2021 Portuguese Grand Prix - Portimão, Apr 30 - May 02

[tpe]

Yeah, IIRC they've never done something like that. DRS always ends when the driver starts braking. There'd have to be some rule changes to allow it to close 'early', and then a bunch of loopholes like DRS taking several seconds to close

Actually no.
Because remember the ECU is controlled by FIA. And the DRS actuator is/could be standard.
And in any case, this is easily monitored.
I like the above idea TBH, it's really interesting and FIA should at least test it in one GP.

The DRS is hydraulically activated it has to be activated by the driver and it closes when the drivers press the brakes... I don’t think it would be feasible for it to be automatically closed and it will probably created a safety issue too.


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The driver just presses a button. In any case, the technology exists and it's feasible, if they want to actually do it. But we go off topic, unfortunately.

[PlatinumZealot]

Rather than starting the DRS zone later, would it be better to start it early and end it early? That way the following driver gets to close on the leading driver but probably loses DRS before he passes the other car. Then the approach to the braking zone would be more like a traditional situation. Sometimes, we see the following car being able to be several car lengths ahead by the time the cars brake for the corner.

I guess the DRS system would have to close automatically on passing a the end of the DRS zone, which adds a level of complication.

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

[F1Krof]

What do we reckon, a Max domination or a close fight?

[Just_a_fan]

Rather than starting the DRS zone later, would it be better to start it early and end it early? That way the following driver gets to close on the leading driver but probably loses DRS before he passes the other car. Then the approach to the braking zone would be more like a traditional situation. Sometimes, we see the following car being able to be several car lengths ahead by the time the cars brake for the corner.

I guess the DRS system would have to close automatically on passing a the end of the DRS zone, which adds a level of complication.

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

[SmallSoldier]

Rather than starting the DRS zone later, would it be better to start it early and end it early? That way the following driver gets to close on the leading driver but probably loses DRS before he passes the other car. Then the approach to the braking zone would be more like a traditional situation. Sometimes, we see the following car being able to be several car lengths ahead by the time the cars brake for the corner.

I guess the DRS system would have to close automatically on passing a the end of the DRS zone, which adds a level of complication.

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

It is hard enough as it is today to complete an overtake even with DRS (unless there is a massive difference in the pace of the cars) that making it close earlier and automatically will ensure way less overtakes than we have today, not the outcome we all want I guess.


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[Just_a_fan]

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

It is hard enough as it is today to complete an overtake even with DRS (unless there is a massive difference in the pace of the cars) that making it close earlier and automatically will ensure way less overtakes than we have today, not the outcome we all want I guess.


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I guess that depends on whether one views the number of overtakes as being a metric of good racing. Overtaking should always be possible but not easy. Lots of overtaking isn't the same as good racing. A good race can have one overtake so long as there has been lots of overtaking opportunities.

[cheeRS]

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

It is hard enough as it is today to complete an overtake even with DRS (unless there is a massive difference in the pace of the cars) that making it close earlier and automatically will ensure way less overtakes than we have today, not the outcome we all want I guess.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I guess that depends on whether one views the number of overtakes as being a metric of good racing. Overtaking should always be possible but not easy. Lots of overtaking isn't the same as good racing. A good race can have one overtake so long as there has been lots of overtaking opportunities.

This is just the kind of shortsighted thinking that has caused F1 to get into the mess it's in. If you've been a fan long enough you'll remember the races in the last 20 years before DRS and how difficult it was to pass. DRS is an imperfect idea to effect overtakes, but the idea about it closing earlier needlessly complicates it further. Rather than augment it, get rid of it altogether and have a push to pass/boost system a-la Indycar where the leading driver call also defend with it.

[PlatinumZealot]

Rather than starting the DRS zone later, would it be better to start it early and end it early? That way the following driver gets to close on the leading driver but probably loses DRS before he passes the other car. Then the approach to the braking zone would be more like a traditional situation. Sometimes, we see the following car being able to be several car lengths ahead by the time the cars brake for the corner.

I guess the DRS system would have to close automatically on passing a the end of the DRS zone, which adds a level of complication.

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

There will be no skill involved because it will be automatic.

Say your DRS ending line, no... infact, it will be a an "ending zone" like in sprint relays. It has to be zone because at 300km/hr no driver can close the DRS at the exact point of crossing a line. It will be a DRS end-zone of say 50 to 100 meters.

What happens in that zone? Suppose the driver closes the DRS when he still hasn't passed yet? What an odd thing to witness - coming full steam to overtake then... Nothing.. What happens the zone is reached after he passes? Passes yeah! Oh?! What is this?! A mysterious 1g of deceleration in the middle of the straight? ! Weird! What will happen in DRS train? What if the driver doesn't close the DRS in that 50 meter zone? (which goes by in 0.6 seconds!) Will the stewards penalize the driver for this?!! They might just screw it and it ends up being automatically closed at the end of the day. Meaning no driver skill and it will be boring, probably even dangerous? Suppose the driver encounters a wet patch in the closing zone? What if another driver is using DRS behind? Too much things to screw up. All for achieving nothing more than the current system achieves.

Imo best to leave the DRS to end under natural braking at the end of the straight. Less Janky, better appearance, more natural for the drivers.

[etusch]

A mercedes man declared which is best.

Wolff: "We still don't have an engine that can match the Honda"

https://racingnews365.nl/wolff-we-hebbe ... n-de-honda

[maxxer]

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

There will be no skill involved because it will be automatic.

Say your DRS ending line, no... infact, it will be a an "ending zone" like in sprint relays. It has to be zone because at 300km/hr no driver can close the DRS at the exact point of crossing a line. It will be a DRS end-zone of say 50 to 100 meters.

What happens in that zone? Suppose the driver closes the DRS when he still hasn't passed yet? What an odd thing to witness - coming full steam to overtake then... Nothing.. What happens the zone is reached after he passes? Passes yeah! Oh?! What is this?! A mysterious 1g of deceleration in the middle of the straight? ! Weird! What will happen in DRS train? What if the driver doesn't close the DRS in that 50 meter zone? (which goes by in 0.6 seconds!) Will the stewards penalize the driver for this?!! They might just screw it and it ends up being automatically closed at the end of the day. Meaning no driver skill and it will be boring, probably even dangerous? Suppose the driver encounters a wet patch in the closing zone? What if another driver is using DRS behind? Too much things to screw up. All for achieving nothing more than the current system achieves.

Imo best to leave the DRS to end under natural braking at the end of the straight. Less Janky, better appearance, more natural for the drivers.

lol was thinking the same DRS open pull out of the slipstream and suddenly bang like you hit the brakes somewhere on the straight. Might even lose a place if another stayed close behind

[LHamilton]

I'm thinking Hamilton wins this with something like 5 seconds from Verstappen. Max were some 30 seconds of last time around, but with their improvements this season that will be closer. In the beginning of the race there will be fighting between Verstappen and Hamilton, but Hamilton will have better pace in the latter parts of the stints.

P3 will most probably be Bottas or Perez, but I'm gonna spice it up a bit and put Leclerc in there. In fact, I'm doing a bold prediction of putting Leclerc third both in Q and R. Will be close in both though.

After them follows the McLarens and Gasly. Kimster will managed to get a point.

Is Portimao a circuit that is frequently used? Because I'm thinking of the resurface 'problem' that happend last time out and if the grip would be significantly better.

Do we know anything about track limits and where it is being looked at? Because I'm thinking exit turn one will surely be one with the liberties that were taken there last time out.

[mclaren111]

A mercedes man declared which is best.

Wolff: "We still don't have an engine that can match the Honda"

https://racingnews365.nl/wolff-we-hebbe ... n-de-honda

Fake News...

[SirBastianVettel]

Do we know anything about track limits and where it is being looked at? Because I'm thinking exit turn one will surely be one with the liberties that were taken there last time out.

[Juzh]

Rather than starting the DRS zone later, would it be better to start it early and end it early? That way the following driver gets to close on the leading driver but probably loses DRS before he passes the other car. Then the approach to the braking zone would be more like a traditional situation. Sometimes, we see the following car being able to be several car lengths ahead by the time the cars brake for the corner.

I guess the DRS system would have to close automatically on passing a the end of the DRS zone, which adds a level of complication.

The drivers close the DRS by themselves in order to brake for the next corner, so if you remove that manual element of using the DRS by disabling it automatically earlier on the straight, there will be less driver skill involved to get that last meter of braking in qualifying or make that last lunge to pass in the race. Just best to leave it as it is ending into the corner.

Yes, the drivers close it now, but they do it well after they have carried out the overtake. No skill involved there. More skill involved in automatically closing it 300m before the corner and making the overtaking driver make the overtake work. That's where the skill lies.

So best not to leave it as it is. Best to change it and make the driver carry out the overtake once DRS has allowed him to get close. In effect DRS would remove the problem caused by the cars not being able to follow each other. DRS would put the driver in the tow but not give him a free pass. Then we'd get to see drivers fighting under braking. Not like now where the overtaking driver is 20m ahead by the time they hit the brake pedal.

Something like this would be quite feasible actually and not a bad idea. Nowadays there's anywhere from 21-29 mini-sector time loops installed on tracks. These mini-sectors can easily detect when one car is lets say 2 tenths behind another one and could close DRS automatically. 2 tenths distance is more than enough to put a car in contention for an overtake when you have inherent overspeed from drs anyway and slipstream alone is very powerful from that close.

For example in Imola:

Lets say DRS shuts off automatically at marked location if a car is timed at less than 0.2s behind a car in front. Rest is up to the driver.

[Juzh]

Do we know anything about track limits and where it is being looked at? Because I'm thinking exit turn one will surely be one with the liberties that were taken there last time out.

https://i.imgur.com/XWipSEv.png

It's the same as last year, except in T15 limit is now on white line.

This would no longer be allowed this year: