Ferrari Power Unit Hardware & Software

[Mamba]

My guess is that Ferrari ran more DF (and thus drag) than before. They gained speed in corners and lost speed on the straights. They still had the edge in qualy, but it was a lot less topspeed wise.

I still feel people think that the speed advantage is only engine dependant, but i'd rather say it's the combination of a engine qualy mode and an aero efficient car with less peak-DF than the competitors (especially merc). Remember that drag increases exponentially with speed. A few extra hp won't get you 20kph in qualy, but less drag will...

A sensible comment!

Binotto himself confirmed that they tried to increase downforce a bit more for this track to lose less in the corners. So top speed will be down if you suddenly increase your DF levels. Racefans is usually a very good site but that article is being thrown around like they caught Ferrari cheating. Straight line speed is hardly proof of anything considering all the factors that influence it.

If one were to actually look tyres were their reason for an terrible race. You can have a monster engine but if the tyres don't work you are nowhere (see Haas). We know Ferrari have a massively complex hydraulic rear suspension so that could have taken them in the wrong direction for the race to manage tyres.

Let's have at least one more race to see how they perform before everybody starts either calling them cheats or bringing back the Ferrari International Assistance bull twang.

[RZS10]

One comment by Binotto i found quite odd was that they supposedly did not even have enough time to concern themselves with the TD so they couldn't have reacted to it anyways, that they still have to have a closer look at it.

Wouldn't any team have their engineers, lawyers and engineer-lawyers right on the case to see whether they might be running something that could be disallowed via TD? (unless you know it's about part X and you know you're not doing anything funky with/or surrounding X)

[Mamba]

One comment by Binotto i found quite odd was that they supposedly did not even have enough time to concern themselves with the TD so they couldn't have reacted to it anyways, that they still have to have a closer look at it.

Wouldn't any team have their engineers, lawyers and engineer-lawyers right on the case to see whether they might be running something that could be disallowed via TD?

That was perhaps a strange comment. My guess is that they glanced at it and saw the TD did not affect them if they are operating in a grey area. But one would think it they would have fine combed it. I guess it just shows they are confident whatever they are doing it is legal.

[SuperCNJ]

If I was Ferrari, after yesterday's FIA directives, I would definitely use less power purposely in the remaining GP's just to trick the opponents into thinking that this was what made them fast.

I don't see why that would be of benefit to them really. Firstly, if it's not the reason why they are fast, then why penalise yourself unnecessarily, potentially sacrificing wins in doing so. Secondly, by not using it, you are depriving yourself of valuable data which will help with its development.

[LM10]

If I was Ferrari, after yesterday's FIA directives, I would definitely use less power purposely in the remaining GP's just to trick the opponents into thinking that this was what made them fast.

I don't see why that would be of benefit to them really. Firstly, if it's not the reason why they are fast, then why penalise yourself unnecessarily, potentially sacrificing wins in doing so. Secondly, by not using it, you are depriving yourself of valuable data which will help with its development.

The reason is pretty straightforward: By not using it you will make all others think that this directive made you lose speed.
On the other hand, if you keep using it, the opponents either will come up with a protest and make the FIA entirely investigate the case and possibly leak some data to others or the opponents will then know that your secret isn’t fuel flow related and will erase that from their list of options. Their next steps then will be to further look into other possibilities of where Ferrari’s speed might come from. This way you make it easier for your opponents on their journey finding out.
If you make them believe that it’s this directive, they will scratch their heads after winter break when you appear with the same speed.

[zibby43]

One comment by Binotto i found quite odd was that they supposedly did not even have enough time to concern themselves with the TD so they couldn't have reacted to it anyways, that they still have to have a closer look at it.

Wouldn't any team have their engineers, lawyers and engineer-lawyers right on the case to see whether they might be running something that could be disallowed via TD? (unless you know it's about part X and you know you're not doing anything funky with/or surrounding X)

Read my mind. Just a bizarre comment.

On a side note, from AMuS:

Red Bull and Mercedes have also discovered other peculiarities at Ferrari together. For example, with the exception of Monte Carlo and Budapest, Ferrari drove extremely slow laps on the grid. So slowly that the drivers were unable to gain any knowledge about the car's balance and grip.

Mercedes and Red Bull concluded that Ferrari had to store fuel in order to use it profitably later. It was not until the GP Mexico that Ferrari stopped this strange procedure. Also in Austin only one of a total of four laps of the two drivers was remarkably slow.

[gruntguru]

The one thing I do not understand here is why RBR "went public" instead of using it themselves?

It would probably require a lot of effort and take some time to make up the difference. Besides - they probably weren't 100% sure this is the loophole. Easiest course of action - close the loophole - instant result.

[Alexf1]

The one thing I do not understand here is why RBR "went public" instead of using it themselves?

It would probably require a lot of effort and take some time to make up the difference. Besides - they probably weren't 100% sure this is the loophole. Easiest course of action - close the loophole - instant result.

Honda didnt want to. In the Autosport podcast its mentioned that Tanabe said they were uncomfortable with the situation and wanted it to be clarified first because they want to compete in a legal and fair way.

[izzy]

apparently Red Bull asked some time ago and FIA sat on it:

The request has been around for some time, but because we did not hear from the FIA, we have intensified it now."

[RZS10]

that's old news ... back on october 17th someone (probably RBR) leaked to the media that the FIA was not answering requests for clarification and told the teams to protest ... page 249 here

[wuzak]

The one thing I do not understand here is why RBR "went public" instead of using it themselves?

It would probably require a lot of effort and take some time to make up the difference. Besides - they probably weren't 100% sure this is the loophole. Easiest course of action - close the loophole - instant result.

Except there never was any loophole.

Cheating the sensor is clearly banned in the regulations.

[wuzak]

On a side note, from AMuS:

Red Bull and Mercedes have also discovered other peculiarities at Ferrari together. For example, with the exception of Monte Carlo and Budapest, Ferrari drove extremely slow laps on the grid. So slowly that the drivers were unable to gain any knowledge about the car's balance and grip.

Mercedes and Red Bull concluded that Ferrari had to store fuel in order to use it profitably later. It was not until the GP Mexico that Ferrari stopped this strange procedure. Also in Austin only one of a total of four laps of the two drivers was remarkably slow.

Which is odd, since Ferrari did not have control of the speed of the formation lap except several races since the mid-season break.

There were also races where the Mercedes cars were slow on the formation lap.

The speed of the formation lap can be explained by a desire to not sit on the grid for too long. Faster formation laps tend to spread the field out more.

Also, the advantage of the Ferraris is most pronounced in qualifying, and they never seemed particularly slow in doing their out-laps. Mercedes, on the other hand....

[GhostF1]

On a side note, from AMuS:

Red Bull and Mercedes have also discovered other peculiarities at Ferrari together. For example, with the exception of Monte Carlo and Budapest, Ferrari drove extremely slow laps on the grid. So slowly that the drivers were unable to gain any knowledge about the car's balance and grip.

Mercedes and Red Bull concluded that Ferrari had to store fuel in order to use it profitably later. It was not until the GP Mexico that Ferrari stopped this strange procedure. Also in Austin only one of a total of four laps of the two drivers was remarkably slow.

Which is odd, since Ferrari did not have control of the speed of the formation lap except several races since the mid-season break.

There were also races where the Mercedes cars were slow on the formation lap.

The speed of the formation lap can be explained by a desire to not sit on the grid for too long. Faster formation laps tend to spread the field out more.

Also, the advantage of the Ferraris is most pronounced in qualifying, and they never seemed particularly slow in doing their out-laps. Mercedes, on the other hand....

Jesus... I hope this isn't true. Article is referring to free practice sessions, with most of them being in FP3..which to be honest, that adds more questions.. because FP3 has the race/quali engine fitted and then guess what else happens a few hours post FP3...
That also comfortably answers why it is only Quali they have this significant advantage.

I'm not about pointing fingers, but either there are massive coincidences on several fronts going on here or there is way more to the story.

[wuzak]

On a side note, from AMuS:

Red Bull and Mercedes have also discovered other peculiarities at Ferrari together. For example, with the exception of Monte Carlo and Budapest, Ferrari drove extremely slow laps on the grid. So slowly that the drivers were unable to gain any knowledge about the car's balance and grip.

Mercedes and Red Bull concluded that Ferrari had to store fuel in order to use it profitably later. It was not until the GP Mexico that Ferrari stopped this strange procedure. Also in Austin only one of a total of four laps of the two drivers was remarkably slow.

Which is odd, since Ferrari did not have control of the speed of the formation lap except several races since the mid-season break.

There were also races where the Mercedes cars were slow on the formation lap.

The speed of the formation lap can be explained by a desire to not sit on the grid for too long. Faster formation laps tend to spread the field out more.

Also, the advantage of the Ferraris is most pronounced in qualifying, and they never seemed particularly slow in doing their out-laps. Mercedes, on the other hand....

Jesus... I hope this isn't true. Article is referring to free practice sessions, with most of them being in FP3..which to be honest, that adds more questions.. because FP3 has the race/quali engine fitted and then guess what else happens a few hours post FP3...
That also comfortably answers why it is only Quali they have this significant advantage.

I'm not about pointing fingers, but either there are massive coincidences on several fronts going on here or there is way more to the story.

And why would they do this?

Where would they store the fuel, between the fuel flow sensor and the injectors without the FIA being able to detect it?

[zibby43]

Some details on the Technical Directive, via Mark Hughes:

Tec Directive 0035/19.

In response to Red Bull asking if it would be legal to run a pulsing electrical signal to interfere with the fuel flow meter so that in between the 2000Hertz frequency measuring points, it could momentarily (and repeatedly) exceed the nominal fuel flow regulation limit (sort of like momentarily doing 80mph in a 70mph limit but still staying within a 70mph limit as measured between two points).

The FIA said no TD 0035/19, citing the following regs.

5.10.3 All cars must be fitted with a single fuel flow sensor, wholly within the fuel tank, which has been manufactured by the FIA designated supplier to a specification determined by the FIA. This sensor may only be used as specified by the FIA. Furthermore, all fuel delivered to the power unit must pass through this homologated sensor, and must all be delivered to the combustion chambers by the fuel injectors described by article 5.10.2.

5.10.5 Any device, system or procedure the purpose and/or effect of which is to increase the flow rate or to store and recycle fuel after the measurement point is prohibited.