2020 Russian Grand Prix - Sochi Autodrom, September 25 - 27

[maxxer]

I'm more annoyed that he ultimately got a penalty for something that wasn't defined clearly. This should teach the stewards/race directory to be more precise in what they expect the drivers to do and not be a punishment for drivers who legitimately exploit it. In the end, it ruined a race for something that wasn't even relevant to the race itself.

Yes i was reading the Race director event notes and looking at the schematics attached the fast lane in the pits end where the pits end just after where the safety car would be parked during the race.

https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... on%202.pdf

[siskue2005]

It's the common sense decision, really. Penalty points were a bit absurd.
As for the teams error- I make it akin to an unsafe release or loose wheel after a stop. It's a shame the driver is penalised for something that's not his fault or within his control. Possibly a WCC point penalty is the fairest thing in circumstances like that.

There is nothing that says the team made an error, there is no regulation or direction that says it is illegal for HAM to make the practice start where he did. The whole thing is just complete and utter BS.

From the notes

19) Practice starts
19.1 Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the
avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race.
Drivers must leave adequate room on their left for another driver to pass.
19.2 For reasons of safety and sporting equity, cars may not stop in the fast lane at any time the pit exit
is open without a justifiable reason (a practice start is not considered a justifiable reason).

How can a penalty be justified based on this uncertain rule? If there was a clear rule like in Monza 2020 then i can agree, but there is no where it is writtern what he did was out of order. It was not at the team's fault according to this notes

[jz11]

did he, by stopping where he did, made other drivers go over the white line separating the pit exit from the track?

I suspect that is the reason for the rule, so no one would make practice starts there making others cross the line and join the track where they are not supposed to, the rule was there for the whole weekend, including practice sessions where there can be cars on fast laps going past them when they do this

[El Scorchio]

It’s silly that such a transgression, even if it WAS one, effectively decided the race result, despite not even occurring in the race. Just daft. A reprimand or fine or points deduction for the team should have sufficed.

I really hated the penalties dished out to Haas a few races ago for that formation lap stuff.

[siskue2005]

did he, by stopping where he did, made other drivers go over the white line separating the pit exit from the track?

I suspect that is the reason for the rule, so no one would make practice starts there making others cross the line and join the track where they are not supposed to, the rule was there for the whole weekend, including practice sessions where there can be cars on fast laps going past them when they do this

Nope, he was not impeding anyone.


You can clearly see he was parked out of the fast lane and even Bono asking him to leave enough space for other cars to go without crossing the line

[jz11]

you're asking for gray area where there shouldn't be one
they didn't make it up 5 minutes before the start, it was published on 25th of September, if someone wasn't clear what the rule was about - go and ask for clarification before you make a mistake, it is as simple as that

they were sloppy, that is all there is to it, just like the last race where on the on board you can clearly see him passing 2 boards with blinking cross indicating pit lane closure, yet you blame it on stewards for putting that message on not the main screen page

if you ask me, they are still quite lenient about the rules, just last race quite a few cars cut the chicane entry corner with all 4 wheels with probably like 50cm more to the white line - I forget if it was Brundle that even commented on that and then immediately changed subject and "forgot"

[jz11]

did he, by stopping where he did, made other drivers go over the white line separating the pit exit from the track?

I suspect that is the reason for the rule, so no one would make practice starts there making others cross the line and join the track where they are not supposed to, the rule was there for the whole weekend, including practice sessions where there can be cars on fast laps going past them when they do this

Nope, he was not impeding anyone.


You can clearly see he was parked out of the fast lane and even Bono asking him to leave enough space for other cars to go without crossing the line

ok, fine, then why they made that additional rule then? to prevent anyone doing exactly what he did because of the reason I mentioned, if you don't read the notes, or read and don't understand and ignore what you don't understand, it doesn't mean the rule is unnecessary...
if something is unclear - go to stewards and ask where they think it is fine to do the practice starts - IT IS THAT EASY!

[maxxer]

you're asking for gray area where there shouldn't be one
they didn't make it up 5 minutes before the start, it was published on 25th of September, if someone wasn't clear what the rule was about - go and ask for clarification before you make a mistake, it is as simple as that

they were sloppy, that is all there is to it, just like the last race where on the on board you can clearly see him passing 2 boards with blinking cross indicating pit lane closure, yet you blame it on stewards for putting that message on not the main screen page

if you ask me, they are still quite lenient about the rules, just last race quite a few cars cut the chicane entry corner with all 4 wheels with probably like 50cm more to the white line - I forget if it was Brundle that even commented on that and then immediately changed subject and "forgot"

Would be funny though if someone at that point was on a fast lap , would have some sky reporters and other vip's in their intakes than by then

[i70q7m7ghw]

Anyone see Stroll taking his helmet, gloves, and overalls off after his crash?

25.2 Should a car stop on the track during a session, the driver must keep all of their protective clothing (Helmet, Gloves, etc) on until they have returned to their garage

https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... on%203.pdf

Where's the penalty?

With regards to Hamilton's penalty, the pre-race notes say this about practice starts:

19.1Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race. Drivers must leave adequate room on their left for another driver to pass

But the penalty says that actually it needs to be outside the line defining the track:

The driver performed the practice start near the end, but directly in the pit exit. Art 36.1requires drivers to use constant throttle and constant speed in the pit exit other than in the place designated for practice starts in the Event Notes item 19.1., which is defined as the place ”on the right hand side” after the pit exit lights (and is not part of the track as defined by lines) which has been known to all competitors and used without exception.

And let's not mention all the other penalties handed out

[Phil]

you're asking for gray area where there shouldn't be one
they didn't make it up 5 minutes before the start, it was published on 25th of September, if someone wasn't clear what the rule was about - go and ask for clarification before you make a mistake, it is as simple as that

they were sloppy, that is all there is to it, just like the last race where on the on board you can clearly see him passing 2 boards with blinking cross indicating pit lane closure, yet you blame it on stewards for putting that message on not the main screen page

if you ask me, they are still quite lenient about the rules, just last race quite a few cars cut the chicane entry corner with all 4 wheels with probably like 50cm more to the white line - I forget if it was Brundle that even commented on that and then immediately changed subject and "forgot"

I wouldnt even call it a grey area - strictly by the book, Hamilton did everything correct. I’m not sure how you could say otherwise - it’s there in writing, black on white.

I also find it extremely annoying that we would have had an orherwise exciting race on the basis that Hamilton was handicapped anyway by starting on the soft tire. Could he have made a strategy work? Fight for the lead? Or was Bottas always going to win it through better strategy? We’ll never know... because the race director couldnt admit to not being specific enough in his own notes. The whole thing just screams incompetence.

[i70q7m7ghw]

Things not investigated:

Verstappen going full throttle over the curb at Turn 2 on lap one and gaining a lasting advantage, he should have lost several positions if he had tried to actually make the corner.

Kyvat going slowly out of the pitlane after the red flag to try and make all the cars behind miss the chequered flag.

[siskue2005]

did he, by stopping where he did, made other drivers go over the white line separating the pit exit from the track?

I suspect that is the reason for the rule, so no one would make practice starts there making others cross the line and join the track where they are not supposed to, the rule was there for the whole weekend, including practice sessions where there can be cars on fast laps going past them when they do this

Nope, he was not impeding anyone.


You can clearly see he was parked out of the fast lane and even Bono asking him to leave enough space for other cars to go without crossing the line

ok, fine, then why they made that additional rule then? to prevent anyone doing exactly what he did because of the reason I mentioned, if you don't read the notes, or read and don't understand and ignore what you don't understand, it doesn't mean the rule is unnecessary...
if something is unclear - go to stewards and ask where they think it is fine to do the practice starts - IT IS THAT EASY!

What rule ???

this is the rule

from this race event notes

19) Practice starts
19.1 Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the
avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race.
Drivers must leave adequate room on their left for another driver to pass.
19.2 For reasons of safety and sporting equity, cars may not stop in the fast lane at any time the pit exit
is open without a justifiable reason (a practice start is not considered a justifiable reason).



https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... on%203.pdf
All the above info taken from their events notes in the above pdf

So where exactly is the rule u are talking about ??

There is no clear place designated to have start, it just says u can do a practice start after the lights before the pit exit ends (see the 19th section in the pdf and the picture of the pit exit in the later pages)

And if the events notes says u can do practice start after the pit lane lights and there is no need to get clarity on every little thing!

It is the fault of FIA that they have a stupid rule written here, and it should have been FIA clarifying it to the team rather than dishing out penalties to cover their incompetence's

[Unc1eM0nty]

Confirmed by radio that Mercedes confirmed that Ham could do the practice start that far from the pits.. Again Lewis suffers for the team. This penalty points are bull....

IMO, The penalty points should only be given for collisions
It is just BS to give it out for team's mistakes like in Monza and here

My thoughts as well. They should be for dangerous driving behaviour. Not for this sort of stuff. The race penalty was already enough to penalise the driver for small slip ups by the team.

I've thought the same for some time, for instance a car leaves the pits without a wheel attached, clearly a team error yet the river is punished. Just deduct constructor points.

[i70q7m7ghw]

Masi is a moron, he's ruining the sport with the constant meddling, Charlie must be turning in his grave.

[jz11]

Nope, he was not impeding anyone.


You can clearly see he was parked out of the fast lane and even Bono asking him to leave enough space for other cars to go without crossing the line

ok, fine, then why they made that additional rule then? to prevent anyone doing exactly what he did because of the reason I mentioned, if you don't read the notes, or read and don't understand and ignore what you don't understand, it doesn't mean the rule is unnecessary...
if something is unclear - go to stewards and ask where they think it is fine to do the practice starts - IT IS THAT EASY!

What rule ???

this is the rule

from this race event notes

19) Practice starts
19.1 Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the
avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race.
Drivers must leave adequate room on their left for another driver to pass.
19.2 For reasons of safety and sporting equity, cars may not stop in the fast lane at any time the pit exit
is open without a justifiable reason (a practice start is not considered a justifiable reason).

https://serving.photos.photobox.com/525 ... ac047f.jpg

https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... on%203.pdf
All the above info taken from their events notes in the above pdf

So where exactly is the rule u are talking about ??

There is no clear place designated to have start, it just says u can do a practice start after the lights before the pit exit ends (see the 19th section in the pdf and the picture of the pit exit in the later pages)

And if the events notes says u can do practice start after the pit lane lights and there is no need to get clarity on every little thing!

It is the fault of FIA that they have a stupid rule written here, and it should have been FIA clarifying it to the team rather than dishing out penalties to cover their incompetence's

was Hamilton the only one doing practice starts?