[ 2020 ] AMG Mercedes F1 Team - Mercedes

[e30ernest]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

[zibby43]

If even half true, there will be a lot of unhappy people around here.

Undeniably true. Mercedes said they started to empty out the design drawers when building the W11 (due to the anticipated reg. changes). In terms of things we can actually see/are aware of, that process gave us DAS, the new rear suspension, etc.

Wonder if they have anything left . . .

I certainly hope it's true, for no other reason than to continue seeing the incredible pole laps that LH puts down. Hungary 2020, SPA 2020, Monza 2020, etc. etc. Just so incredible to watch a driver than skilled and a car that well engineered. I know this phrase gets overused, but it really does look like it's on rails. Mindblowing.

Absolutely! Speaking of that very topic, there is a new interview with Lewis circulating out there (I've seen it referenced multiple times now, but have not located the source) that details how Lewis gave a tremendous amount of development feedback on the W11, which has helped both his qualifying form and race pace this year.

I'll give a brief summary here:

Supposedly, the W10 was front-end limited (Lewis likes a sharp front end), and Lewis didn't like how it responded in the slow and medium-speed corners. The rear-end work (including the new rear-end suspension) on the W11 opened up tons of scope for development on the front end of the car, which made it much sharper/pointier compared to the W10.

I'm anticipating the W12 being even more refined, as Mercedes made some pretty big changes front-rear on the W11, including the aforementioned rear suspension/rear diffuser area, and of course, it was their first year with the high-top side pod inlet philosophy. Which, they will undoubtedly have a better understanding of for the W12.

Edit:

Here's the article - but it may be behind a pay-wall for some (it wasn't for me): https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15370 ... s-hamilton

[dans79]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

In all honesty I think they do a pretty good job of keeping stuff under wraps. With the number of people your average top tema employees is amazing they can keep anything secret!

[ryaan2904]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

I think this leak is to destabilize their opponents. They want to make them subconscious of their own program and rush things in a bid to catch a line which may not even be there.

[e30ernest]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

I think this leak is to destabilize their opponents. They want to make them subconscious of their own program and rush things in a bid to catch a line which may not even be there.

Remember when Ferrari had so much HP? Mercedes set that as their target and when the engine clarifications came and Ferrari lost all that power, the Mercs were left with a huge lead due to the "fake target" they had to achieve.

There's a reason why t hey never show their hand in testing.

[Moore77]

Once again, Pirelli would become a limiting factor. They were happy that FIA had decided to cut the downforce by 10% for 2021, which would have surely helped them.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... V3ntS.html

If the 2021 tyres can't hold up (no news on how they compared against 2020 tyres in recent testing) and Pirelli balloons them, then it's difficult to imagine if W12 would beat the W11 times. It already happened this year and might happen again next year. It would then become hard to distinguish the development of W12.

[Big Tea]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

After reading about how they misled with this car, it would not surprise me if they add more to force the other builders to run with poor reliability looking to equal them.

[ryaan2904]

I wonder how they get these "leaks". I would think Mercedes would want to keep a tight lid on their performance projections of next year's car to avoid the competition getting a benchmark to chase. The team has always downplayed their performances so this seems like an odd leak coming from them.

I think this leak is to destabilize their opponents. They want to make them subconscious of their own program and rush things in a bid to catch a line which may not even be there.

Remember when Ferrari had so much HP? Mercedes set that as their target and when the engine clarifications came and Ferrari lost all that power, the Mercs were left with a huge lead due to the "fake target" they had to achieve.

There's a reason why t hey never show their hand in testing.

Yes but what I meant was that this time it could be Mercedes drawing the fake line. To force their opponents into errors

[NathanOlder]

Id be worried if I were the other teams. Mercedes always play themselves down, so it they are saying they have recovered all the downforce lost with the regulation tweak, it probably means they have found 3 times as much as they lost

[e30ernest]

Id be worried if I were the other teams. Mercedes always play themselves down, so it they are saying they have recovered all the downforce lost with the regulation tweak, it probably means they have found 3 times as much as they lost

Hahahaha yeah this might be the case. Maybe Merc is still sandbagging despite this revelation.

[zibby43]

Fascinating quote from James Allison re: how big the aero changes are for '21, as he describes what would happen if you just trimmed the floor, diffuser slats, and removed floor slots, without making any accompanying changes:

“The change in its raw, un-optimised form, just chopping the things off the car . . . and our car would go from pole to comfortably last.”

He goes on to explain:

“The aerodynamic change is pretty big . . . and could easily change a lot of the characteristics that we've taken for granted for the last two seasons."

"So it's quite an anxious time at the moment, making sure that we recover as much downforce as we can from the regulatory wounds that were inflicted on the car just lately, and to scramble as much information out of the next two races as we can on these two tyre tests that we will get to do with the new rubber. And then hopefully be able to glue all those pieces of information back together in time for winter testing next year.”

[tangodjango]

Fascinating quote from James Allison re: how big the aero changes are for '21, as he describes what would happen if you just trimmed the floor, diffuser slats, and removed floor slots, without making any accompanying changes:

“The change in its raw, un-optimised form, just chopping the things off the car . . . and our car would go from pole to comfortably last.”

He goes on to explain:

“The aerodynamic change is pretty big . . . and could easily change a lot of the characteristics that we've taken for granted for the last two seasons."

"So it's quite an anxious time at the moment, making sure that we recover as much downforce as we can from the regulatory wounds that were inflicted on the car just lately, and to scramble as much information out of the next two races as we can on these two tyre tests that we will get to do with the new rubber. And then hopefully be able to glue all those pieces of information back together in time for winter testing next year.”

Yet another example of inept FIA management. Keep the regs the same build and induct a tire compound one step harder than this year's hardest and drop the softest from the range this year, mandate more pit stops for races where tires are a concern or allow only the softest compound(out of the 3 selected) for qualifying and the two harder for the race. Instead we have more mindless wasting of resources for the smaller teams in the lead up to 2022.

[Just_a_fan]

Fascinating quote from James Allison re: how big the aero changes are for '21, as he describes what would happen if you just trimmed the floor, diffuser slats, and removed floor slots, without making any accompanying changes:

“The change in its raw, un-optimised form, just chopping the things off the car . . . and our car would go from pole to comfortably last.”

So they're seeing a c.3 second loss of performance from the initial changes? That's quite a big drop and shows how effective those floor slots are.

It will be interesting to see what effect the changes have on the cars' ability to follow each other. The slots help to keep the air under the car "clean", losing them will mean more work being done by the bargeboards and associated fences/flicks to move front tyre wake further outwards. Which means there's a risk that the wake issue will return. Or have Mercedes (and no doubt others) been able to set up enough strong vortices to send along the floor and keep the air where they want it? Perhaps using the upper surfaces of the sidepods to direct air down and outwards?

[zibby43]

Yet another example of inept FIA management. Keep the regs the same build and induct a tire compound one step harder than this year's hardest and drop the softest from the range this year, mandate more pit stops for races where tires are a concern or allow only the softest compound(out of the 3 selected) for qualifying and the two harder for the race. Instead we have more mindless wasting of resources for the smaller teams in the lead up to 2022.

Pretty much, yep.

So they're seeing a c.3 second loss of performance from the initial changes? That's quite a big drop and shows how effective those floor slots are.

It will be interesting to see what effect the changes have on the cars' ability to follow each other. The slots help to keep the air under the car "clean", losing them will mean more work being done by the bargeboards and associated fences/flicks to move front tyre wake further outwards. Which means there's a risk that the wake issue will return. Or have Mercedes (and no doubt others) been able to set up enough strong vortices to send along the floor and keep the air where they want it? Perhaps using the upper surfaces of the sidepods to direct air down and outwards?

The hole at the rear edge of the floor just ahead of the rear tire is critical to managing tire squirt, which, left unchecked, can wreak havoc on the rear diffuser (one of the most efficient sources of downforce for the entire car).

Going to be interesting to see what sorts of novel solutions are introduced to retain this "tire squirt management" effect.

[PlatinumZealot]

Hamilton is such a good driver because he approaches his life differently to the other drivers. Others may be more focused on driving to the exclusion of everything else. Hamilton balances his life with his driving, the driving is a central part of his life, but it is not the only part of his life. He does fashion, music, he has a social life outside of F1. Somehow he balances all of those extra-curriculars to his benefit as a driver. His elite social circle gives him political insights that others may not have, which helps him deal with not just the team, but the higher ups, the media, the FIA, etc. The fact he uses his creativity besides driving makes him more well rounded as an individual, his love of music, of creating it, means he understands timing, rhythm, he has a subconscious math that he has integrated into his driving style.

In short, he is not distracted by his activities off track, rather he's found a way to make himself a more complete driver because of those activities. Other drivers are too focused on F1, to the exclusion of other things in life, which limits them in a sense, they are not as complete as if they were able to balance those things like Hamilton seems to do.

Hamilton may have a large brain capacity when it comes to multitasking and learning

Some people are geniuses but they rather not multitask. They like their comfort zones too. Hamitlon seems tk be one of those outgoing geniuses now though he was not always like that. Remember the days of the "happy bubble" that he learned from Jenson.