2021 British Grand Prix - Silverstone, July 16 - 18

[notsofast]

For a minute I thought I accidentally wandered onto the NASCAR forum

[godlameroso]

Silverstone is a strange track in some ways as not only is the surface very dark and dense, which means lots of transfer into the tyres, but beneath the track is thousands of tons of broken concrete from clearance of the original site so it is heat store in some places and not others. there are also several 'lost' streams below somewhere so heating is always going to be a difficult thing to handle

That is very interesting, thank you, I did not know that

[Mogster]

Likelihood of tyre failures this afternoon seems quite high?

[godlameroso]

Blisters are the result of previously inflicted tyre damage, most probably caused by rough kerb edges.

If Pirelli were to conduct a quick simple test of the above, all they would need is a Stanley knife and one of the top cars and a top driver to drive it for no more than half a dozen qualifying type laps. Using the Stanley knife scribe the Pirelli logo circumferentially around the tread surface and await the return of the car, the evidence will be plain to anyone.

If it's on the inside of the tire, and only the rears, then it's something else.

It's just the right front not getting up to temperature. There aren't many left hand turns to really put a lot of energy through the tire. The left front has no issue at all getting up to temperature because all the high speed corners are right hand turns.

There are two ways to deal with this, put more downforce on the front right, knowing it's going to grain, and try to dial out some understeer. The alternative is, you don't put more downforce on the front right and you adopt a more aggressive driving technique to force more heat into the front right and get it working that way.

The pit stop affords you a chance to make a flap adjustment, so perhaps with the softer tires it's better to use the asymmetrical wing, then even it out late race on the harder tire and just wring the neck out of the fronts so they'll bite. Or, just stay with the asymmetrical setup and live with the graining, should be a driver's choice.

[jjn9128]

Seems to be a bit of desperation IMO. He's over driving to try and get the Merc seat, which IMO he should already have. I'm not sure the penalty was fair, I've not seen an offboard to know how close Vettel was on the inside. Lap 1 they usually go more lenient as the cars are more in a pack.

I guess they are treating the sprint differently because incidents have a much bigger impact on a short race. Seems counterproductive to the idea of the sprint race if you ask me.

They just showed the view from Vettel behind. 100% George’s fault. 3 place penalty about right. Wish they could do 1 or 2 places instead.

[nevill3]

The Sky "experts" said that the front tyres were blistering due to "dragging them" down the straights, referring to the camber and toe settings used to optimize the cornering is not ideal for straight line running.

[Sieper]

The Sky "experts" said that the front tyres were blistering due to "dragging them" down the straights, referring to the camber and toe settings used to optimize the cornering is not ideal for straight line running.

Could be, Lewis and Max then on a 2 stopper and Bottas with maybe less camber for a one stopper?

[search]

the tire list from Pirelli is available as well now:



interesting that Vettel somehow managed to be left without any new ones for the race. Could turn into an issue later on

[Spacepace]

The Sky "experts" said that the front tyres were blistering due to "dragging them" down the straights, referring to the camber and toe settings used to optimize the cornering is not ideal for straight line running.

Yes I believe Norris had said that in the post sprint race interview. It was the inside tyre dragging in maggots Becketts

[El Scorchio]

Silverstone is a glorious sight in the sunshine. Wonderful stuff

[NathanOlder]

Matt b, Gianpiero Lambiase even called it in to Max in the radio, 2 laps from the end, you have a 3 second gap, stay off the kerbs please. That is why Lewis came back, Max had a time gap to “use” on trying to prevent a possible tire rip. Lewis was chasing full out, despite similar tire issues.

What are you saying ? I am saying Max and Lewis both blistered their tyres, only difference was Lewis spent the whole race in dirty air, while max was in clean air. Theres a difference. Or are you saying thats not correct ?

I was replying to Matt b. He said Lewis was closing in at the end and he thought this was because Max’ tires were in a worse state. I merely explained this was actually discussed over the team radio with his engineer, they stayed off the kerbs the last two lap, investing the 3 second lead Max had. As they both had blistered tires and Max could afford to reduce the risk of a blowout in the last laps as he was 3 seconds ahead. Lewis did not have that luxury and had to keep pushing to take advantage of a potential max slip up or issue.

I am not disagreeing with you at all in that post and struggle to understand why you would think that? I do think a little differently about the reason for blistering, see reply hereunder.

Surely if you were replying to matt b, maybe quote him instead of me?

anyway, just a mix up. Lets hope we get a good race, especially for the 140k fans in this baking hot sun today.

[Sieper]

What are you saying ? I am saying Max and Lewis both blistered their tyres, only difference was Lewis spent the whole race in dirty air, while max was in clean air. Theres a difference. Or are you saying thats not correct ?

I was replying to Matt b. He said Lewis was closing in at the end and he thought this was because Max’ tires were in a worse state. I merely explained this was actually discussed over the team radio with his engineer, they stayed off the kerbs the last two lap, investing the 3 second lead Max had. As they both had blistered tires and Max could afford to reduce the risk of a blowout in the last laps as he was 3 seconds ahead. Lewis did not have that luxury and had to keep pushing to take advantage of a potential max slip up or issue.

I am not disagreeing with you at all in that post and struggle to understand why you would think that? I do think a little differently about the reason for blistering, see reply hereunder.

Surely if you were replying to matt b, maybe quote him instead of me?

anyway, just a mix up. Lets hope we get a good race, especially for the 140k fans in this baking hot sun today.

Yes, hopefully they can find some shade. I went for an hour of tennis (with factor 50) and still I have a headache from the sun.

[i70q7m7ghw]

Why would higher pressures categorically lead to overheating? Common convention is lower pressures allow more flex which generates more temperature.

I find the blistering on the front right actually pretty weird. Maybe it has a lot to do with the fast left T2 and then trail braking into Brooklands?

I don't think anyone said, "higher pressures categorically lead to overheating". However, lower pressures might add some heat through sidewall flex, but would potentially reduce the surface temp as it can reduce sliding/scrubbing the surface of the tyre. Higher pressures will stiffen the tyre, reducing the flex and causing the tyre to scrub a bit more, which will increase the surface temp. It's the surface temp that can cause blistering, not the internal tyre temp.

Well you did give a pretty general statement about higher pressures so to me it seemed implied but I get your reasoning.

I still kind of disagree though. The higher pressure might give more scrub but then will also give less grip, so drivers will have to go slower for a given corner.

I always thought blistering came mostly from internal temp...?

I still maintain its the combined braking and cornering load. Brakes pumping lots of heat into the rim/tyre while also turning. The front left doesn't really see that kind of load anywhere on the lap. Maybe T3 but that's definitely less severe than T6. Other high load right hand corners are mostly on throttle.

It's cumulative over several laps. That tyre may not get worked particularly hard in any one place, but it might not be getting a chance to cool, so it just gets hotter and hotter. I'd love to get my hands on the telemetry! The blistering on that particular corner is possibly a result of a setup compromise, and Hamilton's comment about pressures suggests that's part of the compromise.

Russell was just saying they are all expecting blistering due to the high track temps, and that they will need to "nurse the tyres until the end". Sounds like it's going to be a classic race then

[atanatizante]

To me, it looks like France. The pace of the Merc is much better, otherwise, they could not stay in DRS over several laps. This is the reason why it is so bad that Perez is not in the game. Now the track position does not help as Merc can easily go for a two stop with Ham with an undercut and a one stop with Bot.

I think Ves needs to gamble on a two-stop. But once he goes aggressive with an earlier stop he needs to pass both Mercs on the track....

Yeah, it seems to me too. This time Merc has the upper hand in high-speed corners and RB traditionally on lower ones, especially with this high RW level they went for thinking on a one-stop strategy, bearing in mind the reinforced tyres would help them in contrast to Barca race.

From Merc standpoint of view, HAM needs to go to a 2 stopper to have a clear air in front, get their top speed advantage and a possible SC phase.

Regarding the sprint race and think it was just an opportunity to satisfy the TV broadcasts over the world with more ads and stuff.

It`s the third time when HAM lost the place to VER but both in Barca and here VER was on the gripper spot, something that we could see at F2 races and apart from HAM wheel spin BOT has had the same good get away ...

[InsaneX_Badger]

With these high temps, would this favour RBR or Merc? Or is it so close it's basically who ever is in front and clean air?