Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

[NathanOlder]

If Albon could qualify directly behind Max we would get a more representative performance. Last week Alex was able to keep up with Max once he had been lapped by him so his speed in the race is not in question I am sure.

Don't forget that Albon was on a softer compound that was 25 laps newer than the tyres Max had on! Albon should have been way faster than Max not just matching him.

[Racer X]

If Albon could qualify directly behind Max we would get a more representative performance. Last week Alex was able to keep up with Max once he had been lapped by him so his speed in the race is not in question I am sure.

Don't forget that Albon was on a softer compound that was 25 laps newer than the tyres Max had on! Albon should have been way faster than Max not just matching him.

Im afraid it is if he was only able to lap closer to Max on a new set of the faster compound with less fuel load. If anything it highlights his deficit even more.

Think about it Max needed to be on slower older tires and Albon on new with the quicker compound. Also less fuel load if anything the only thing it kept him from doing is falling behind more and being a back marker. In a car that can fight for podiums....

[Edax]

From what I have seen of Albons performances recently I believe that RedBull regularly try non optimal contra strategies with him. This is partly due to his qualifying results I think which then get compounded by RedBull bringing him early or trying something different with his tyres to attempt an upset or at least rule out things for Max to try.

If Albon could qualify directly behind Max we would get a more representative performance. Last week Alex was able to keep up with Max once he had been lapped by him so his speed in the race is not in question I am sure. His main problem is qualifying, but trying to push to the limit in a car that is as delicately balanced as the RedBull is this year has often seen him try a little too hard and results in a disappointing qualifying result from which his race becomes a battle to gain the lost ground and results in RedBulls experimentation with differing strategies which are sub optimal. Christian knows they do this which is why he has supported Alex so much. With the RedBull car getting more stable and less prone to snap Alex's excuses are diminishing which I think has prompted the change in Christian's messages to the press.

Is anyone able to shed some light on why the car id that twitchy and why it can not be altered on just the one car?
Or do they want both cars set up identical so they can use the feedback from Albons tyres?

They are obviously not going to alter the car away from Max's preference, but why can they not 'tame' alex car?
Is there something fundamental that they can not trim out? Weight distribution if fixed (is it not?) so what is left that can not be tuned out? It is not like they were looking for grip on a bad car, just balance on one.

I guess the short wheelbase and high rake not going to help. But I am not sure whether this is the issue with Albon, since the TR is basically the same platform.

One thing I can think of is that the top cars seem to run the tires much closer to the edge. In the midfield you can see people fighting for the entire race and still have tires at the end. Try to follow someone for 3 laps in a RB, Ferrari, or Merc, or push too hard on an outlap and you will be counting blisters. In order to unlock the performance of these cars tire management skills count more than racing skills. Albon has shown that he can race, but I am not so sure whether he can make the tires work for him.

[Big Tea]

From what I have seen of Albons performances recently I believe that RedBull regularly try non optimal contra strategies with him. This is partly due to his qualifying results I think which then get compounded by RedBull bringing him early or trying something different with his tyres to attempt an upset or at least rule out things for Max to try.

If Albon could qualify directly behind Max we would get a more representative performance. Last week Alex was able to keep up with Max once he had been lapped by him so his speed in the race is not in question I am sure. His main problem is qualifying, but trying to push to the limit in a car that is as delicately balanced as the RedBull is this year has often seen him try a little too hard and results in a disappointing qualifying result from which his race becomes a battle to gain the lost ground and results in RedBulls experimentation with differing strategies which are sub optimal. Christian knows they do this which is why he has supported Alex so much. With the RedBull car getting more stable and less prone to snap Alex's excuses are diminishing which I think has prompted the change in Christian's messages to the press.

Is anyone able to shed some light on why the car id that twitchy and why it can not be altered on just the one car?
Or do they want both cars set up identical so they can use the feedback from Albons tyres?

They are obviously not going to alter the car away from Max's preference, but why can they not 'tame' alex car?
Is there something fundamental that they can not trim out? Weight distribution if fixed (is it not?) so what is left that can not be tuned out? It is not like they were looking for grip on a bad car, just balance on one.

I guess the short wheelbase and high rake not going to help. But I am not sure whether this is the issue with Albon, since the TR is basically the same platform.

One thing I can think of is that the top cars seem to run the tires much closer to the edge. In the midfield you can see people fighting for the entire race and still have tires at the end. Try to follow someone for 3 laps in a RB, Ferrari, or Merc, or push too hard on an outlap and you will be counting blisters. In order to unlock the performance of these cars tire management skills count more than racing skills. Albon has shown that he can race, but I am not so sure whether he can make the tires work for him.

He seems to suffer more in qualli than in the race, so would it be tyre related? Also, I don't know red bull would find his feedback (well, by feed back I mean call him in to look at his tyres) much use for Max, which seems to be his job.

Also, being worse in qualli seems to lead to it not being a problem following cars as it is usually possible to get him on track in a gap, even if not at the ideal moment. He could even chose a different tyre to max (unless RbR insist, so they can use the data, but if he is on the option it is just as useful to know about the tyre Max is going on to)

Surely they can make or adapt a wing to give him the balance, if it is less on the front or more on the back.
Is it something that makes the flow so touchy that it is like a switch? it works or not, nothing in between?


Thanks for the reply, appreciated, and not intending to shoot you down or anything, don't take it that way.

[Manoah2u]

As for the Russell to RBR nonsense: that's what it is, nonsense.
He mentioned himself he has a contract and isn't worried one bit, and really, it makes no sense to see him leave, literally no sense whatsoever.

Perez to Williams makes no sense either.

It's Haas or RedBull for Perez. Haas still is the most likely, but RBR is a fair possibility, normally it wouldn't, but given that Marko admitted there are conciderations,
there is. Otherwise, there would be none. Since Haas has mentioned there has been no contact regarding Hulkenberg, it's increasingly likely Hulk will not end up there,
and as such, Perez going there is still one of the most likely possibilities.

There is also 'suddenly' a growth of reports that Mick will go to Haas instead to go for Alfa Romeo, which is not unlikely at all, but still, with the same verve it was claimed
that Mick will be paired to Kimi for 2021, so i'd leave that in the open.

In regards to Perez, there are three options, and that's really it.

1. RedBull - Possible, but not the most likely
2. Haas - The most likely
3. Out of F1 and into other racing class(es).

In case of 1, recent reports aren't unlikely that Mick Schumacher and Nikita Mazepin will drive for Haas.
However, i'd concider it very unlikely that two 'complete rookies' will be appointed to Haas.

In case of 2, then it would be likely the other driver @ Haas will indeed be Mick, as there's no way Sergio will go there if Mazepin is going to have a say @ that camp.

Case 3 to me is the most unlikely scenario of all, as Perez is bringing way too much interest with his Carlos Slim backing AND his actual proven talent.

Why 1 remains unlikely to me is simply because RedBull in all honesty does not NEED Carlos Slim money, and therefor Sergio will not have much 'weight' to bring to the table.
He has clear talent, but that doesn't mean he still won't get beaten by Max fulltime. And that's without mentioning the possibility of demanding he will have a 'nr2 role'.

2 remains the MOST likely simply because haas DOES benefit from Slim money, Sergio can bring 'weight' to the table and the team, and essentially is a 'free spirit' there.
Even IF his teammate will be Mick and even if Mick would 'destroy' him (unlikely, but not impossible), then everybody knows Mick will head out to get a Ferrari seat ASAP.
If Ferrari can't get him that, then that will see Mick end up @ Mercedes or Aston Martin instead, but in any case, zero worries for Perez.
Add to that that again, I very much see Sergio 'take' BWT with him to where he moves aswell, and that combo quite certainly will be enough for Haas to 'skip' Mazepin in the end.

Williams, to me, sounds much more like a means to achieve something elsewhere, as Russell is stating. Obviously Perez will have a 'backup backup backup' plan, but i can't for a second believe Perez will 'really' concider Williams, neither will Carlos Slim. The only 'force' if you may that could go to Williams might actually be BWT, and we will see a pink Williams.
HOWEVER, there remains a simple truth, and that is that BWT will alsways prefer to sign with a team that can get them 'more' exposure, and nobody will doubt that Haas will have more (positive) exposure than Williams is able to. I would thus ONLY believe that it is WILLIAMS that has 'interest' in Perez and BWT. After all, Latifi's camp will most certainly NOT leave space for Mazepin's camp to come aboard aswell, so the only 'big money' they can 'aquire' then is Perez (Carlos Slim) and a bit of BWT on the side.

IF Sergio however ends up at RedBull, I think BWT will end up @ Williams, and Mazepin will drive for Haas.

In conclusion:

Perez & Schumacher @ Haas.

[nevill3]

Don't forget that Albon was on a softer compound that was 25 laps newer than the tyres Max had on! Albon should have been way faster than Max not just matching him.

But a lot of talk after the race has said the softer compound was less desirable and the harder tyre was the best one to be on. As I said earlier Red Bull use Alex as an extended in race testing mule. They know the championships are all but finalized and are experimenting during the race either to get a jump on Mercedes next year or help maximise Max's chances for glory days this year.

[PlatinumZealot]

If I were Gasly, I'd sign the first offer I get for any team's junior academy let alone a drive for the first team. Not a fan of the way his performance is being downplayed. I've been a big supporter of Alex and I believe even now that he can really give Max a run for his money but that doesn't mean Gasly's performances should in any way be belittled.

I don't think Gasly's performance is being downplayed, just his ability to drive THAT Red Bull car.
The same for Albon. I think most people see them as promising drivers, but out of their depth in the RBR boss team.

I have been cheering Albon on since he moved to Red Bull, but I now think that if he stays there it will ruin him as a driver and his rep with other teams. He needs to go somewhere he ca show he IS good, and I thing AT would be ideal

I see why RedBull want to try an outside driver now.
A young driver that grew up in the RedBull system and then finally reaching the highest level in the top team likely creates an implosive level of pressure to perform, especially against the benchmark set by Max.

One could guess an outside driver has no such "Twist-ian" sentiments. Having no childhood in the RedBull workhouse, that driver simply enters the team with no emotions towards the ring leaders in Helmut, Christian and Dietrich. That driver only sees the steering wheel and the pedals, the lights the track and the flag.

I agree with such an experiment. And Perez is perfect for the job.

[DChemTech]

If I were Gasly, I'd sign the first offer I get for any team's junior academy let alone a drive for the first team. Not a fan of the way his performance is being downplayed. I've been a big supporter of Alex and I believe even now that he can really give Max a run for his money but that doesn't mean Gasly's performances should in any way be belittled.

I don't think Gasly's performance is being downplayed, just his ability to drive THAT Red Bull car.
The same for Albon. I think most people see them as promising drivers, but out of their depth in the RBR boss team.

I have been cheering Albon on since he moved to Red Bull, but I now think that if he stays there it will ruin him as a driver and his rep with other teams. He needs to go somewhere he ca show he IS good, and I thing AT would be ideal

I see why RedBull want to try an outside driver now.
A young driver that grew up in the RedBull system and then finally reaching the highest level in the top team likely creates an implosive level of pressure to perform, especially against the benchmark set by Max.

One could guess an outside driver has no such "Twist-ian" sentiments. Having no childhood in the RedBull workhouse, that driver simply enters the team with no emotions towards the ring leaders in Helmut, Christian and Dietrich. That driver only sees the steering wheel and the pedals, the lights the track and the flag.

I agree with such an experiment. And Perez is perfect for the job.

Add to that that an outsider perspective on ways of working can also help a lot, and there's all the more reason to look outside their own academy for once. RB academy drivers have only seen the way AT and RB are operating, limits the odds that they come with good insights on how things can be done better around the team. Hulk & Perez have loads of experience with how other teams handle certain aspects, be it technical or operational.

[raymondu999]

So.... there was at one point some noise about Gasly looking at Renault as an exit strategy, given RB may potentially hurt his career. Thoughts? Gasly-Alonso perhaps?

Edit - https://www.racefans.net/2020/10/28/alp ... n-in-2021/ nvm then

[DChemTech]

So.... there was at one point some noise about Gasly looking at Renault as an exit strategy, given RB may potentially hurt his career. Thoughts? Gasly-Alonso perhaps?

Gasly has been confirmed at AT for 2021 it seems, so he has time to plan an exit strategy. He could replace Ocon, were Ocon to dissapoint (I personally find Gasly more likable for sure, but that probably plays little role). Or, who knows what Haas & AlfaRomeo are up to in 2022. Kimi has to retire at some point, and by 2022 Pierre could be regarded as an experienced driver.

[raymondu999]

So.... there was at one point some noise about Gasly looking at Renault as an exit strategy, given RB may potentially hurt his career. Thoughts? Gasly-Alonso perhaps?

Yeah the announcement came out exactly 28 mins after my previous post ahahahha
Gasly has been confirmed at AT for 2021 it seems, so he has time to plan an exit strategy. He could replace Ocon, were Ocon to dissapoint (I personally find Gasly more likable for sure, but that probably plays little role). Or, who knows what Haas & AlfaRomeo are up to in 2022. Kimi has to retire at some point, and by 2022 Pierre could be regarded as an experienced driver.

[DChemTech]

Another interesting announcement is that the teams agree on a wage cap of a (rather roya)l 30M. Will this have any impact on, say, Hamilton's future decisions?

[tangodjango]

Another interesting announcement is that the teams agree on a wage cap of a (rather roya)l 30M. Will this have any impact on, say, Hamilton's future decisions?

Depends on whether the contract he signs is before the new rules are passed or not. In any case these caps are extremely easy to get around. All that is needed is some creative accounting. Mercedes pay Hamilton 20 million and their 4 biggest sponsors have image rights and personal sponsorship deals with him totalling 20 million: problem solved. That can never be regulated and has no basis for regulation in any court in a free market system.

[DChemTech]

Another interesting announcement is that the teams agree on a wage cap of a (rather roya)l 30M. Will this have any impact on, say, Hamilton's future decisions?

Depends on whether the contract he signs is before the new rules are passed or not. In any case these caps are extremely easy to get around. All that is needed is some creative accounting. Mercedes pay Hamilton 20 million and their 4 biggest sponsors have image rights and personal sponsorship deals with him totalling 20 million: problem solved. That can never be regulated and has no basis for regulation in any court in a free market system.

Yeah that's true, sponsor deals are excluded. And then it only starts 2023 anyway, so drivers still have some time to figure out their strategy.

[raymondu999]

Even without exclusion of sponsorship deals, Hamilton will, at the end of the year, lock up every statistical category as the statistical goat.

Even if he were to drive for free, if that means added stats it would also mean increased sponsorship income otherwise. Brand endorsements, advertising etc.

I don’t follow Moto and Rally but don’t Rossi and Loeb both have 9 titles apiece? What kind of retainers do/did they command?