2020 Formula 1 70th Anniversary Grand Prix - Silverstone, August 7-9

[Sieper]

The engine was fine. He was still running that until this weekend and it will now be the friday engine. Or did you not notice?

So why did he stop in the race? Pretending? What's the use of such a survived engine if it doesn't help have a race? Shouldn't they do a decent job of building a PU that can be used to race?

Max had a DNF in his first race, I believe it was something in the clutch assembly. In any case, the point was that his car stopped on him (and not because they tried to prolong a stint to beyond what the tires are capable off under that specific car). He could have been in contention on his own merit, he still is above Bottas now. That is my point. Delusional is too big of a word. I also agree that Lewis will take this years championship by an enormous margin, and next year cannot be much different also.

Much like certain people will say Lewis lost to Rosberg as his engine gave out on him in Malaysia. Which I personally believe to be true. And yes, I did notice! I also noticed that you are a fan of Lewis, and from my point of view you have that right, without me calling you out on it.

[Sieper]

This is probably the delay of the graphics, which aren't properly synced ... look at the gear changes etc, those are 10 or so frames behind ... roughly the number of frames until he drops below 80 ... the telemetry data supposedly disappears the moment he enters the pits, he's at 79 when that happens

He made it (to slow down sufficiently) on pit entry. Apparently there is even a speedgun at the line. Was just maximizing has pace and likely a bit caught out by the rears that had already gone so braking at maximum effort produced a lock up.

[GPR-A]

The engine was fine. He was still running that until this weekend and it will now be the friday engine. Or did you not notice?

So why did he stop in the race? Pretending? What's the use of such a survived engine if it doesn't help have a race? Shouldn't they do a decent job of building a PU that can be used to race?

Max had a DNF in his first race, I believe it was something in the clutch assembly. In any case, the point was that his car stopped on him (and not because they tried to prolong a stint to beyond what the tires are capable off under that specific car). He could have been in contention on his own merit, he still is above Bottas now. That is my point. Delusional is too big of a word. I also agree that Lewis will take this years championship by an enormous margin, and next year cannot be much different also.

Much like certain people will say Lewis lost to Rosberg as his engine gave out on him in Malaysia. Which I personally believe to be true. And yes, I did notice! I also noticed that you are a fan of Lewis, and from my point of view you have that right, without me calling you out on it.

You can go on giving excuses and I can keep challenging it. The fact is, Max being in second position despite a DNF is because Bottas had a DNS. Not because of some miraculous performance.

[Phil]

Ok I didn't know that (and neither paid TV commentators).

The ORF did and pointed it out on their broadcast. These are black/white rules. If Hamilton had been speeding, it would have been a straight forward penalty. He was just lucky and with the way it is measured (average speed between the two sensors) within the speed limit.

[Just_a_fan]

We had this odd race every year... the competition can grasp for air and have some hope... and Mercedes goes for the kill.

Fun thought: Max won on Sunday because he had the best car.



That's a bit tongue in cheek and aimed at those who say the same about Hamilton, but the reality is that Max's car was the best car on Sunday. Had it not been, he wouldn't have won.

[Sieper]

So why did he stop in the race? Pretending? What's the use of such a survived engine if it doesn't help have a race? Shouldn't they do a decent job of building a PU that can be used to race?

Max had a DNF in his first race, I believe it was something in the clutch assembly. In any case, the point was that his car stopped on him (and not because they tried to prolong a stint to beyond what the tires are capable off under that specific car). He could have been in contention on his own merit, he still is above Bottas now. That is my point. Delusional is too big of a word. I also agree that Lewis will take this years championship by an enormous margin, and next year cannot be much different also.

Much like certain people will say Lewis lost to Rosberg as his engine gave out on him in Malaysia. Which I personally believe to be true. And yes, I did notice! I also noticed that you are a fan of Lewis, and from my point of view you have that right, without me calling you out on it.

You can go on giving excuses and I can keep challenging it. The fact is, Max being in second position despite a DNF is because Bottas had a DNS. Not because of some miraculous performance.

Bottas had a DNS, then you were right all along and I have not been paying attention at all. I am not making any excuses, I am challenging the opinion that is so delusional. Where did you hear me say I was a miraculous performance by the way?

My point is that the whole Honda/RBR/Max package has enabled him to be on P2 after 5 races. It is not a miracle but a fact.

[Phil]

It is fascinating though. 2 Races that could have gone differently for RedBull. They could have won the first race on strategy, they could have won last weeks Silverstone race on fortunate circumstance and they clearly won this race on speed and superb tire wear. Out of 5 races, they could have won 3, changing the WDC quite significantly in doing so.

From those 5 races however, only 1 race was ever down to merit and this was this race here. Just one. And with this one, they had an ace up their sleeve because Mercedes was napping in Q2 when they easily could have qualified on the hards as well, giving them an advantage that might have been enough to win this race too. All others were down to circumstance. If you ignore circumstance, then Mercedes easily won 4 out of 5 races this year - and did.

Good on Max for being 2nd. My bet though is that over the course of the season and with the performance advantage Mercedes has, I wouldn't be surprised if both Mercedes drivers secure 1 and 2 easily. The way the points are given though and that small difference between 2nd and 3rd, Max won't be that far behind [in points].

[Sieper]

Exactly, fully agree with you Phil.

So next weekend. Merc will surely take care of the tire issues by offering up some stiffness (better for aero) and trading that in for more leniently sprung (rear). That way the tires will need to fulfill a lesser part of the suspension job and fait better. They will still qualy P1 and 2 (although RBR might be closer as Merc's aero will then not work as good as now) as the package is more then good enough for that and in Spain overtaking is neigh on impossible so If they can keep an undercut (or overcut) at bay they should have the win secured. RBR might again not qualify on P3. The whole top midfield (especially RP) is very close to them. That would seal the deal.

[dans79]

Good on Max for being 2nd. My bet though is that over the course of the season and with the performance advantage Mercedes has, I wouldn't be surprised if both Mercedes drivers secure 1 and 2 easily. The way the points are given though and that small difference between 2nd and 3rd, Max won't be that far behind [in points].

I think the thing I and several others are taking exception to, is that Max being second right now has and real significance to the overall season, despite what several others are claiming or alluding to.

It reminds me of a scenario in school when we had a young freshmen who was very fast (runner) for his age. he finished second to our top senior at the time in the mile. He was bragging and carrying on and being all boastful until a day or two later when coach called him into the office and basically told him keep his mouth shut because he was something like 30 seconds behind.

In track, position is only relevant when time is taking into account as well. WDC position is only relevant when points are taking into account as well.

[Sieper]

But Max is not bragging and boasting at all. Have you seen his post race interview on SKY?

Also I am not doing that (nor anyone else I see in this thread). Merely objecting to overstating, words like "delusional" "miraculous". That makes it almost impossible to have a discussion.

[dans79]

But Max is not bragging and boasting at all. Have you seen his post race interview on SKY?

Also I am not doing that (nor anyone else I see in this thread). Merely objecting to overstating, words like "delusional" "miraculous". That makes it almost impossible to have a discussion.

as i said earlier, i suggest you look around the forum a little more and the internet as a whole. Also keep in mind just because you don't see something now doesn't mean it wasn't there at one point and was then removed by the moderators.

Edit: you might want to have a conversation, but i have seen a lot of people who support the same driver as you, or just don't like lewis or Merc etc who are just interested in poo fling.

[Big Tea]

We had this odd race every year... the competition can grasp for air and have some hope... and Mercedes goes for the kill.

Fun thought: Max won on Sunday because he had the best car.



That's a bit tongue in cheek and aimed at those who say the same about Hamilton, but the reality is that Max's car was the best car on Sunday. Had it not been, he wouldn't have won.

Fun thought: Max won on Sunday because he had the best Package. true?

I think so. Lets not discount either team all year, as they will all have some good luck and some bad luck.
The better prepared they are the less part luck plays into it. Sunday RbR were prepared.

[LM10]

To sum up the weekend regarding RBR and Mercedes:

- Max perfectly capitalized on the issues Mercedes had

- Mercedes will most probably not have the same issues to the same extent again

- Mercedes has been, is and will remain the (by far) most dominant car in this season

- Bottas is a really weak racer and as long as he can’t even pull away with Lewis being right behind him in dirty air for several laps, he should not even dream of winning WDC

[Big Tea]

To sum up the weekend regarding RBR and Mercedes:

- Max perfectly capitalized on the issues Mercedes had

- Mercedes will most probably not have the same issues to the same extent again

- Mercedes has been, is and will remain the (by far) most dominant car in this season

- Bottas is a really weak racer and as long as he can’t even pull away with Lewis being right behind him in dirty air for several laps, he should not even dream of winning WDC

Agree except the Botas part, he is doing an almost perfect job. He is not there to be a champion, unless Hamilton drops the ball. He is an excellent back up and we should not slate him for things he does/does not do, unless it is an out of the ordinary race.

[Sieper]

He should dream, but against Hamilton that is what they will remain. In all fairness, in this race he did take pole and in his after the first stint Max did came out in front of Lewis by some margin but not Valterri. so in this specific race weekend Valterri was not so poor at all? Then again, Max would not have gotten past Lewis so quickly and Bottas would likely not have caught Hamilton in the last part of the race if the roles were reversed. However, then I think they would not have let Bottas run long and just pit him directly after Lewis (if the roles were reversed) but that is just a guessing game.