Honda F1 in trouble, and withdraw from F1

[ben_watkins]

Can't see a buyout of Honda F1 Racing by Prodrive now as Subaru have pulled out of the WRC - and the team cars were prep'd by Prodrive.. Massive reduction in revenues for them!

Only way for Honda is a middle east sheik to buy them out.

[db__]

Can't see a buyout of Honda F1 Racing by Prodrive now as Subaru have pulled out of the WRC - and the team cars were prep'd by Prodrive

That said - Prodrive now have a race team with time on their hands and will be pretty desperate to replace the work & revenue lost from WRC

[WhiteBlue]

If sombody wants the team it would be chaeper to run in 2010. But the priviledges of an established team with FOM would be lost.

[DaveKillens]

In the current economic climate where many business enterprises are contracting, that doesn't rule out a company willing to expand and prosper in these uncertain times. And from what I've seen, Honda seems a good buy for the right company. This is the opportunity to jump into what could be a very lucrative business, with a firm committment to controlling costs and giving the underdogs more of a fighting chance.
It would take a major committment, ability to secure credit and sponsors, and the determination to weather the short term economic uncertainty to emerge a genuine GP team. Folks, there are companies out there that can do it, we just have to see who steps up and gives it a go.

[xpensive]

I just wonder, is Max still asking for a 50 MUSD entry-fee to compete with a new team in F1?
What about a possible Honda-team buyer, I guess the fee doesn't apply?

[tarzoon]

It's shame that men like this run the sport we love:

"Honda will be no great loss," Ecclestone told British newspaper Telegraph on Thursday. "Just look at where they finished in the championship - ninth. They wasted millions and were a bad example to other teams.

"Now they've gone, we've got a chance to bring in some sense to the teams about how much they should spend. I'm keen for the team to be kept in place. We have whittled it down to three serious potential buyers."

Well, from what I understood of Bernie Ecclestone's words, it seems that the sport is being ruled by companies that are not taking it seriously enough and spend more money than they should. Pretty lame excuse, especially coming from the guy that converted the "garagiste" into "gran circus".

[CMSMJ1]

I just wonder, is Max still asking for a 50 MUSD entry-fee to compete with a new team in F1?
What about a possible Honda-team buyer, I guess the fee doesn't apply?

NO - if you buy the team you buy their entry too..jobs a good'un

[donskar]

RE: Potential buyers for Honda F1 team, this from grandprix.com (emphasis added):

Sources at PSA Peugeot Citroen say that rumours suggesting that the French company might buy the assets of Honda Racing F1 are not going to become a reality. The company was involved in F1 between 1994 and 2000 as an engine supplier with McLaren (1994), Jordan (1995-1997) and Prost (1998-2000). There is obvious merit in F1 for image-building but Peugeot sources say that it is not possible to invest the kind of money needed at the same time as it is closing down production facilities and idling factories. The company does not know how the rumours started.

Looks like a smaller field this year. Next year?

[modbaraban]

All those rumours about an imminent buy-out of the Honda F1 team, from either Prodrive or PSA(!), makes me wonder if it is somehow orchestrated just to whip up an interest in the team?
I fail to see any board of directors anywhere endorsing the idea of a commitment to spend 100 MEUR, let alone 300, a year om an F1 team today.

Me too. It's too much of a gamble now. One the one hand one can get it cheap and probably gain some when... or rather if things in F1 improve significantly. On the other hand it's a good way to blow a fortune.

Here's a render I've come across.

PSA livery on a BMW.Sauber body.

[xpensive]

I just realized that Toyota has now completed seven full seasons in F1 and has gone basically nowhere. I wonder how much of a patience "kaizen" provides you with?

[modbaraban]

I just realized that Toyota has now completed seven full seasons in F1 and has gone basically nowhere. I wonder how much of a patience "kaizen" provides you with?

They must have that special DC version of kaizen "we'll win next time"

[CMSMJ1]

I just realized that Toyota has now completed seven full seasons in F1 and has gone basically nowhere. I wonder how much of a patience "kaizen" provides you with?

They must have that special DC version of kaizen "we'll win next time"

That was funny.

Maybe they will win next time...more likely they won't.

You cannot tell. - I think that Toyota must be taking some pain if the USA big three are knackered and Honda too... Who esle is a major player in the Toyota sector? VAG are cutting back UK touring cars and leon cup stuff, AUdi out of ALMS and Porsche not knowing what to do..

I hope the JT replacement stories are untrue.

OnTopic - Honda F1 are a good team that had too many long and wet pub lunches when designing RA107...

The poor '08 car was the icing on the dog food cake.

Honda are great..I still love 'em for what I have had from them in bikes and car ownership and on TV etc. They made a mess of the current stint and Mr Fry stifled and wounded them until they were a pale imitation of their former self.

[pgj]

Kaizen should have provided the solution to Honda's problems. If it was going to work with Toyota, it would have shown results by now.

Kaizen works in improving efficiency and problem solving in production environments. I am not sure that it can react quickly enough in an F1 environment. There may be one, but I can't think of one instance where a team has been successful through collective effort. Even if they are introverted, there has always been a dominant figure in control of development. I am not sure that the Japanese Way has a place in F1.

[Metar]

It appears to have worked for Ferrari in the first half of this decade, but then again, it's a "collective team effort" because every single part of the team worked perfectly.

It used to work, though, in the days of horrible reliability - teams that, without innovation or speed, managed to build more reliable cars, and sometimes earned a win or two thanks to it. Nowadays, when the top teams also have top reliability, it seems impossible.

[xpensive]

Hmmm...my crystal ball tells me that Toyota has just run out of their special DC-kaizen-patience...