Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

[Tommy Cookers]

CHP is the answer in efficiency terms
some modern CHP schemes are over 100% efficient (efficiency convention ignores latent heat in exhaust water vapour)

'Power' was originally CHP
but then interfering liberal politicians uninvented CHP (to force P-only and so 'gridding-up' the whole country)
now interfering liberal politicians have again invented CHP

100% CHP plants must recover most of the flue (exhaust) gas waste heat and most of the condenser waste (latent) heat

combined cycle eg Drax Repower (retrofit if allowed) is 65% efficient P-only
the more efficient the prime mover the less scope there is for CHP

[Feliks]

Would a Stirling engine not be more efficient and simpler?

Not necessarily ... besides, building such a big stirling creates a lot of problems ...
this system seems feasible ...
and its efficiency probably depends on the height of such a tower ...




And I think that geothermal energy is the perfect engine ... because even 80 degrees Celsius, the temperature of the water heating the air is enough for good operation of such an engine ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_air_balloon


Andrew

[Big Tea]

Would a Stirling engine not be more efficient and simpler?

Not necessarily ... besides, building such a big stirling creates a lot of problems ...
this system seems feasible ...
and its efficiency probably depends on the height of such a tower ...


https://www.new4stroke.com/hot%20air.jpg

And I think that geothermal energy is the perfect engine ... because even 80 degrees Celsius, the temperature of the water heating the air is enough for good operation of such an engine ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_air_balloon


Andrew

I am surprised much more use is not made of 'district heating' powered by such things. ~In Northern Europe it seems to have caught on but I do not know of a single one, even just supplying public or government units.

[Feliks]

I am surprised much more use is not made of 'district heating' powered by such things. ~In Northern Europe it seems to have caught on but I do not know of a single one, even just supplying public or government units.

First, someone has to propose ideas, and only then governments will try to implement it .. This is the way things are, not the opposite ...
In geothermal, if you have 80 degrees Celsius water, so far it could practically only be used for heating .. But to heat it, the heat must be supplied to the recipient pipes and these pipes, it is five times more expensive than the extraction of hot water ... therefore, if it changes from time to time and electricity, then it is possible to let these energies into the country's electrical network in one place, and pick it up in another, even relatively remote, with minimal costs of building transmission,
Andrew

[Feliks]

Interesting properties of such an engine .. At a tower height three times greater, we will also receive 3 times more torque on the power output shaft, while we provide the same amount of heat per second....




What if the 10 ray tower was ...? it will also be 10 times more energy ...
The only limitations are the realities of technical possibilities ..
But theoretically, the energy received can go to ... infinity ...

Interesting..

Andrew

[PlatinumZealot]

http://www.new4stroke.com/images/tlok%20silyp.gif http://www.new4stroke.com/images/tlok%20silyp.gif

Okay, yes, do we continue to develop ideas ...
here one of the advantages: the possibility of completely separating the piston chamber, from the crankshaft chamber and main connecting rod .. This causes that the oil used for lubricating the shaft will not be contaminated with combustion products. He is in a clean state ... As someone will want to lubricate the piston with oil, it can use a different oil for this purpose.
However, I think that Teflon will fulfill its role ......

http://www.new4stroke.com/crosshead%20izolowany.jpg

Andrew

Why not use a cross-head design similar to MAN B&W or Sulzer?
Those are extremely efficient. When I was at the power plant the cross-head bearing basically doesn't wear. Only thing you change is the guide shoes. It also uses telescopic pipes to send oil to the piston crown. Note the piston rod and cross head are in two different chambers separated by a Gland. But if your design is in one chamber like a regular car, you can use splash/squirt lubrication.

[Big Tea]

It may be over-simplifying things, but if said hot air was rising in a stack or chimney, would a 'screw' not do the same job but with fewer (1) moving parts?

[gruntguru]

It may be over-simplifying things, but if said hot air was rising in a stack or chimney, would a 'screw' not do the same job but with fewer (1) moving parts?

See solar chimneys https://www.nationalgeographic.com/news ... to-energy/

[Feliks]

Wuzak, on 12 Feb 2020 - 06:31, said:

Are you assuming that the hot air is still the same temperature at the top, when the bucket turns over to let the exhaust air escape?



Which would mean that you are creating power without extracting any heat energy.



Yes, thanks for the right thinking on the project ... Alone in the beginning, I described these balloons as the largest heat engine ... ..
But you can not say that it is a heat engine, because it just does not lose heat, and gives energy ..
This escaping heat can be reused by building a roof at the top that will collect it and bring it back to the bottom of the device for refilling.
By creating good thermal insulation, the heat lost will be minimal, and only theoretically we will have to supplement the heat lost as a result of putting it into the atmosphere, and not as a result of its loss for the work.
So it's not a classic heat engine, despite the fact that it uses heat ..




Andrew

[gruntguru]

The energy required to drive the hot air pump is the same as the energy gained from the hot air rising in the first place. Result = zero energy output.

[J.A.W.]

The energy required to drive the hot air pump is the same as the energy gained from the hot air rising in the first place. Result = zero energy output.

Yeah gg, for all their faults,(& subsequent revisions of their scientific foresight), neither Newton, nor
Kelvin have had their findings on thermodynamics/entropy factors - in mechanical systems - blown away.

[PhillipM]

I'm still not convince that this guy isn't the worlds greatest internet troll to be honest.

It's amazing how the hot air can simultaneously rise with enough force to drive your power generator and magically return back down the pipe with no effort at the same time.

[Big Tea]

The energy required to drive the hot air pump is the same as the energy gained from the hot air rising in the first place. Result = zero energy output.

Yeah gg, for all their faults,(& subsequent revisions of their scientific foresight), neither Newton, nor
Kelvin have had their findings on thermodynamics/entropy factors - in mechanical systems - blown away.

You can not win. You can not even break even. You cannot even stay out of the game.

[Feliks]

Well, I see that I need to do the mathematical calculations step by step ...
so we have a 14m x 20m x 10m = 2800m ^ 3 bucklet ... he gives STRING at these 80 degrees Celsius those 500 KG of strength ... in a line, ALL bucklets give a total thrust of 12 x 500 KG = 6000 KG .
Now the pulling wheels have a diameter of 20 meters, i.e. a radius of 10 meters .. So we get a torque of 6000 x 10 m = 60,000 Kgm.
The circulation time of 1 bouquet is 100 seconds on this road 500 meters. or 500 meters divided by the circumference of the wheel, i.e. PI x D, 3, 14 x 20 m = 62 m, i.e. 500m / 62m = 8 turns, to overcome this path ... So one turn, that is 100 seconds / 8 = 12, 4 seconds lasts, i.e. 60 / 12.4 = 4.83 RPM per minute, on the wheel shaft,
The power we get with such parameters is 4, 63 rev / min x 60,000 kgm = 335 HP.

But now we can build it in a shaft dug in the ground, every 1000 meters deep, which is not a problem, and still part above the ground ..
And of course further permutations ..



Well, the usual waste would be the release of hot air into the atmosphere ...

Now imagine that you have a long pipe, but closed at its ends tight and well insulated ...
and now turn it upside down .. Will the air in the pipe move? Well, certainly not, and why Well, because there is not ... cold air, and it is only hot ... and now if we install a fan at the bottom, which will give us a small vacuum, pumping this container into the air, then the warm air in the pipe will follow where there is pressure, even small ...


Andrew

[Big Tea]

What about the heat soak into the bucket on the way up, and so it being hot on the way down and warming the cool air?
Would it not soon reach a stage where everything is almost the same temperature?