Ferrari Power Unit Hardware & Software

[tnajner]

“It is hard to tell now if FERRARI was running in illegal configuration in races which past”. That’s not correct, It is not possible because since the introduction of the fuel flow restriction rule in 2014 to this day, the FERRARI engine used by the FERRARI team and as supplied to customer teams is the only one out of the four makes on the grid that haven’t had track time and or finishing positions disqualified for breaching the fuel flow rules.

This is clearly wrong assumption. In reality it would be really hard to tell if the engine was illegal. They would have to inspect all of the previous engines used and I think those engines might be easy to modify to comply with the FF restrictions, so that FIA wouldn't notice. I mean modify fuel lines before handing them back to FIA for inspection. Also the fact that the FERRARI engine was the only one engine without any recorded FF breach doesn't say anything about its illegality.

[saviour stivala]

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

[aleks_ader]

Guys leave the politics. I think Ferrari exploided loopholes in FF monitoring. I m tehnical guy and i m even more interested how they achieve that?

1. Mechanical pulsing. That would be really impressive.
2. Some kind interference pattering. Via cables or whatnot...

Both things would be mindbogglingly difficult to achieve under harsh race conditions.

[f1jcw]

Guys leave the politics. I think Ferrari exploided loopholes in FF monitoring. I m tehnical guy and i m even more interested how they achieve that?

1. Mechanical pulsing. That would be really impressive.
2. Some kind interference pattering. Via cables or whatnot...

Both things would be mindbogglingly difficult to achieve under harsh race conditions.

A full bypass of the rules isn’t a loophole, it is full blown cheat

[maguetox]

But a private agreement between Ferrari and the FIA only means that something was not right and was permanent. Its a different situation that can't be compared.

[dans79]

Can we discuss the actual settlement or are we just going to have yin yang for weeks...........

[aral]

I fully agree. Discussing Mercedes and Honda power units on a Ferrari PU thread, is going off topic. Please use the proper threads if relevant.

[One and Only]

How many times was fuel taken out of Ferrari car last year? Binnoto said it was on approx. 50% of the races. If that's true and Ferrari was cheating FF sensor then they were playing with fire.

I am not convinced by AMuS article. I think they are guessing. Stop cheating FF sensor and you have to redesign hybrid part of the PU? Cheating FF sensor was theory from Red Bull which they claim they managed to do on a test bench. If they were 100% certain Ferrari is doing it and they could do it, I think they would be quiet about it and exploit it. They get free upgrade compared to Mercedes (they have better chassis than Ferrari anyway). If they get caught Ferrari is doing as well so they would get of the hook for free. Win-win situation for Red Bull. I think they needed anything plausible to make FIA to check Ferrari PU thoroughly, so they came up with that theory.

One other thing. I don't know what Ferrari did with their PU, but is it really needed to check someone's PU thoroughly over winter to make sure it's legal? How do we know FIA can effectively enforce that any complex part is legal without that kind of check?

[214270]

It’ll be interesting to see what Renault do here. They were publicly embarrassed & accused of cheating last year with their BBal system. They weren’t the recipient of any privileged treatment and I don’t see why Ferrari should be given any special dispensation. Hopefully, they publicly come out as disgruntled and force hands - I don’t think given their circumstances they have anything to loose.

[djones]

I read somewhere about manipulating the sensor with temperature.

Can anybody explain how such a thing would work as I'm struggling to visualise this?

[tnajner]

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

You are right, I quckly read through your reply. It is obviously correct to assume that Ferrari engine was legal because It did not breach any of FF limits.

[Just_a_fan]

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

You are right, I quckly read through your reply. It is obviously correct to assume that Ferrari engine was legal because It did not breach any of FF limits.

He's wrong because the others haven't been caught breaching the rules and, well, Ferrari have. Or, rather the FIA haven't said they have but then also haven't said they haven't. Which means they have but the FIA don't want to upset Ferrari.

[Tommy Cookers]

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

perhaps this was what the late Elvis Aaron Presley meant .....
when he said ..... 'why keep a cow if you can get milk under the fence !'

[turbof1]

I think AMuS is wrong regarding completely rebuilding the PU. Hypothesizing on fooling the fuel flow sensor and running a higher fuel flow for these fractions of moments, it doesn't seem to be critical towards the function and reliability of the power unit, and thus taking that away should not brick the power unit. It can only take some performance away, which Ferrari could have clawed back by significant changes on the PU.

Also what Stivala said, is technically true, but not relevant. This issue does not include other parties. It is about Ferrari and the FIA, and only about them.

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

You are right, I quckly read through your reply. It is obviously correct to assume that Ferrari engine was legal because It did not breach any of FF limits.

I'm not jumping automatically to conclusions here, but circumventing the fuel flow sensor can very much be considered illegal:

5.10.5: Any device, system or procedure the purpose and/or effect of which is to increase the flow rate or to store and recycle fuel after the measurement point is prohibited.

That's pretty much covering all aspects of increasing fuel flow above what is allowed.

[basti313]

Why is it a wrong assumption to assume the FERRARI engine was legal as regards the maximum fuel flow rules when it was the only one out of the four on the grid that was never been caught breaching said rules?.

You are right, I quckly read through your reply. It is obviously correct to assume that Ferrari engine was legal because It did not breach any of FF limits.

He's wrong because the others haven't been caught breaching the rules and, well, Ferrari have. Or, rather the FIA haven't said they have but then also haven't said they haven't. Which means they have but the FIA don't want to upset Ferrari.

That would be the easy movie answer.

In reality it usually works different and the FIA is 100% like any management today. The first rule is "save your own ass" and there is nothing bigger than compliance.

If you take this is the starting point for the interpretation then:
- No smoking gun. FIA could not nail the cheat. If they could, they would communicate it to save their own ass.
- There is a theory how Ferrari would be able to cheat and, thus, this possibility needs to be removed by monitoring and technical changes.

My bet is FIA made sure they can control better what Ferrari is doing and Ferrari avoided a communication of technical details.