Zandvoort

[strad]

Zandvoort is going to have a banked oval style last corner..

As part of the plans to bring Zandvoort circuit up to scratch for the Dutch GP next year, the banking at its final corner will be made twice as steep as Indianapolis.
Zandvoort has confirmed that the banking at the final turn will be angled at 32% – the equivalent of 18 degrees. This is twice as steep as the Indianapolis track which hosted the United States Grand Prix from 2000-07 where the banking was around 9 degrees.
Romain Grosjean spoke earlier this year when his F1 future was in doubt about his fear of racing on ovals, citing it as a reason why he would be reluctant to race on such circuits in IndyCar, so this news may not go down well with him.
But, Zandvoort CEO Robert van Overdijk believes the banked final turn will prove to be the “most spectacular part” of the revamped circuit.

[Tim.Wright]

30% is massive. I hope someone told Pirelli about this a long time ago.

[strad]

Indy is 9° Talladega is 33° Daytona 31° and 18° in the tri-oval.....so 18° doesn't seem too outrageous to me.
Monza's old banking was 21°
I can't find the FIAs rules on track design but Road and Track mentions a 10° maximum for new tracks so they might have a problem with the proposed 18°.

[Rodak]

Speaking of banking..... Texas Motor Speedway for the 2001 CART race; banking of 24° on a 1.5 mile oval.

From Wiki:

The first serious concerns about driver safety occurred on Friday afternoon. CART medical affairs director Steve Olvey would later report that two drivers felt dizzy and disoriented after running their cars at over 230 mph (370 km/h), and that they felt they could not control their cars. The identities of the two drivers were not disclosed, but Tony Kanaan and Alex Zanardi later claimed they experienced the symptoms. Olvey later recalled that Max Papis was unable to tell the frontstretch from the backstretch when his crew told him to pit. Adrian Fernandez also reported to the media he was experiencing dizziness. Olvey said in his 25 years of working in motorsports, it was a problem he had never experienced.

Later, chief steward Chris Kneifel recalled that he had also heard reports about drivers feeling dizzy, with some saying they had lost their equilibrium after getting out of their cars. CART competition and PR chief Mike Zizzo said that the cars were going so fast that one could get dizzy just watching them roar around the track.

Kenny Bräck qualified for the pole position at an all-time official track record of 22.854 seconds (233.447 mph). Patrick Carpentier was second, and Oriol Servia third. Twenty-four of the twenty-five cars were over 226 mph (364 km/h), and the average speed for the field was 229.9 mph (370.0 km/h).

During qualifying, drivers were reporting 5 lateral Gs sustained for 14-18 of the 23 seconds per lap.

[Maplesoup]

Has pirelli not already protested this idea of banked corners. Doubt they've designed tyres with that in mind.

[Manoah2u]

they'll just make sure there'll be double yellow throughout the entire race or mandated pit limiter on

On a serious note: sounds exciting to me! This track sounds like it's gonna be pretty ballsy and spectacular.
But offcourse safety DOES need to be looked at, and if concerned, must be approached accordingly.

Expecting the bank to be implemented to make sure they can accelarate better, lateral load on the tire walls might raise some concerns. Then again, the corners just in front of the final corner take out a lot of speed, so i rather expect to not be such a high impact and rather allow cars to better prepare for a run for the straight.

More important would be how they'll implement the barriers, and also where they're gonna put areas to get the cars off the track if they've had a technical failure or malfunction.
nothing as annoying as too many VSC or SC sessions because of bad engineering.

[NL_Fer]

The corner before the banking is pretty slow and close. So they are not at 300 when going through the banking.

[RZS10]

So they're ruining the character of the (challenging) last corner ... with other cars it was hard to get right but almost full throttle was possible, in the2018 onboard video with Max at the wheel it was already close to full throttle in an old car - so what's the point of the banking? Just because it looks 'cool' ?

[mertol]

Almost flat out will prevent overtaking. Easily flat out is like extending the length of the straight. Zandvoort is seriously mickey mouse track. It's worse than hungary.

[RZS10]

Dunno ... pretty sure this was full throttle


I wrote 'close to' because he probably wasn't going all out.

Here's an older video


My main point however was that they're majorly changing the character of the track to suit F1, making it worse for every other racing series.

[Jolle]

Dunno ... pretty sure this was full throttle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Roznaae7J5M?t=77

I wrote 'close to' because he probably wasn't going all out.

Here's an older video
https://youtube.com/watch?v=2M0inetghnk?t=94

My main point however was that they're majorly changing the character of the track to suit F1, making it worse for every other racing series.

In a street car it's pretty challenging, but with a bit of downforce or even slick tires it's easy flat out. You set up your car for a maximum exit speed for Kumo (the corner before) and then power on until 100 meters before Tarzan.

[Capharol]

the most challenging point will be the wind and probably the possibillity of rain

[PlatinumZealot]

Sand fart.
Farting after skinny dipping at the beach.

Jokes aside the flow of the track looks sinuously perilous if that makes sense. But at least it flows. Seems quite narrow in some parts like RedBull ring. Might be difficult overtaking.

[mertol]

In the simulator, the overtaking is impossible unless someone makes a mistake. And not only with F1 cars, anything with a high level of downforce can't overtake. Maybe the banking will help.

[Jolle]

In the simulator, the overtaking is impossible unless someone makes a mistake. And not only with F1 cars, anything with a high level of downforce can't overtake. Maybe the banking will help.

In real life, overtaking at Zandvoort is very difficult. Tarzan gives some possibilities if there is bad defending. Expect a lot of wheel banging overtakes.