Rear wing flex and FIA regulatory test 2021

[peaty]

-The FIA started looking into this in mid/late June last season (by the way, Meredes rear wing was the one on the spot light at the time).
-By mid July the FIA already had tougher load tests planned to prevent F1 teams using flexible rear wings.
-Nothing happened, they didn't move a finger for almost a year!
-Hamilton mentioned the "bendy wings" after qualy in the 2021 Spanish GP
-The following week teams recieve an email informing them about the new test
-Wolff say they are annoyed the FIA has taken so long because they stepped in almost a year later.

I mean...

[Juzh]

Toto is now threatening with protests in baku and even mentioning ICA, so you bet this'll blow up soon. He does it in his usual one dimensional approach. First he claims video evidence shows wings are illegal because theirs doesn't bend, then immediately goes on and claims new tests present new opportunities they'll have to take advantage off by softening their RW as if that somehow won't go against "spirit of the rules" .

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/wolf ... k/6511928/

“We will need to modify our wing,” said Wolff. “We need to soften it. Our wing is extremely rigid complying to the famous article 3.8 that [demands] it must remain immobile.

“The new test that has been introduced is a half-baked solution, which is giving us opportunity. So the whole thing can soften and bend more in future.”

Why? You just said wing must be immobile, no matter what tests are applied to them. Introspection = zero.

It's a warning to the FIA that they either get on top of it or there will be a "flexi wing war".

Well yes, but then he should stop playing a saint. Even if FIA brings new rules forward to baku he really shouldn't then say they will have to exploit this new rule. Why haven't they exploited existing one already? Doesn't new rule exploitation then expose them to that same protest?
I don't see how it changes anything, per existing rules there should (in theory) be no flex, load test or not. This rule doesn't change with additional load bearing tests being brought in.

[El Scorchio]

Toto said if they don't enforce it, then they'll be forced to invest and join the fray for Baku. Not that it isn't against the spirit, but if the FIA doesn't want to act, then, they too will do it.

And fair enough. You don't want to disadvantage yourself in this sport just to be 'noble'. and I bet they've probably got the exact specs to produce their own limbo wing back at the factory already.

[RedNEO]

[Just_a_fan]

Toto is now threatening with protests in baku and even mentioning ICA, so you bet this'll blow up soon. He does it in his usual one dimensional approach. First he claims video evidence shows wings are illegal because theirs doesn't bend, then immediately goes on and claims new tests present new opportunities they'll have to take advantage off by softening their RW as if that somehow won't go against "spirit of the rules" .

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/wolf ... k/6511928/


Why? You just said wing must be immobile, no matter what tests are applied to them. Introspection = zero.

It's a warning to the FIA that they either get on top of it or there will be a "flexi wing war".

Well yes, but then he should stop playing a saint. Even if FIA brings new rules forward to baku he really shouldn't then say they will have to exploit this new rule. Why haven't they exploited existing one already? Doesn't new rule exploitation then expose them to that same protest?
I don't see how it changes anything, per existing rules there should (in theory) be no flex, load test or not. This rule doesn't change with additional load bearing tests being brought in.

It's F1 politics. He's saying to the FIA that unless they step on it now, it will get silly. He's trying to force the FIA to bring it in in time for Baku because a flexi wing is going to a need-to-have item on that long, long straight. If the FIA insist on waiting until after Baku, Mercedes will have to "do a Red Bull" in order to have any chance to compete with them on the straight. Mercedes hope that the new tests will force Red Bull to make a non-flexi wing, and thus lose some of their straight line speed and thus overall lap time. Of course, Red Bull will be working hard to develop a flexi wing that passes the new tests and still flexes. Indeed, Mercedes might be concerned that the FIA's long lead-in time for the new tests will essential give Red Bull the time to do just that.

[El Scorchio]

[dans79]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/g2YdApKE ... .webp&ct=g

Horner's is full of it.....

As I mentioned in the RBR team thread nearly a week ago.

Here is a video from Max's front wing camera in Portugal, look at the position of the flaps right before the breaking zone for turn 1 and at the apex of turn 3, and you will se a lot of movement. (ignore the name of the video)

If memory serves the fia cares more about the main plane than they do the flaps.

[Just_a_fan]

Yeah, Christian, but yours will be doing exactly the same thing. All of them do because of the way the flaps are supported. The easy answer would be to mandate an inner endplate type device that all flaps have to connect to and which would make the whole ensemble stiff.

[214270]

https://media3.giphy.com/media/g2YdApKE ... .webp&ct=g

Horner's is full of it.....

As I mentioned in the RBR team thread nearly a week ago.

Here is a video from Max's front wing camera in Portugal, look at the position of the flaps right before the breaking zone for turn 1 and at the apex of turn 3, and you will se a lot of movement. (ignore the name of the video)

If memory serves the fia cares more about the main plane than they do the flaps.

Front wing discussions are just noise and a non-issue. You just cannot make something that thin completely rigid just like the T- wing oscillations.

Wolffs thinking I guess is DAS was a perfectly legitimate interpretation of the rules, but it was banned in order to avoid unnecessary spending. The same should apply here.

[Blackout]

They have to give the teams some time to make changes, but yes it would be nice to see the FIA give them a bit less time. Maybe we will see some protests in Baku?

And so what? (innocent question) how will the steward deem those problematic wings illegal? those wing pass the tests that the FIA has put in place. Will the stewards improvise a new test?

[214270]

They have to give the teams some time to make changes, but yes it would be nice to see the FIA give them a bit less time. Maybe we will see some protests in Baku?

And so what? (innocent question) how will the steward deem those problematic wings illegal? those wing pass the tests that the FIA has put in place. Will the stewards improvise a new test?

The matter doesn’t necessarily end with the stewards. It can then go onto tribunal, at which point anything is feasible I would imagine.

[Giblet]

They have to give the teams some time to make changes, but yes it would be nice to see the FIA give them a bit less time. Maybe we will see some protests in Baku?

And so what? (innocent question) how will the steward deem those problematic wings illegal? those wing pass the tests that the FIA has put in place. Will the stewards improvise a new test?

Remember that Red Bull was caught with actual springs in their front wing endplates and were DSQ from a qualifying session.

This was after many many passed static tests on the front wing.

We never found out how they were found IIRC.

[dans79]

They have to give the teams some time to make changes, but yes it would be nice to see the FIA give them a bit less time. Maybe we will see some protests in Baku?

And so what? (innocent question) how will the steward deem those problematic wings illegal? those wing pass the tests that the FIA has put in place. Will the stewards improvise a new test?

It wouldn't be much different than in Abu Dhabi 2014 when they got excluded from qualifying.

A technical delegate reported this to the stewards, and the stewards agreed it was a breach of article 3.15

When checking the front wing of car numbers 01 and 03 it was found that the front wing flaps were
designed to flex under aerodynamic load. In my opinion this is not in compliance with Article 3.15 of
the Formula One Technical Regulations. Therefore I am referring this matter to the stewards for their
consideration.

I posted all the technical documents from 2014 last week earlier in the thread here, if you wish to read them.
viewtopic.php?p=971148#p971148


The way the flexing rules are written, they FIA can come down on teams really hard if they want to.

[Giblet]

I feel like they got off really lightly after being caught purposefully designing parts to beat FIA tests.

Trying to beat the rules is one thing, going around them like Ferrari appears to have done in the past with their engine's rumored sensor play and these wings are a little far.

The double diffuser or DAS for example are where teams found a loophole or unregulated area.

But looking at a rule and saying "nah, I am not going to adhere to that in any way and hide that I do it" is not sporting, or "cool".

[peaty]

We have to love the political game! I just hope everything explodes and we get protest left, right and center.
I would love to "see" the top cars being check. I don't mean the joke introduced this season to try make fans forget that the FIA doesn't have the capabilities to ensure a fair competition (making the entire hybrid era a joke). I mean a real post-event scrutiny checks. Unfortunately that would never happen, it's part of the F1 business.