2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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FittingMechanics
FittingMechanics
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Great result for the team. This weekend shows the team is coming together, they went in the wrong direction on Friday, made an analysis and moved in the right direction on Saturday, qualified almost the best they can (P7 and P9) and in the race ended up P6 and P8 even though SC/VSC came out at the worse moment for them. You know the team is doing well when they can recover after a really bad friday to end up best of the rest. Imagine what could have been if they nailed the setup on Friday.

One thing that is slightly disappointing to see is that the McLaren is still in the "don't fight the top 3" mode, pretty much anyone from top 3 if they come close, McLaren focuses on not losing time to guys behind them. It's a bit sad to see, but hopefully this will change as they catch up. Sainz told on Sky that he thinks they need about 0.5s to be able to defend against top teams, say they are about 1.5s behind Merc on race pace, but with 0.5s more pace they could defend in these kind of situations.

About Honda and Renault, we all remember that Red Bull was winning with Renault (and passing factory Renaults and McLarens) and it can pass us this year as well. It doesn't mean that the Honda is a better engine, just shows that Red Bull is a really good car.

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
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Joined: 10 Mar 2019, 03:54

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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FittingMechanics wrote:Great result for the team. This weekend shows the team is coming together, they went in the wrong direction on Friday, made an analysis and moved in the right direction on Saturday, qualified almost the best they can (P7 and P9) and in the race ended up P6 and P8 even though SC/VSC came out at the worse moment for them. You know the team is doing well when they can recover after a really bad friday to end up best of the rest. Imagine what could have been if they nailed the setup on Friday.

One thing that is slightly disappointing to see is that the McLaren is still in the "don't fight the top 3" mode, pretty much anyone from top 3 if they come close, McLaren focuses on not losing time to guys behind them. It's a bit sad to see, but hopefully this will change as they catch up. Sainz told on Sky that he thinks they need about 0.5s to be able to defend against top teams, say they are about 1.5s behind Merc on race pace, but with 0.5s more pace they could defend in these kind of situations.

About Honda and Renault, we all remember that Red Bull was winning with Renault (and passing factory Renaults and McLarens) and it can pass us this year as well. It doesn't mean that the Honda is a better engine, just shows that Red Bull is a really good car.
In regards to them not fighting the top 3... Sometimes you have to understand who you are fighting against... The team won’t achieve third position and achieving 4th isn’t secure yet and that’s still a “soft target” for the team.

If they try to maintain position against the top 3, they run the risk of not only losing pace at the end of the race due to damaging their tires (you are braking later, getting more wheel spin out of corners in an effort to maintain distance to your opponents and consuming more fuel)... You will also probably add additional stress to the engine and batteries by running in higher modes to defend the position... Which you could ultimately lose due to the pace difference.

Not fighting the top 3 isn’t a matter of lack of ambition on their behalf, is acknowledging the pace differential and playing the smart game and achieving the maximum amount of points.

You nailed on the situation between the Renault and Honda engines... The reason why the top 3 can make a pass with ease on the midfield, isn’t due to a difference in power from the units, it’s the difference in the chassis performance... With more efficient downforce, not only do they run lesser amount of drag, they also have the capability to be closer to the car in front before the straights, making DRS more efficient and a secure weapon to use... In Russia, the difference in performance out of S3 shows why for teams like RBR was “easy” to make a pass on the like of Mclaren (in addition to Mclaren not necessarily fighting to keep the position).


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gokarter
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Its good to see some mclaren fans seeing the truth, that mclaren never had a top 3 car for so many years, next year let see if they have progressed but to be honest 2021 rules change is required to bring them to catching distance to top 3. I am not suprised mercedes said yes to mclaren supply 2021,becuase they dont believe mclaren can provide a good car to compete with mercedes. pretty clear

SmallSoldier
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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gokarter wrote:Its good to see some mclaren fans seeing the truth, that mclaren never had a top 3 car for so many years, next year let see if they have progressed but to be honest 2021 rules change is required to bring them to catching distance to top 3. I am not suprised mercedes said yes to mclaren supply 2021,becuase they dont believe mclaren can provide a good car to compete with mercedes. pretty clear
Well, we will never know how good the McLaren cars where from 2015 to 2017, the only thing we know for sure is that the engine they had was pretty poor, both in terms of performance and reliability... The fact that the 2018 car / chassis was flawed is in no way a representation of the performance of the cars that preceded it... If your comment wants to start a discussion in regards to the performance of the Honda PU during that stint, please don’t... Since it has nothing to do with the current car/team.

In regards to Mercedes, I would be very surprised if they would be underestimating McLaren, an smart operation like Mercedes will never give something for granted, especially with such a big regulation change incoming... Having a team like McLaren, which is now starting to improve their performer is good for their brand... Better than having it associated with Racing Point or Williams... It also allows Mercedes to avoid having to supply RBR if Honda decides not to continue (so far they haven’t confirmed their commitment beyond 2020).


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gokarter
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Well, we will never know how good the McLaren cars where from 2015 to 2017, the only thing we know for sure is that the engine they had was pretty poor, both in terms of performance and reliability... The fact that the 2018 car / chassis was flawed is in no way a representation of the performance of the cars that preceded it... If your comment wants to start a discussion in regards to the performance of the Honda PU during that stint, please don’t... Since it has nothing to do with the current car/team.

In regards to Mercedes, I would be very surprised if they would be underestimating McLaren, an smart operation like Mercedes will never give something for granted, especially with such a big regulation change incoming... Having a team like McLaren, which is now starting to improve their performer is good for their brand... Better than having it associated with Racing Point or Williams... It also allows Mercedes to avoid having to supply RBR if Honda decides not to continue (so far they haven’t confirmed their commitment beyond 2020).

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Oh yes ,we very well know mclaren had a average cars from 2015 to 2017 so did the engine. Isn't it clear Mercedes are not afraid of a mclaren supply tell you something. They Mclaren dont have the technical expertise yet , maybe in future who knows. Can you imagine mercedes saying yes to Redbull. No way!. Mclaren and some of their fans are living in their past glory. feel bad for them. reality check mclaren is still not there and was not there for the past few years.#believeinmclaren should be changed to #mclarenbelievedintheirownhype and got exposed themselves

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zoroastar
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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gokarter wrote:
30 Sep 2019, 04:54
Well, we will never know how good the McLaren cars where from 2015 to 2017, the only thing we know for sure is that the engine they had was pretty poor, both in terms of performance and reliability... The fact that the 2018 car / chassis was flawed is in no way a representation of the performance of the cars that preceded it... If your comment wants to start a discussion in regards to the performance of the Honda PU during that stint, please don’t... Since it has nothing to do with the current car/team.

In regards to Mercedes, I would be very surprised if they would be underestimating McLaren, an smart operation like Mercedes will never give something for granted, especially with such a big regulation change incoming... Having a team like McLaren, which is now starting to improve their performer is good for their brand... Better than having it associated with Racing Point or Williams... It also allows Mercedes to avoid having to supply RBR if Honda decides not to continue (so far they haven’t confirmed their commitment beyond 2020).

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Oh yes ,we very well know mclaren had a average cars from 2015 to 2017 so did the engine. Isn't it clear Mercedes are not afraid of a mclaren supply tell you something. They Mclaren dont have the technical expertise yet , maybe in future who knows. Can you imagine mercedes saying yes to Redbull. No way!. Mclaren and some of their fans are living in their past glory. feel bad for them. reality check mclaren is still not there and was not there for the past few years.#believeinmclaren should be changed to #mclarenbelievedintheirownhype and got exposed themselves
i remember that at the end of 2017 alonso was fighting to pass massa's williams, while defending against perez in brasil. honda had finally given them an update that would last an entire race. even though the honda was still down at least 80hp on the mercedes PU.

the truth is that you dont have any idea what you are talking about, and you are basing your opinions on what you want to believe. the only thing you can say for certain is that honda was a really bad PU from 2015-2017, but you wont mention that. hell, it wasnt even hondas fault really.

toto, mclaren, and especially you, have no idea what is going to happen after the regs change, and team spending is leveled out after 2021. so futuristic "brand beating" shouldnt even be part of this discussion.

geogate
geogate
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Joined: 29 Nov 2014, 02:25

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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those look like troll comments to me - get a life fella

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proteus
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Joined: 13 Feb 2015, 14:35

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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And Honda jet again managed to crawl back to this thread...some people just cant let it go...how long will it take for someone to mention his hopes of Alonso coming back i wonder...
If i would get the money to start my own F1 team, i would revive Arrows

FittingMechanics
FittingMechanics
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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SmallSoldier wrote:
30 Sep 2019, 01:34
In regards to them not fighting the top 3... Sometimes you have to understand who you are fighting against... The team won’t achieve third position and achieving 4th isn’t secure yet and that’s still a “soft target” for the team.

If they try to maintain position against the top 3, they run the risk of not only losing pace at the end of the race due to damaging their tires (you are braking later, getting more wheel spin out of corners in an effort to maintain distance to your opponents and consuming more fuel)... You will also probably add additional stress to the engine and batteries by running in higher modes to defend the position... Which you could ultimately lose due to the pace difference.

Not fighting the top 3 isn’t a matter of lack of ambition on their behalf, is acknowledging the pace differential and playing the smart game and achieving the maximum amount of points.
I know the reason they do it, and I understand it. I just find it a bit sad to see. Problem is that the rules are made that way, tires are designed to fall apart and are hard to maintain in the operating window, while pushing the engine makes you take penalties. All of this means that if you are a slower car, usually you cannot push as hard as you'd want to or you risk losing more places than one.

Hopefully McLaren can make a step ahead next year allowing them some breathing room to fight the top 3 when they get the chance. As a fan I want to see them fighting with the top 3, not just doing damage limitation.

M840TR
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Quickest pit-stop of the race.

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f1rules
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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i dont know how accurate this is, and in spanish so used translate,

https://extraconfidencial.com/noticias/ ... motorista/

geogate
geogate
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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f1rules wrote:
30 Sep 2019, 10:44
i dont know how accurate this is, and in spanish so used translate,

https://extraconfidencial.com/noticias/ ... motorista/
quite difficult to read, but got the gist ... possible i guess that Singapore gave Mclaren a heads up on how much power Renault were getting, but I think a bit recent for that to have been the underlying cause. One would think negotiations had been ongoing a while

PowerandtheGlory
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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The article seems to suggest that Renault 'works' team are somehow not supplying the same PU or software to Mclaren as they are getting. And this is the reason they have moved to Merc. Either way, the merc engine is powerful and reliable so its a sideways step for Mclaren rather than a real step forward. Next year's car with the Renault engine is promised to be the real deal, so we will see what they can produce- but its not for lacking HP at the moment. Mclaren have a good race car, whose only weakness seems to be Quali and very low DF tracks like Canada and Monza Spa where the Works renault team seem to catch up. Other than that it seems to be another step forward. I feel as though Zak brown always wanted the Prestige of the Merc Brand over Renault as it helps them globally, i will miss the way he says 'Renault' with the american accent though.. :)
“I don't believe in luck, luck is preparation and taking your opportunity” Ross Brawn

Ground Effect
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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So, what they’re saying is that there was more to the performance difference between Renault and McLaren than just downforce levels?
Q: (Stefano Mancini – La Stampa) Kimi, will you help Vettel to win his championship this year?
Kimi Raikkonen: I can only drive one car, obviously. 
@2018 Singapore Grand Prix drivers press conference.

Ground Effect
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Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Does anybody know/have any post race interviews with Lando, Carlos, Seidl etc?
Q: (Stefano Mancini – La Stampa) Kimi, will you help Vettel to win his championship this year?
Kimi Raikkonen: I can only drive one car, obviously. 
@2018 Singapore Grand Prix drivers press conference.