Christian Horner under Investigation

[Shakeman]

In 1859, we find the proverb well and truly in print in recognisable form. The preacher C. H. Spurgeon quoted it in one of his sermons:

If you want truth to go round the world you must hire an express train to pull it; but if you want a lie to go round the world, it will fly; it is as light as a feather, and a breath will carry it. It is well said in the old Proverb, ‘A lie will go round the world while truth is pulling its boots on.’

I almost put that idiom in my post!

It's so true.

[Unc1eM0nty]

"The lawyer is on vacation". Is this supposed to be a cliffhanger?

Sounds like a "Do not Disturb" note on a Hotel door.

Yeah this holiday stuff is B S

Who would appoint a lawyer for such an urgent matter knowing they'll be away at the beech next week

[koolway]

If even bernie can't defend you, your carrer is finished

Ex-Formula 1 boss Bernie Ecclestone, has also intervened and advised Horner to resign from team boss in order to avoid further damage to himself and his family

Why would BE intervene and be advising CH to go? That implies BE knows everything about the case and is in a position to have judged CH guilty. Who in RB GmbH has briefed BE in such fine detail that he can come to any conclusion whatsoever? Why would RB be briefing BE when BE has nothing to do with RB GmbH, F1 or CH? Why?

Does it not cross anyone's mind how absurd the statement is? Defending oneself against an allegation is NOT further damaging yourself or your family, it is quite the reverse. This is a workplace dispute, there are two sides of the story which no one knows outside a small number of people inside the inner sanctum of RB GmbH.

I expect BE was door stopped by a hack and got a quote similar to if not identical to, 'If Horner is guilty he should go...' which then gets 'translated into the Newspeak 'BE urges CH to go for the sake of himself and family.' Then it's copied round the world at the speed of light and appears in shite publication after shiter publication for those who have taken leave of their senses and ability to reason to consume and pass on.

Just think about what you are reading and just how implausible it is before doing the legwork for these miserable clickbait artists.

A lot of assumptions on the fact that BE is over the top ethical, and will only speak publicly if he has omniscience on a subject.
History has shown that he will speak on any particular F1 related topic and give his "limited" point of view as if he mastered all ins and outs of the subject...
He probably knows what happened through CH himself as the two have a close relationship.
Maybe CH sees him as a mentor and seek for advises from time to time... Maybe in this case CH doesn't care about BH POV and BH is burning to tell him what he thinks anyway; may it be directly or through press release...

Anyway, from a journalist POV : BH has hardly ever refused to comment on a topic, he's publicly close to CH, maybe he have insider knowledge on the matter that can leak new info.
If he replies something, it's between himself and CH to settle on whether or not he should have keep his mouth shut or not. The journalist just did his job to find new information : ask people close to the topic if they're willing to share something...

[Wouter]

Horner is present at the shakedown in Silverstone as I expected.

[organic]

Erik van Haren reports that Christian Horner was at Silverstone for the shakedown (which has been confirmed with video) and he plans to be at the car launch on Thursday as well

[taperoo2k]

Erik van Haren reports that Christian Horner was at Silverstone for the shakedown (which has been confirmed with video) and he plans to be at the car launch on Thursday as well

Guess he's not going to step aside voluntary. Doesn't make a lot of difference if the lawyer is on
holiday or not. They will still have to consider the evidence gathered, ask follow up questions if needed and
then write the report. That could take several weeks, anyone expecting an instant result will be disappointed.

[koolway]

...

Let's take a moment to enjoy this post...

**gif removed** > Mod edit

I love it when people fantasize, makes wild assumptions and give intent. That's the definition of speculation.
ie : you have no fact to prove your point...

The only thing you know related to BE statement :
- CH was best man at BE wedding in 2012 & BE was best man at CH wedding in 2015.
So they're more than probably what you can call "close"...
- BE is a grown man, knows how media works and how it can be used to have influence on a matter.
- BE is known to give his 2 cents on every F1 related topic

If your job was to find new information, you can either go :
- to an official source (I guess they're calling RB & RB racing PRs daily...),
- an anonymous internal source (that is willing to leak information and risk his job...),
- or an external source linked to anyone involved. (his wife, child, best friend, ...)

Consequences of all that :
- BE was asked and gave is opinion publicly on the topic.

The corollary of all this :
Has he already give this advice to CH privately? or not... that's between them two to discuss if it was relevant and/or helpful.
Anyway, I'm sure that if needed, BE can call any journalist or press agency to publish a statement to amend or correct what has been published so far...

But if you have new elements to share that are not a fiction you made up in your head, please feel free....
If CH thinks it's sooo detrimental to his case,

[Shakeman]

I saw another 'report' today that suggested Liberty media and F1 themselves are getting worried about how this looks and putting pressure on Red Bull although like every claim there's no detail about what pressure is being applied.

If we are to believe this then it is simply enough for a Team boss to be pressured out of his job on the basis of all the rampant press speculation because it's hurting the license holders? Is this where we are in 2024?

It seems perfectly fine for journalists, I use that term in the loosest possible sense, to write an unquestioning story where all the above is true and there's nothing wrong about a man losing his job because the press are writing a lot of speculation. How about one, just one daring journalist stand up and say so what to Liberty media or so what to F1, every person deserves to be treated fairly and no one in 2024 should lose their job without a fair hearing? Wouldn't that be a refreshing turn of events?

[rijtuig]

Or, it could all mean for some extra episodes for DTS.

[koolway]

If you mistakenly confuse : relating some events through all available public statements as taking a side to fulfill an existing agenda.... that's where you're a victim of your fear of connecting invisible, and perhaps inexistant dots...

The only speculation I made, and discarded directly as irrelevant is :
Has CH discussed it privately with BE before that statement?. Yes or No... it doesn't even matter because in any case : that's a problem between them and they need to discuss between 4 eyes. Nothing more...

BE's statement can be understood in many many ways, let's review possible cases regarding the allegations :
- If such allegations are true :
"CH should leave"...
(ie : He should damage-control the situation; have a NDA, keep the face with a public statement and private settlement, etc...)
- If such allegations are false, made up and the investigation is clearly a witch hunt :
"CH should leave"
(ie : he deserves better, trust is broken between the 2 parties)
- If they have underlying facts to back it up, but were exaggerated with -or even without- intent of a specific agenda. (OR BE doesn't know sh** about the topic, OR any other possibility....) :
"CH should leave"
(ie : personal advice : do not put yourself through all this, imho you will not come out clean ultimately, you have little to gain from this fight for a board that don't deserve you)

Do we know yet which one is applicable ? No...
Does that shine a light on CH's culpability on the (still publicly unknown) charges against him ? Of course not... Only due process and time may ultimately bring light on this.

If you can choose between those 3 cases and be certain that this was the intent of the press-release, then you clearly know something more than we all do, please share it....
You chose one hypothetical path and and use it as a prism to argue on it with your rant on "media" etc...

I'm just saying : Factually, I haven't seen anything, as of now, that makes me lean on guilty or not guilty side...
Just a series of neutral public statement of people directly or indirectly involved. None of those statement makes assumptions on guilt.
- There's an investigation in progress
- CH "entourage" give their opinions on what should be his next move
- F1 & FIA are worried that it's not handle in the cleanest way for F1

Nothing more at the moment, so no need to fantasize on made up intents. Imho : it's not helping CH's case anyway...

[mendis]

Do we know yet which one is applicable ? No...
Does that shine a light on CH's culpability on the (still publicly unknown) charges against him ? Of course not... Only due process and time may ultimately bring light on this.

Is there an official confirmation that there is an investigation? Sorry if I have missed reading one. If there isn't one, why would they release one on the completion of it?

If you can choose between those 3 cases and be certain that this was the intent of the press-release

Do you have a link to the press-release? Sorry, I might have missed. I am really curious.

[koolway]

Here is an article quoting the statement released at AFP London

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/2 ... -behaviour


All sources regarding BE « private advices » refers to f1-insider :
https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-red-bul ... rfe-61671/


Official press releases are not always « publicly available ».
They are provided to press agencies who sell it to news outlet affiliates.

[ThijsMuis]

Here is an article quoting the statement released at AFP London

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/2 ... -behaviour


All sources regarding BE « private advices » refers to f1-insider :
https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-red-bul ... rfe-61671/


Official press releases are not always « publicly available ».
They are provided to press agencies who sell it to news outlet affiliates.

But from this links we have on record Horner denying any wrongdoing.
And like you say neutral statements from Red Bull about the matter. From the theme on the thread it seems the media and GmbH is taking more blame.
The problem is there is history of Horner making statements of innocent and threatening rivals with lawyers.
That doesn't make him guilty now. Due process must happen first and this includes Gmbh, Mintzalff and van haren, who of course have been criticised.
There shouldn't be any guesswork here until we know the facts.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... qualifying

[koolway]

Indeed.
I didn’t mentioned CH statement, as at this stage it’s similar to a guilty/not-guilty plea. He’s just confirming that he was proceeding with the upcoming investigation hearing and defend his case.

In this topic there’s a lot guesswork to make it a “game of thrones”. But “even if…” it’s still speculations and does not prove neither innocence or guilt on the related accusations.
The magnitude of those accusations still being unknown at this stage, as the actions themselves are unknown…

[senja]

Dude, what you repeating, like a parrot, is Bernie Ecclestone statement. Ther is no such thing in that article. Statement is when a journalist quoting what a person said. There is not any quote of Bernie in that article. It's just a baseless rumor, without a reliable source...