (some subtle, others not so much) at Merc this season.

[notsofast]

I was never a Vettel fan. I'm sure he's a nice guy off the track, but the Finger and "that's what I'm talking about" kind of ruined it for me. However, the last two races I find myself on Vettel's side. If you have the chance to go P1, why wouldn't you go for it? If the plan was otherwise, but your team mate isn't challenging you (with his car, not with his mouth), then why feel sorry for being in P1? It's racing.

The whole notion of giving up a 2+ second lead when differences are measured in tenths is ridiculous. I understand the "dirty air" bit, but if you believe you're faster, you should at least be able to get within DRS range. If LEC had done that, Vettel would most likely have let him through.

By the way, Schuttelberg, where are you? We miss you.

[F1NAC]

Close the pitlane during VSC.. Amen

Driver: "i think I have a puncture, picked up some of Romain's debris"

Engineer: "well, yeah, sorry, we can't pit you while the safety car is out. Hang on for a few laps!"

There is an obvious issue with this idea, I'd say.

Red light at the end of the pitlane. Till whole pack passes

[Jolle]

I was never a Vettel fan. I'm sure he's a nice guy off the track, but the Finger and "that's what I'm talking about" kind of ruined it for me. However, the last two races I find myself on Vettel's side. If you have the chance to go P1, why wouldn't you go for it? If the plan was otherwise, but your team mate isn't challenging you (with his car, not with his mouth), then why feel sorry for being in P1? It's racing.

The whole notion of giving up a 2+ second lead when differences are measured in tenths is ridiculous. I understand the "dirty air" bit, but if you believe you're faster, you should at least be able to get within DRS range. If LEC had done that, Vettel would most likely have let him through.

By the way, Schuttelberg, where are you? We miss you.

Well, the laps Vettel got the call "let Charles go by", the gap was between 1.1 and 1.3 seconds, with jumps to 1.7. Just at the point not to overheat everything. Only later when they got the call "we swap later in the race", the gap increased, probably because Leclerc got the call that he would have to go longer on his tires.

Next time, Leclerc won't give Vettel any room at the start, he cannot be trusted with arrangements made prior to the race. Very bad for the team. from now on they will operate as two different teams at important moments.

[Edax]

Can’t really blame Vettel. If this was the arrangement it would be stupid to do it when Leclerc was asking it. If Leclerc and Vettel were 6 seconds loose from the rest of the field then of course it would be a different story. Vettels request to first make a gap for him was entirely justifiable. But as it was, Leclerc was not able to create a gap between him and Hamilton to put Vettel in and Vettel was simply driving away from Leclerc.

Even the way they solved in the end was pretty stupid Imho. They slowed Vettel down by not taking him in for another lap when his rears went off. But in doing so they gave away a gap that could have survived the VSC stop by hamilton. Of course this becomes a moot point due to the Kers failure, but strategy wise it would have never been a good idea.

I think Leclerc should concentrate more on driving fast and less on having arguments with the team on the radio. I feel it is distracting to a point where Ferrari is more occupied with mental coaching of its drivers than with winning races.

[Shrieker]

So a driver gets a puncture in the incident and he has to go around and around the track dropping rubber and carbon fibre everywhere because he can’t enter the pits?

When's the last time you've seen that ? Surely there can be an exception for that.

Drivers get punctures from collisions all the time. What about if a driver loses a front wing?

Also I like that you think it’s ok to stop 1 thing that you think is unfair in this race situation (pitting under the VSC) even thought it could directly cause another (stopping drivers doing their scheduled stop) with a lovely easy line of ‘but still’. How about everyone just stops bitching because something effects their team/driver when they seemed to be mute when it favoured them.

You know I'm a Hamilton fan like you don't you

When's the last time you've seen someone pick a puncture right before sc/vsc that would've prevented them from pitting if the pits had to be closed was what I meant, as that was what you were alluding to. By the way you can already find exceptions in the rules regarding damage and/or safety; parc ferme rules for example.

[Restomaniac]

When's the last time you've seen that ? Surely there can be an exception for that.

Drivers get punctures from collisions all the time. What about if a driver loses a front wing?

Also I like that you think it’s ok to stop 1 thing that you think is unfair in this race situation (pitting under the VSC) even thought it could directly cause another (stopping drivers doing their scheduled stop) with a lovely easy line of ‘but still’. How about everyone just stops bitching because something effects their team/driver when they seemed to be mute when it favoured them.

You know I'm a Hamilton fan like you don't you

When's the last time you've seen someone pick a puncture right before sc/vsc that would've prevented them from pitting if the pits had to be closed was what I meant, as that was what you were alluding to. By the way you can already find exceptions in the rules regarding damage and/or safety; parc ferme rules for example.

I don’t understand the point you are making. Collisions often lead to punctures it happens all the time. Collisions also often lead to SC and VSC. A closed pit lane then causes issues.

I just think you are looking for an issue when there are far greater problems. This conversation started after a whiny bitch on Sky started crying. It’s happened numerous times before and nobody has said a god damn word. Yet suddenly now it’s an issue.

[Mamba]

funny this whole discussion about the vsc and sc was actually cause by a ferrari itself, maybe ferrari should have got VET not to cause it.
Oh but ofcourse VET is first he cant go into next race with a penalty! that team will need to really think who they back next season because VET isnt delivering

And what good will come from it? What if they are in good shape at Suzuka too? Then one car starting a five or so places back will be no good.

Also, what happened today shows exactly what happens if the team choose to back one driver over the other. Chaos! Ferrari need a firm word with their drivers and Leclerc and in a way Vettel too needs to understand that after lights out it is racing. Part of racing is slip streaming and better starts etc. The team can take over after the first few laps in order to maximise their end result. At this rate we will end up with either one or both Red cars crashed out very soon.

[Restomaniac]

funny this whole discussion about the vsc and sc was actually cause by a ferrari itself, maybe ferrari should have got VET not to cause it.
Oh but ofcourse VET is first he cant go into next race with a penalty! that team will need to really think who they back next season because VET isnt delivering

And what good will come from it? What if they are in good shape at Suzuka too? Then one car starting a five or so places back will be no good.

Also, what happened today shows exactly what happens if the team choose to back one driver over the other. Chaos! Ferrari need a firm word with their drivers and Leclerc and in a way Vettel too needs to understand that after lights out it is racing. Part of racing is slip streaming and better starts etc. The team can take over after the first few laps in order to maximise their end result. At this rate we will end up with either one or both Red cars crashed out very soon.

Exactly. That was why I mentioned Vettel Vs Webber.
It’s go all the Hallmarks. The team didn’t control the situation, the drivers didn’t trust each other, gloves were off, etc.

[iotar__]

Commentator's (whoever that was) justification for bizarre Ferrari team orders: "Vettel had a tow so it's only fair" Huh Stupid idea or not points below still apply to TO situation:

A. He was third
B. Overtook Hamilton
C. Then overtook Leclerc
D. Had a better start, nothing to do with a tow, sod earning anything in F1, can't start well to save your life, here's candy of team orders. BTW you can have a bad start starting third and no tow will help if you lose positions
E. There was nothing stopping Leclerc from starting third and getting the lead through magical tow thus avoiding TO I guess? Or starting well enough and keeping the lead from pole because:
F. Tow does not equal two overtakes and the lead, sod earning anything in F1.

Ferrari created this whole team orders mess by themselves .

[TAG]

With the 1-2 today and Ferrari's one DNF, Mercedes actually gave themselves a shot at clinching their 6th world title in Suzuka. They'd have to outscore Ferrari by 10 or more points.

[drunkf1fan]

Commentator's (whoever that was) justification for bizarre Ferrari team orders: "Vettel had a tow so it's only fair" Huh Stupid idea or not points below still apply to TO situation:

A. He was third
B. Overtook Hamilton
C. Then overtook Leclerc
D. Had a better start, nothing to do with a tow, sod earning anything in F1, can't start well to save your life, here's candy of team orders. BTW you can have a bad start starting third and no tow will help if you lose positions
E. There was nothing stopping Leclerc from starting third and getting the lead through magical tow thus avoiding TO I guess? Or starting well enough and keeping the lead from pole because:
F. Tow does not equal two overtakes and the lead, sod earning anything in F1.

Ferrari created this whole team orders mess by themselves .

Yes, when Leclerc braked pretty early and stayed wide and left the door wide open, it was all about Vettel being stronger and having a better start. Also a tow helps in every decent length run down to T1 but apparently it had no effect in this race alone because... you say so?

If Leclerc moves across immediately then Hamilton gets the tow early, he has higher speed, he's closer to Leclerc and if Leclerc stays right and defends hard then Vettel doesn't just take first place. If he wants to go for first he's got to go deep, brake late and on the outside and as we saw all weekend and the last several seasons, that would usually lead to him going off track.

But just ignore that Leclerc stayed left, gave a perfect tow and stayed in the worst possible position to defend his lead against vettel and let him by with absolutely zero defence.

Vettel wasn't even ahead in braking, he only got ahead on corner exit. Now imagine Leclerc is on the inside with Vettel on the outside, but even further back with no tow at all.

Yes, two does equal massive help, tow is exceptionally strong at the start and always has been and the longer the run to the first braking zone the more important it is.

Or are you going to completely ignore that Sainz was also far closer to Leclerc and Hamilton, the guys without a tow, would normally be?

[AJI]

Why not have a rule that states you can’t touch the car the first 7seconds- when stationary in the pit, during a VSC?

This way you can still pit during a VSC, but it will be a bit like a ‘stop & go’ penalty.

I like this, but it should only apply to cars which are of German origin, or Grosjean's car, because I don't like him