Ferrari Power Unit Hardware & Software

[izzy]

I'll stay with my opinion, that the whole block is not doable.

3D printing in steel or aluminium alloys is no problem, however conventional additive and subtractive techniques (eg casting and machining) are well developed and the raw materials relatively inexpensive. This is why you see 3D printing emphasis on exotic materials like titanium and nickel alloys.

with the materials, i think part of it is that instead of casting a piece in one material, with 3D printing now they can vary the material during the build:

so they can go hard/soft, dense/lightweight, nickel alloy/steel alloy, whatever, with each tiny droplet! Being F1, i wouldn't be surprised if by now they can actually mix the exact alloy in real time as they go. It must be a whole new way of looking at designing something. They could even cool it by making some of it porous, possibly, who knows where it could lead

[LM10]

That’s F1. Pinnacle of motorsport with best engineers in the world constantly innovating. Therefore I wouldn’t tell that something is “not possible”. Even if it was, it might not be anymore.

[dans79]

doesn't quite work like that, they still have to concern themselves with things like thermal and mechanical properties that prevents some materials from working together in extreme environments.

I'll stay with my opinion, that the whole block is not doable.

3D printing in steel or aluminium alloys is no problem, however conventional additive and subtractive techniques (eg casting and machining) are well developed and the raw materials relatively inexpensive. This is why you see 3D printing emphasis on exotic materials like titanium and nickel alloys.

with the materials, i think part of it is that instead of casting a piece in one material, with 3D printing now they can vary the material during the build:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WL4b03Tfjg
so they can go hard/soft, dense/lightweight, nickel alloy/steel alloy, whatever, with each tiny droplet! Being F1, i wouldn't be surprised if by now they can actually mix the exact alloy in real time as they go. It must be a whole new way of looking at designing something. They could even cool it by making some of it porous, possibly, who knows where it could lead

[izzy]

doesn't quite work like that, they still have to concern themselves with things like thermal and mechanical properties that prevents some materials from working together in extreme environments.

don't worry, Ferrari will have a whole laboratory full of PhD's in metallurgical engineering to make sure nobody casually cooks up an engine block to izzy's recipe

and what an amazing fun time they must be having, if they've solved the warping problem

[izzy]

That’s F1. Pinnacle of motorsport with best engineers in the world constantly innovating. Therefore I wouldn’t tell that something is “not possible”. Even if it was, it might not be anymore.

yes exactly, Ferrari and F1 will be several steps ahead of anything we can see in the public domain. Hopefully the true awesomeness will leak out during the year, or some of it. Meanwhile we can just try to imagine what a breakthrough AM might be. Cooling could be like veins and arteries for example. Combustion chambers could run hotter and then efficiency will take another step.

[subcritical71]

I'll stay with my opinion, that the whole block is not doable.

3D printing in steel or aluminium alloys is no problem, however conventional additive and subtractive techniques (eg casting and machining) are well developed and the raw materials relatively inexpensive. This is why you see 3D printing emphasis on exotic materials like titanium and nickel alloys.

The quote above should be attributed to oehrly.

[LM10]

The 2020 engine was born from a new project that concerns in particular the upper part of the engine with new heads that have a different combustion chamber, but also the fixing points to the frame have changed because the installation of the power unit has been further extreme in the frame of the 671 with the movement of some important accessories.

According to rumors, the staff of Enrico Gualtieri has developed an unprecedented intercooler to cool the compressor air: those who think it may be an adaptation of the Cavallino solution to the 2019 FIA technical directives are very wrong, because they tell us that Maranello embarked on the development of a concept that seeks reliability and performance. With particular attention also to the integration of the engine into the machine to obtain aerodynamic advantages.

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-fe ... r/4630979/

[MtthsMlw]

Current intercooler is quite bulky in front of the engine, I wonder what they've come up with. Otherwise they pretty much minimalised the amount of radiators. Only the ones in the sidepods are left as well as a small one on top of the engine where the TC sits.

Just talking about the SF90 here, Haas and Alfa use different layouts apart from the intercooler.

[gruntguru]

I'll stay with my opinion, that the whole block is not doable.

3D printing in steel or aluminium alloys is no problem, however conventional additive and subtractive techniques (eg casting and machining) are well developed and the raw materials relatively inexpensive. This is why you see 3D printing emphasis on exotic materials like titanium and nickel alloys.

with the materials, i think part of it is that instead of casting a piece in one material, with 3D printing now they can vary the material during the build . . . so they can go hard/soft, dense/lightweight, nickel alloy/steel alloy, whatever, with each tiny droplet! Being F1, i wouldn't be surprised if by now they can actually mix the exact alloy in real time as they go. It must be a whole new way of looking at designing something. They could even cool it by making some of it porous, possibly, who knows where it could lead

Yes there are certainly limitations in conventional manufacturing techniques that can be overcome by 3D printing. Another is the creation of certain voids and internal features which would be otherwise impossible.

[rgava]

I can give my two cents on additive manufacturing on toolmaking, which I have direct experience.
Typical material for tool inserts is maranging steel (which can be age hardened to 52 HRC).
outside surface can be post machined, polished and coated with almost any existing coating.
State of the art is hybrid manufacturing: starting from a machined part, applying additive manufacturing on top of it (it can be done locally) and then machining the outer shape to tighter tolerances than the achievable by AM process.
So, going to the possibility to apply AM to an engine block of head. I see it possible applied to local areas were the advantages on the creation of internal structures like cooling or oil channels can be useful.
If they are currently using it, IMHO it's pure speculation, but totally possible.

[izzy]

I can give my two cents on additive manufacturing on toolmaking, which I have direct experience.
Typical material for tool inserts is maranging steel (which can be age hardened to 52 HRC).
outside surface can be post machined, polished and coated with almost any existing coating.
State of the art is hybrid manufacturing: starting from a machined part, applying additive manufacturing on top of it (it can be done locally) and then machining the outer shape to tighter tolerances than the achievable by AM process.
So, going to the possibility to apply AM to an engine block of head. I see it possible applied to local areas were the advantages on the creation of internal structures like cooling or oil channels can be useful.
If they are currently using it, IMHO it's pure speculation, but totally possible.

i love this 2 cents, thanks! Hybrid Manufacturing. Perfect! So they could get round the warping problem by having a big cast piece to start with, then literally add material to it, like a cooling matrix or something as you say, and then go back to machining to finish some surfaces.

[rgava]

Thanks Izzy, you can take a look at this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqWOrwBzOjU showing what I told before.

[izzy]

Thanks Izzy, you can take a look at this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqWOrwBzOjU showing what I told before.

god that's from 2011, back in V8 prehistory! what must they be capable of now?

[rgava]

[/quote]
god that's from 2011, back in V8 prehistory! what must they be capable of now?
[/quote]

Mainly, improved precision of the AM process, more variety of materials and combination of machining and AM in the same machine.

[izzy]

Mainly, improved precision of the AM process, more variety of materials and combination of machining and AM in the same machine.

in the same machine? amazing. All the teams must be into this, i hope FIA/Liberty don't decide it's not dumb enough and ban it