2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix - Yas Marina, Dec 10 - 12

[nevill3]

Carlos would have known that Max would be focussing 100% on Lewis ahead and so could surprise him if an opportunity arose. With restarts often the second placed driver is challenged by the third place driver if they anticipate the restart correctly. Max ws watching for when Lewis put the hammer down but so too would Carlos if he had been allowed to.

[cooken]

How do you think RB could defend the rules, for that one decision, to ensure the title is awarded to them?

They don’t have to as far as I can see? Their defense will be simple imho (not that they’re one of the parties involved other than “witness”), and say it was the race directors decision. What do they have to justify?

https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... 048.12.pdf

Race Director’s Evidence
The Race Director stated that the purpose of Article 48.12 was to remove those lapped cars that
would “interfere” in the racing between the leaders and that in his view Article 48.13 was the one
that applied in this case.
The Race Director also stated that it had long been agreed by all the Teams that where possible
it was highly desirable for the race to end in a “green” condition (i.e. not under a Safety Car).

simple question, was carlos who was in P3 at the time of the restart a leader yes or no?

One way to interpret a "leader" is any car on the lead lap.

[101FlyingDutchman]

Not wasting any more of my time on this. Clearly you either leave it to Merc and their lawyers to sort or you go over the same grounds another 1000x times trying to find a smoking gun. If you’re all so dead clever, maybe the FIA should hire you?

Honestly I can live with whatever gets decided. Court/no court. Reversed decision or not. A ruling by a judge or not at all.

This more than likely gets sorted in an office somewhere with no prying eyes as most of these things always do. But happy for that not to be the case

Question is, will you be able to let it be and move on if it does get dropped?

[timorous]

Carlos would have known that Max would be focussing 100% on Lewis ahead and so could surprise him if an opportunity arose. With restarts often the second placed driver is challenged by the third place driver if they anticipate the restart correctly. Max ws watching for when Lewis put the hammer down but so too would Carlos if he had been allowed to.

With a double Tow into T5 and into T6 an into T9 there is a strong possibility that it could have been 3 abreast into T9.

[dans79]

Not wasting any more of my time on this. Clearly you either leave it to Merc and their lawyers to sort or you go over the same grounds another 1000x times trying to find a smoking gun. If you’re all so dead clever, maybe the FIA should hire you?

They would never hire me because the first thing i would do, is shred the loophole ridden rule book!

[AMG.Tzan]

People wanted drama in F1! They got drama on the final lap...why not get a bit of drama after the final lap??

Although I have absolutely no problem with Verstapen taking the title (he deserved it as much as Lewis and he did nothing wrong on that final lap), I would love to see the whole Mercedes board (i.e Daimler) get involved in that and even threatening to boycott or leave Formula 1 (just like a certain "historic" manufacturer did all these years whenever rules weren't to its liking) just for the drama of it!!

At least if Mercedes manages to win the appeal they and Lewis himself can show the world that they got deceived by Masi's decisions! No need to overturn Max's championship though...

[Starkblood80]

Not wasting any more of my time on this. Clearly you either leave it to Merc and their lawyers to sort or you go over the same grounds another 1000x times trying to find a smoking gun. If you’re all so dead clever, maybe the FIA should hire you?

Honestly I can live with whatever gets decided. Court/no court. Reversed decision or not. A ruling by a judge or not at all.

This more than likely gets sorted in an office somewhere with no prying eyes as most of these things always do. But happy for that not to be the case

Question is, will you be able to let it be and move on if it does get dropped?

Come on, you know in this world of social media and the internet, whichever way it pans out this will never be dropped.

[Mogster]

Carlos would have known that Max would be focussing 100% on Lewis ahead and so could surprise him if an opportunity arose. With restarts often the second placed driver is challenged by the third place driver if they anticipate the restart correctly. Max ws watching for when Lewis put the hammer down but so too would Carlos if he had been allowed to.

With a double Tow into T5 and into T6 an into T9 there is a strong possibility that it could have been 3 abreast into T9.

That could have been fantastic, it would have been interesting to see how Max would have dealt with the situation if he’d been forced to watch his mirrors also. Sainz was on old tyres though wasn’t he?

[PlatinumZealot]

A big part of the problem is that for some reason the RD seems to have entertainment within his remit. Really, the RD should give zero consideration for entertainment value in his decision making. Reason being, entertainment value is nearly proportional to chaos, which is inversely proportional to safety. So decision making based on improving the show will in most cases increase danger.

I think most of us can appreciate that having some of the lapped cars in the mix with the field bunched up like that was a mess and to quote Sainz "dangerous". Clearly, the safest course of action world have been to let all the lapped cars go past - which is precisely why that's what happens 99.9% of the time.

So the RD compromised safety for entertainment. That should most definitely not be happening.

That's correct. The unlapping rule was created for safety.

Singapore... 2011? It was when there was almost a huge pile up after the safety car restart. This is the real reason for clearing the track. Not for racing.

When Masi leaves some cars unlapped it means that he thinks it is unsafe for Max if he has to race his way to Lewis... But not unsafe for the other drivers who have to dodge lapped cars?

Anyway. Again. I don't think this is Masi's doing. I think it comes from higher up.

[timorous]

Carlos would have known that Max would be focussing 100% on Lewis ahead and so could surprise him if an opportunity arose. With restarts often the second placed driver is challenged by the third place driver if they anticipate the restart correctly. Max ws watching for when Lewis put the hammer down but so too would Carlos if he had been allowed to.

With a double Tow into T5 and into T6 an into T9 there is a strong possibility that it could have been 3 abreast into T9.

That could have been fantastic, it would have been interesting to see how Max would have dealt with the situation if he’d been forced to watch his mirrors also. Sainz was on old tyres though wasn’t he?

He was but with Max and Lewis battling he would have had a better exit out of T5 than the pair of them and could have closed down the gap and he likely would have had a better run through T6/7 as well.

Maybe with Sainz there Max does not go for the move into T5 knowing that it puts him at a disadvantage to Sainz. It totally changes the decision making IMO.

[AngusF1]

Lol at this whole farce. Totally manipulated result by the umpire blatantly ignoring the rules for the sake of Racetainment. Mercedes ought to sue to hell and threaten to quit the sport.

Listening to some interviews with Masi, the man sounds to me like an idiot.

Wikipedia lists his studies as Marketing at TAFE! That's an Australian third-tier form of tertiary education which is essentially a trade school.

My opinion: Masi is likely a stooge of the American owners and the FIA, chosen for being not too smart and possessing an enthusiasm for "the show".

[Big Tea]

Without replying to any of the posts above in particular, can I point out Red Bull do not have to prove or justify anything. The 'problem' if there is one is with a representative if F1/FIA.
Red Bull broke on rules, they acted on information and instruction of the race director. They have nothing to answer for.

[Aesop]

Short version: Masi should've let the lapped cars unlap in lap 56.
Long version: 164 pages and counting.

[Just_a_fan]

Without replying to any of the posts above in particular, can I point out Red Bull do not have to prove or justify anything. The 'problem' if there is one is with a representative if F1/FIA.
Red Bull broke on rules, they acted on information and instruction of the race director. They have nothing to answer for.

Absolutely. Horner and Wolff were both shouting at Masi but other than that, the teams and drivers did nothing wrong. It's all about the way the FIA's delegate ran the race and what it means for future races and championships.

[timorous]

Short version: Masi should've let the lapped cars unlap in lap 56.
Long version: 164 pages and counting.

Not possible.

MSC went past marshalls on track as they jumped the barrier. 9s later Lewis started L57.

By the time RC is aware the track is now clear and has relayed the unlap order to the teams and the teams have relayed that to the drivers L57 has started.

If if that happened instantly MSC still has to negotiate the cars infront of him safely and he will not overtake Lewis until after L57 starts meaning that L58 should be run under the safety car.