2013 British GP - Silverstone

[Regle]

It may have been said before, but the cheering of "fans" when Vettels car gave up the ghost, was a poor show.

The british fans just follow the thoughts of the likes of Hamilton, Alonso and co. Vettel is only there because of the car. So when the car lets go...... YAAAAAAYYYYYY =D>

why poor show ? hamilton can have his share of bad luck , when alonso retires veteel fans can scream, check history and i bet
everytime webber starts next or head of vettel , he gets a poor start and that is always blamed to bad luck.

i strongly feel redbull does tht on purpose BUT if bad luck strike vettel, Brits and other have all right to cheer.

Red Bull are racing for a multi-million constructor's championship. Believing their animosity towards Webber (if any) goes as far as willingly making him start badly and thus risking the championship and their financial future is crazy. Webber going from 4 to 14 or 15 is not in ANYONE'S interest at Red Bull.
But I guess I'm just troll feeding.

[Mandrake]

That was a nice race. The championship isn't looking like a cake walk for Vettel anymore. Mercedes seems to be rounding into great form at the moment.

I just wonder: Who was the manufacturer who couldn't solve their tire eating Problems for 4 years in a row? - Mercedes
Which team was known for poor development speed & success for the last 4 years? - Mercedes
Which team was super quick in qualy, but as quick in falling back through the grid in the opening races? - Mercedes
Which team had a private test with Pirelli? - Mercedes
Which team is now at worst the second fastest car? - Mercedes

Sounds massively fishy and should they indeed be second in WCC and win the WDC it'll be a bad thing for the sport...

Look where Lotus and Ferrari were on race pace, not anywhere near the challenge.....and I doubt they've gone backwards.

[stefan_]

I might be paranoid, but I must admit that went through my mind also: how much progress Mercedes have done in a couple of races really - from having a car that was on fire and in the walls during winter testing and fell through the field like a rock in water during the races to this. But I don't want to get in that zone of discussion with all the Merc fanboys™ around - they just made progress through the well thought updates and developments.

Is it true that Rosberg set a purple sector on yellows?

[banibhusan]

Sounds massively fishy and should they indeed be second in WCC and win the WDC it'll be a bad thing for the sport...

Look where Lotus and Ferrari were on race pace, not anywhere near the challenge.....and I doubt they've gone backwards.

Why is it a bad thing for the sport now? Things have been like this for decades. There have been many such championships that have been tainted for some or the other reason. Now just because Mercedes did it, it becomes a bad thing for the sport!!

Regarding Lotus and the Ferrari, they may have designed the car that's tire friendly, but its not an all round fast car that can show that consistent race pace in all the races. At least as of now, we haven't seen it. Whereas the Merc and RBR have controlled their tire issues to some extent and are doing a very fine job. So, IMO, the credit goes to Merc and RBR.

[Mandrake]

I don't mind clever engineering, outside of the box thinking or borderline developments outside the "spirit of the rules" (e.g. DDD, throttle maps, flexiwings etc.). It's what F1 should be about, develop things other have not thought about.

What I do not like is what Merc did, test illegally with apparently gaining a significant advantage, while getting away with it under reasons I cannot understand at all.

I hoped for the last 3 years that MGP would finally step up into the game of the big ones, but they have failed every year since, and I highly doubt this year is all "natural" development.

This race it was evident that every team performed to my expectations, RBR possibly a bit better than I imagined, but I was expecting the Mercs to tumble through the field again. However with Hamilton in particular it was the absolute opposite. He looked to have the best tire performance of everyone.

[Hail22]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6rmCH6vQ9E[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anLsuI53tnI[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JmcBwdFdrE[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46ymO8HvHBE[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCNb2vH7G8s[/youtube]

[Cocles]

That was a nice race. The championship isn't looking like a cake walk for Vettel anymore. Mercedes seems to be rounding into great form at the moment.

I just wonder: Who was the manufacturer who couldn't solve their tire eating Problems for 4 years in a row? - Mercedes
Which team was known for poor development speed & success for the last 4 years? - Mercedes
Which team was super quick in qualy, but as quick in falling back through the grid in the opening races? - Mercedes
Which team had a private test with Pirelli? - Mercedes
Which team is now at worst the second fastest car? - Mercedes

Sounds massively fishy and should they indeed be second in WCC and win the WDC it'll be a bad thing for the sport...

Look where Lotus and Ferrari were on race pace, not anywhere near the challenge.....and I doubt they've gone backwards.

You're overgeneralizing, and perhaps naysaying a bit.

I don't remember the BGP-001 having this level of tire problems.

The teams development pace has been fine. When it slowed or even stopped there was always a very overt reason (firing their head aerodynamicist while also shutting down their windtunnel for example). What the team IS known for is starting off on the wrong foot. The W02's SWB was a dead-end as was the W03's DDD. The BGP-001's development pace and W01 as a whole were both products of a skeleton crew.

As for being quick in quali, you're falling prey to confirmation bias. They've been average in quali with flashes of brilliance up until this season. I believe you're just remember this season and those earlier flashes of brilliance.

Fact is, with or without the test, the car has been progressively improving all season.

You seem to be making Merc out to be a crap team that was suddenly awesome overnight due to a single test. Was that your intention?

[fritticaldi]

The FIA is really protecting Mercedes as Nico Rosberg only gets a reprimand for ignoring yellow flags.

[Mandrake]

You seem to be making Merc out to be a crap team that was suddenly awesome overnight due to a single test. Was that your intention?

This is now more about Merc than the race, but as it's discussing a development Merc showed this particular race, I'd like to ask moderators to leave it in this race thread.

Fact is, Merc have not been able to make a good car for the last 4 years. And all the in-season development was ineffective. Last season I hoped that MSC would rise back to the top after the initial good performance of the car, but throughout the whole year they've gotten worse and worse. It's mostly been about the tires.

This season, it started all over again and in Barcelona they were NOWHERE! The turnaround they've made since Barcelona is remarkable, is RedBull or McLaren (at their best times) worthy. And that's what I don't buy and that's what screws the championship for me as they seem to have overtaken Ferrari and Lotus. Imagine Vettel had not retired and Lewis had won the race, The gap to Alonso/Kimi would be so much bigger.

Given the pace AND tire performance of Merc in Silverstone, not even Vettel/Webber/RBR could have done anything against it. Merc have gone from worst tire users to best in 3 races? Sorry mate, doesn't happen that easily!

[Cocles]

And all the in-season development was ineffective.

Not true, the W02 maintained its gap with RBR throughout the season. This was also the one season prior to 2013 in which we didn't have an overt reason for development to be down. This is primarily why I responded to you. Your assessment of the team struck me as a bit biased, selectively remembering things (claiming they've never had decent development and always had good qualifying, etc.). Because of this, I think your opinion is distorted.

The test certainly had an effect. I'll drink to that. Your overly low assessment of this team however is exaggerating that effect. Your baseline was too low. And now back to the race.

[nhojekim]

That was a nice race. The championship isn't looking like a cake walk for Vettel anymore. Mercedes seems to be rounding into great form at the moment.

I just wonder: Who was the manufacturer who couldn't solve their tire eating Problems for 4 years in a row? - Mercedes
Which team was known for poor development speed & success for the last 4 years? - Mercedes
Which team was super quick in qualy, but as quick in falling back through the grid in the opening races? - Mercedes
Which team had a private test with Pirelli? - Mercedes
Which team is now at worst the second fastest car? - Mercedes

Sounds massively fishy and should they indeed be second in WCC and win the WDC it'll be a bad thing for the sport...

Look where Lotus and Ferrari were on race pace, not anywhere near the challenge.....and I doubt they've gone backwards.

You're overgeneralizing, and perhaps naysaying a bit.

I don't remember the BGP-001 having this level of tire problems.

The teams development pace has been fine. When it slowed or even stopped there was always a very overt reason (firing their head aerodynamicist while also shutting down their windtunnel for example). What the team IS known for is starting off on the wrong foot. The W02's SWB was a dead-end as was the W03's DDD. The BGP-001's development pace and W01 as a whole were both products of a skeleton crew.

Back then, f1 had bridgestones where there were really, not even one team having tire problems. Even the back markers back then had no problems with the tires. I don't think brawnGP had a skeleton crew, brawnGP was built with full workforce with Honda money.

[dren]

Mercedes finally produced a car with all of their extremely experienced and tallented heads in place. The car is genuinely fast, which was evident even before the "secret" test. It is a huge improvement over the overly complex W03. The tire issue has caused a lot of teams problems, but Mercedes more. Many things are coming to fruition now. They are/have fine tuned their fric system which likely caused teething issues the last few years. They designed the rear of the car to be easily changed, which it was yet again for Silverstone. They have made several rear suspension changes and are now seeing some gains. The test surely did give them some benefit but we can't say that all of a sudden one test magically transformed everything.

Silverstone has been a Red Bull dominant track. For Mercedes to perform this good at Silverstone it shows how far the aerodynamics on the Mercedes has come since the cars before it.

[Vasconia]

You seem to be making Merc out to be a crap team that was suddenly awesome overnight due to a single test. Was that your intention?

This is now more about Merc than the race, but as it's discussing a development Merc showed this particular race, I'd like to ask moderators to leave it in this race thread.

Fact is, Merc have not been able to make a good car for the last 4 years. And all the in-season development was ineffective. Last season I hoped that MSC would rise back to the top after the initial good performance of the car, but throughout the whole year they've gotten worse and worse. It's mostly been about the tires.

This season, it started all over again and in Barcelona they were NOWHERE! The turnaround they've made since Barcelona is remarkable, is RedBull or McLaren (at their best times) worthy. And that's what I don't buy and that's what screws the championship for me as they seem to have overtaken Ferrari and Lotus. Imagine Vettel had not retired and Lewis had won the race, The gap to Alonso/Kimi would be so much bigger.

Given the pace AND tire performance of Merc in Silverstone, not even Vettel/Webber/RBR could have done anything against it. Merc have gone from worst tire users to best in 3 races? Sorry mate, doesn't happen that easily!

That test in Barcelona made the difference, I would like to know what they checked because the improvement in only a few races has been impressive and very suspicius. Brawn has done it once again, it was illegal but he knew that FIA doesnt want to push Mercedes too hard because of the risk of leaving F1. Clever guy Brawn.

About people´s reaction to Vettel´s retirement, I expect more from the English F1 fans, you know, its Silverstone, people know about F1 and theoretically respect all the F1 drivers, so it was sad to see that reaction.

[myurr]

That test in Barcelona made the difference, I would like to know what they checked because the improvement in only a few races has been impressive and very suspicius. Brawn has done it once again, it was illegal but he knew that FIA doesnt want to push Mercedes too hard because of the risk of leaving F1. Clever guy Brawn.

Prove it. How did that test make a difference. Why did Merc's test make such a difference when Ferrari's testing with a 2011 chassis but 2013 mechanicals and aero (presuming Horner's accusation is accurate) not make such a difference?

If it was all such a clever ruse by Brawn then why did he ask, and obtain, permission from Charlie Whiting and why did the tribunal rule that they acted in good faith?

[foxmulder_ms]

I see nothing wrong with cheering to Vettel's retirement. If you are fan of any other driver in the championship that was an event to cheer for. It is a sporting event people are aspirant. I was clapping in front of my TV to see that too. :p

Also, Lotus made a huge mistake with not pitting Raikkonen, I couldn't believe that. It costed him an easy second finish and a shot to win.