2021 British Grand Prix - Silverstone, July 16 - 18

[DChemTech]

Ok, I hope Max takes a page out of your book, and keeps turning in everytime there's a car on the inside, completely ignoring their existence.

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

Moment of contact.

https://imgur.com/a/L85u1A7

I'll let you decide who has more space to play with.

What does it matter who has more space? What matters is that there is enough space. Max is not obliged to let his rival pass easily as if he were Bottas making space.

[Restomaniac]

Ok, I hope Max takes a page out of your book, and keeps turning in everytime there's a car on the inside, completely ignoring their existence.

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

I would expect more cautious approach from a 7time world champion, specially the way Hamilton presents himself to the public, as a person of reason. He could have waited for the next straight. If their roles were reversed, those who are now defending Lewis, would say that Max was too agressive.

Both of them need to start using their heads.

So he needs to back out AGAIN to overly aggressive Verstappen. Heaven forbid he defends himself.

[nimoraca]

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

Moment of contact.

https://imgur.com/a/L85u1A7

I'll let you decide who has more space to play with.

What does it matter who has more space? What matters is that there is enough space. Max is not obliged to let his rival pass easily as if he were Bottas making space.

It matters because both of them can avoid the accident by using the given space, it's just that they do not want that space because it is on a slower line and would cost them the position.

[Big Tea]

Agree. Max didn’t do anything wrong here, nor has he for several seasons. Hard but Fair racing, he always delivers. Others should too, this is what we want to see.

He hasn’t? You only have to look at turn 6 in this very race, where the roles were reversed. Hamilton is ahead going into the corner, yet Max STILL LAUNCHES the car up the inside. Hamilton takes a mega wide line just to avoid a similar incident which happened at Copse later. Hamilton might think he can expect similar respect from Max, but obviously he can’t. And no wonder, since his team has always defended his overly aggressive driving all the time (and still ofc does). I thought he had learned something, but he hasn’t. This time however, he will see that HE himself lost out the most, so he might finally reconsider.

If you want another example, look at T1 in Barcelona, where Lewis has the right to take the line, but doesn’t because he expects Verstappen to make these risky moves. Instead, he thinks of his own championship and tries to get him later in the race instead. Which worked. And that approach would have worked for Verstappen today as well, if he would have thought one step longer.

What happened today is that Lewis saying that he is not longer opening the door in 50/50 situations. It's up to Max to adjust to it or there will be more crashes. when Lewis is under attack he knows when to give way. Not so with Max. Max does not know when to cede way. Ricciardo found out the hard way in Baku 2018, Vettel found out the hard way in Suzuka 2019, and Ocon found out the hard way while trying to unlap himself (poor fella, he even got shoved afterwards by Max) in Brazil 2018. Max expects other racers to get out of his way even when they are entitled to some space. Maybe he is doing too much ghost racing on the sim. Today that attitude bit him hard.

I dont think it is Hamilton 'saying' anything. It is just that if you are leading or close to the table leader it is more prudent to let it go because some point are better than no points. When you are a full win behind, your strategy has to change its balance point to a more 'go for it' attitude. Its risk v returns, and when there are less points left on offer the options change. Nothing personal between drivers, just the way it is

[Mattyw]

Man, people can whine all they want, but Max at the end of the day needs to learn when to dial it down from 100% when racing against other drivers.

Lewis has been backing off in almost every duel theyve had this year, and they've had quite a few.

Max has been aggressively defending every time Lewis comes at him. If you do that every single time, a crash is inevitable and its not guaranteed that you will come out of it with a car that still works.

Max had half a tracks width to his left IF he was thinking about playing it safe. IF he was thinking about not trying to win on lap 1. IF he was thinking about the championship.

Just two corners prior, Lewis went into the corner in front and could have just chopped across to block Max but he played it safe because the consequences of an accident was not worth it.

There is a difference between driving to win races/duels and driving to win championships and I'm not sure Max has figured that out yet.

I'm sure he will figure it out in time, but hopefully not too late.

Yep.

[Restomaniac]

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

Moment of contact.

https://imgur.com/a/L85u1A7

I'll let you decide who has more space to play with.

What does it matter who has more space? What matters is that there is enough space. Max is not obliged to let his rival pass easily as if he were Bottas making space.

That’s fine but also the guy passing doesn’t need to back out because the other guy refuses to see the corner is lost.

[Just_a_fan]

There is nothing wrong to turn in when you’re on the racing line and in front, which Max was.

If he was in front there wouldn't have been contact...

Isn’t the definition of being in front that your nose must be ahead?

Define nose. And ahead.

That's the problem really. Lots of people chuck out phrases like "must be ahead", "was alongside", "had the line" but none of it is really defined anywhere.

Some people say that having your nose up alongside the other car is enough to claim the corner if you're on the inside. By that definition Hamilton had the corner. Others would say you need to further up to claim the corner. A lot of it comes down to who the driver is and who the poster is, sadly. Fan driven arguments are difficult to get any meaningful definitions.

[Shrieker]

What does it matter who has more space?

That's a laughable notion.

[DChemTech]

Moment of contact.

https://imgur.com/a/L85u1A7

I'll let you decide who has more space to play with.

What does it matter who has more space? What matters is that there is enough space. Max is not obliged to let his rival pass easily as if he were Bottas making space.

It matters because both of them can avoid the accident by using the given space, it's just that they do not want that space because it is on a slower line and would cost them the position.

And so its a racing incident, as I mentioned before. There is no ground to exclusively blame Max for not leaving space, as some seem to be keen on doing.

[ringo]

Well Max can keep doing what he is doing.
He had a 32 point avdantage he could have only lost 7 today.
He is welcome to keep turning in with a car 90% alongside.
If cannot do basic math to realize he can play it safe and protect his run of points then he doesnt deserve to be champion.
Keep playing big bad red bully bull and see ehat happens when the points are counted at the end of the season.

[F1NAC]

Ok, I hope Max takes a page out of your book, and keeps turning in everytime there's a car on the inside, completely ignoring their existence.

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

I would expect more cautious approach from a 7time world champion, specially the way Hamilton presents himself to the public, as a person of reason. He could have waited for the next straight. If their roles were reversed, those who are now defending Lewis, would say that Max was too agressive.

Both of them need to start using their heads.

Did you watch the sprint race? Had he lifted and left Max go, he would lose the momentum and ability to keep up close for the hangar straight. This circuit is trash for racing with these cars. Look at Sainz - Ricciardo. Or Leclerc Hamilton. Once in 1,1.5 secs it is difficult to close the gap.

To win the championship, not only you have to be the fastest. But also consistent. Judge when to back off. Something that Max cannot execute and where Lewis comes with his experience.

[Shrieker]

Keep playing big bad red bully bull and see ehat happens when the points are counted at the end of the season.

This is the root of his problem. He has been bullying a lot of drivers (incuding Lewis) for a long time, and the stewards almost always turned a blind eye. Thinks he can get away with it all the time.

[jz11]

Ok, I hope Max takes a page out of your book, and keeps turning in everytime there's a car on the inside, completely ignoring their existence.

He didn’t ignore Lewis’ existence. In fact, Lewis had more than enough room on the inside and it actually was him not staying close to the apex.

Moment of contact.

https://imgur.com/a/L85u1A7

I'll let you decide who has more space to play with. To help a little bit: Ham has less than a car's width to play with. In contrast, Max has many car's width of space to play with. He takes all the risk. While Hamilton clearly doesn't. You can see it clearly in the video as well.



When they're side by side and going straight (way before turning into the corner), Hamilton leaves space -space he can play with to open up copse that little bit more- to be safe.

Lewis understeered into Maxes line and missed his apex, there are no two ways about it, look at the rest of the turn, he barely stayed on the track on the exit and even then he was so slow that LEC immediately overtook him, he simply divebombed that corner trying to carry way too much speed - that is why he was given the penalty, which was much too lenient IMO considering what is at stake and his racing experience, he should have not tried that move on Max there period

I'm not saying he did it on purpose or any that sort of thing, it was a racing incident/accident, Max had a much quicker cornering car and Lewis didn't, that also played into this, maybe he expected for Max to be just slightly ahead (and Max was thinking the same), he simply wanted to slot in right after Max in that corner to hopefully keep the attack going on, I seriously don't think he expected to overtake Max there, and I wouldn't believe a word of his after the incident, it is all PR now

and the reason he didn't want to lift/brake more was because he would lose a lot, LEC would certainly take him (and he did), and might have lost another place right there

[Hammerfist]

He hasn’t? You only have to look at turn 6 in this very race, where the roles were reversed. Hamilton is ahead going into the corner, yet Max STILL LAUNCHES the car up the inside. Hamilton takes a mega wide line just to avoid a similar incident which happened at Copse later. Hamilton might think he can expect similar respect from Max, but obviously he can’t. And no wonder, since his team has always defended his overly aggressive driving all the time (and still ofc does). I thought he had learned something, but he hasn’t. This time however, he will see that HE himself lost out the most, so he might finally reconsider.

If you want another example, look at T1 in Barcelona, where Lewis has the right to take the line, but doesn’t because he expects Verstappen to make these risky moves. Instead, he thinks of his own championship and tries to get him later in the race instead. Which worked. And that approach would have worked for Verstappen today as well, if he would have thought one step longer.

What happened today is that Lewis saying that he is not longer opening the door in 50/50 situations. It's up to Max to adjust to it or there will be more crashes. when Lewis is under attack he knows when to give way. Not so with Max. Max does not know when to cede way. Ricciardo found out the hard way in Baku 2018, Vettel found out the hard way in Suzuka 2019, and Ocon found out the hard way while trying to unlap himself (poor fella, he even got shoved afterwards by Max) in Brazil 2018. Max expects other racers to get out of his way even when they are entitled to some space. Maybe he is doing too much ghost racing on the sim. Today that attitude bit him hard.

I dont think it is Hamilton 'saying' anything. It is just that if you are leading or close to the table leader it is more prudent to let it go because some point are better than no points. When you are a full win behind, your strategy has to change its balance point to a more 'go for it' attitude. Its risk v returns, and when there are less points left on offer the options change. Nothing personal between drivers, just the way it is

It's important to lay some ground rules because otherwise Max is just going to bully him off the track for the remainder of the season and you can't just wait and play the long game forever as the Redbull car is only getting faster and the margins for opportunities get smaller as more races unfold. Hamilton has to ensure that going forward Max shows more respect in his race craft. He said it himself in one of his post race interviews.

[Just_a_fan]

He was given room. What more should he have done? Go off like Leclerc? There have been plenty of times when critique of his moves was in order, but in my view, not in this case. He wasnt making it easy on his rival, but he surely left room.

He went off track in turn 1 in order to stay ahead. Should have given the place up there and then.

Thats a different point and could have been discussed by the stewards had the accident not happened. It does not in any way change the notion that there was sufficient room for Hamilton in thr corner where the incident happened.

Note that i am not blaming Hamilton either. It was a racing incident in my view. But putting the blame on Verstappen not giving enough room or so just doesn't make sense here.

It is a different incident, but it's also the point that had he given up the place, as required by the rules, he wouldn't have been in the incident with Hamilton at Copse. It's a trail of consequences, not of blame. Action leads to consequence. Perhaps, had he given up the place he would have won the race. There's a thought. Yes, this is armchair quarterbacking, but it's a point worth noting.