COVID-19 could affect more races this year.

[Restomaniac]

^^ That's not quite apples and oranges though. Would be better to view the Central Park (outdoors) vs one of the London Parks ((outdoors)

I live near the Peak District in UK - as on my MTB this weekend and it was heaving in the car parks and "hubs" as I passed on by.

Some bloody stupid people out there who are not getting the very obvious point that you need to stay away from people and manage your life as if you are a carrier of this disease.

True and the irony is that when the UK Govt are forced to lockdown the country those same idiots will be the ones bleating!

[DChemTech]

^^ That's not quite apples and oranges though. Would be better to view the Central Park (outdoors) vs one of the London Parks ((outdoors)

I live near the Peak District in UK - as on my MTB this weekend and it was heaving in the car parks and "hubs" as I passed on by.

Some bloody stupid people out there who are not getting the very obvious point that you need to stay away from people and manage your life as if you are a carrier of this disease.

True and the irony is that when the UK Govt are forced to lockdown the country those same idiots will be the ones bleating!

Yep.
I fully expect the same to happen in the Netherlands. Basically:

Gov't: "OK, we tried to allow you to go outside to get some fresh air and exercise with social distancing, but clearly you cannot handle the responsibility and we have to opt for mandated full lockdown now. Congratulations, the 10% that could not deal with responsibility ruined it for the rest."

Especially that 10%: "See! The [populist parties] were right! They called for a lockdown from the start! The government ruined everything, you have blood on your hands!"

Everyone else: "..."

[mmred]

I don't wanna sound obnoxious but i said it all along.
1 italy was not a special case just the first hit
2 there were no uk alternatives to italian and asian quarantine like rules
3 social style cant be responsible for 10x deaths, ot can spread the disease faster but once the healthcare is in crysis deaths depend by the vyrus itself who s much more deadly than what they said to avoid panic

[izzy]

I'm a bit switched off from covid-19 but Sky are running a piece saying UK deaths are on the same trajectory as Italy and Spain, so far

See London's Richmond Park.
https://twitter.com/tomrichell/status/1 ... 0042996742

yes i don't know what you do if you live in a city. You have to stay fit or get fit, you can't just sit inside all day, you have to run or bike, outside, so it's a question of 2m separation or what? Downwind, upwind, 5m? But anyway i'm working to max out my aerobic capacity for a good while every day, in between my oranges, muesli and yoghourt

But yes lots of people not taking it seriously in our bold immigrated western democracies

[DChemTech]

I don't wanna sound obnoxious but i said it all along.
1 italy was not a special case just the first hit
2 there were no uk alternatives to italian and asian quarantine like rules
3 social style cant be responsible for 10x deaths, ot can spread the disease faster but once the healthcare is in crysis deaths depend by the vyrus itself who s much more deadly than what they said to avoid panic

I'm sorry to be repetitive, but in all your assessments of deadliness you keep ignoring testing coverage.
And I don't say that to downplay the severity of the situation or anything like that.

[PlatinumZealot]

Fear mongering might be the only way to get the message across to those people. It might lead, unfortunately, to the extreme hoarding of resources, but if that's what is needed then so be it.

[izzy]

Fear mongering might be the only way to get the message across to those people. It might lead, unfortunately, to the extreme hoarding of resources, but if that's what is needed then so be it.

i blame the supermarkets personally. They just watched their shelves being cleared and counted the money, for days and days. They could easily have set limits at the start and there wouldn't have been any shortages or even any panic

in my mind they're different people tho, the panic hoarders and the spring breakers. The fearful ones are just like that and the bold ones aren't going to get scared into changing, they'll have to be persuaded that it's not smart or fashionable

[DChemTech]

Fear mongering might be the only way to get the message across to those people. It might lead, unfortunately, to the extreme hoarding of resources, but if that's what is needed then so be it.

i blame the supermarkets personally. They just watched their shelves being cleared and counted the money, for days and days. They could easily have set limits at the start and there wouldn't have been any shortages or even any panic

in my mind they're different people tho, the panic hoarders and the spring breakers. The fearful ones are just like that and the bold ones aren't going to get scared into changing, they'll have to be persuaded that it's not smart or fashionable

Yeah, they could have started taking measures earlier, although I do think they were initially overwhelmed. After measures were communicated (more or less out of the blue), hoarding started instantly. However, days later, there is still no consistent policy in supermarkets. Some made 'shelters' for checkout personnel, but fillers are still fully exposed to the crowds. Some have number limitations on visitors and/or items, some force taking a cart to increase distancing, but my local supermarket has neither - just a piece of paper saying "keep your distance". Which is just physically impossible in that place with the numbers they let in. So for now I'll stick with old-fashioned bakeries, vegetable shops, and the little oriental supermarkets. They either have better door policies, or you can at least see how crowded it is and come back later.

[3jawchuck]

^^ That's not quite apples and oranges though. Would be better to view the Central Park (outdoors) vs one of the London Parks ((outdoors)
I live near the Peak District in UK - as on my MTB this weekend and it was heaving in the car parks and "hubs" as I passed on by.
Some bloody stupid people out there who are not getting the very obvious point that you need to stay away from people and manage your life as if you are a carrier of this disease.

True and the irony is that when the UK Govt are forced to lockdown the country those same idiots will be the ones bleating!

Yep.
I fully expect the same to happen in the Netherlands. Basically:
Gov't: "OK, we tried to allow you to go outside to get some fresh air and exercise with social distancing, but clearly you cannot handle the responsibility and we have to opt for mandated full lockdown now. Congratulations, the 10% that could not deal with responsibility ruined it for the rest."
Especially that 10%: "See! The [populist parties] were right! They called for a lockdown from the start! The government ruined everything, you have blood on your hands!"
Everyone else: "..."

Helsinki isn't too much different, lots of people out, in groups and clearly not paying attention to good practises. The city may be closed off to all but the most essential traffic soon. Of course they will tell us days before that happens so people will have time to pack and go other parts of the country.

[mmred]

I don't wanna sound obnoxious but i said it all along.
1 italy was not a special case just the first hit
2 there were no uk alternatives to italian and asian quarantine like rules
3 social style cant be responsible for 10x deaths, ot can spread the disease faster but once the healthcare is in crysis deaths depend by the vyrus itself who s much more deadly than what they said to avoid panic

I'm sorry to be repetitive, but in all your assessments of deadliness you keep ignoring testing coverage.
And I don't say that to downplay the severity of the situation or anything like that.

I Hope you are right

[nzjrs]

I don't wanna sound obnoxious but i said it all along.
1 italy was not a special case just the first hit
2 there were no uk alternatives to italian and asian quarantine like rules
3 social style cant be responsible for 10x deaths, ot can spread the disease faster but once the healthcare is in crysis deaths depend by the vyrus itself who s much more deadly than what they said to avoid panic

Doesn't your #1 contradict your #3? And didnt you earlier suggest that Italy was a special case because of a specially mutated strain?

[Jambier]

I've read also that no every country count the dead the same way

That's why Germany seems to be so low, counting dead only if Covid is primary cause of death

[nzjrs]

China begins to loosen lockdown:




What's that? 8 weeks on from the onset. Based on that, with a "china -> 'the west'" inefficiency multiplier of 3x, I'd say we are in for about 4-6 months of this lock down in the west.

[izzy]

Yeah, they could have started taking measures earlier, although I do think they were initially overwhelmed. After measures were communicated (more or less out of the blue), hoarding started instantly. However, days later, there is still no consistent policy in supermarkets. Some made 'shelters' for checkout personnel, but fillers are still fully exposed to the crowds. Some have number limitations on visitors and/or items, some force taking a cart to increase distancing, but my local supermarket has neither - just a piece of paper saying "keep your distance". Which is just physically impossible in that place with the numbers they let in. So for now I'll stick with old-fashioned bakeries, vegetable shops, and the little oriental supermarkets. They either have better door policies, or you can at least see how crowded it is and come back later.

yes if you get in a queue you get IT, is how we have to think about it, so true

[mmred]

I don't wanna sound obnoxious but i said it all along.
1 italy was not a special case just the first hit
2 there were no uk alternatives to italian and asian quarantine like rules
3 social style cant be responsible for 10x deaths, ot can spread the disease faster but once the healthcare is in crysis deaths depend by the vyrus itself who s much more deadly than what they said to avoid panic

Doesn't your #1 contradict your #3? And didnt you earlier suggest that Italy was a special case because of a specially mutated strain?

No contraddiction between italy being normal and having 10x deaths for maybe a mutated strain

Normal means and meant the causes are not social
10x deaths is what we see in europe compared to asia
Again causes are not social or the virus mitated or the numbers were altered before or now