Australian GP 2010 - Melbourne

[marcush.]

I am amazed that not only the tabloids but also guys in this forum would bash him.
he was dead last after falling victim to a first corner incident that he did not cause ,he was not even involded in that tangle between Button and Alonso.He had to
pit instantly for a new nose -in contrast to alonso who could battle on- so to still bag a point seems to be am achievement to me and not the sign of a guy to forget...
but then who cares...he was only 10th ..and vettel did not even bag a single point..so he should retire as well given he cannot win in the fastest car ,right?

[Miguel]

If my memory serves me, there was exactly one car between Alonso and Schumacher when racing resumed. I think it was di Grassi, but I'm not sure. However, it may be likely that something small broke in Schumacher's car, leading to a small performance hit.

By the way, and not trying to take much merit off Hamilton, because he really drove great, his overtakings were helped by having something like 7km/h advantage of top speed over the Ferrari. The advantage was as much as 15 km/h with respect to the Red Bulls.

[WhiteBlue]

I am amazed that not only the tabloids but also guys in this forum would bash him.
he was dead last after falling victim to a first corner incident that he did not cause ,he was not even involded in that tangle between Button and Alonso.He had to
pit instantly for a new nose -in contrast to alonso who could battle on- so to still bag a point seems to be am achievement to me and not the sign of a guy to forget...
but then who cares...he was only 10th ..and vettel did not even bag a single point..so he should retire as well given he cannot win in the fastest car ,right?

Let's not forget that Schumacher also came second at the pit stop for slick tyres and had to wait several seconds. Together with the added time for a nose change at his first stop that cost him 13 seconds in addition to the 25 seconds that a regular additional pit stop costs. Add another three or four seconds for being forced off track in turn one and you get a penalty of 42 seconds before you even consider sitting behind cars with similar race pace. On top you have to consider that the car is 0.7 s slower than the Ferrari in race trim under same conditions. People always seem to bash Schumacher regardless of what he says and does. I liked his second move on Alguersuari. It was a hard but fair overtaking maneuver which took advantage of a very small error on Alguersuari's side. That is the kind of racing I expect Schumacher to show. I'm totally confident that he will also enjoy better races when and if the Merc becomes better.

Good example was his communication with Alonso after qualifying. In the German interview Schumacher told that he asked Alonso whether the team had told Alonso that Schumacher was approaching during his in lap. Alonso denied that and the chat was over. Even on this site the English speaking press made up a fancy story that Schumacher asked Alonso whether the team had told Alonso to block Schumacher. A totally different story but consistent with the trend to always spin the story for a villain aspect.

A popular prediction was that Schumacher would use unfair driving tactics as soon as he realized that he was in no position to win a race. That hasn't happened so far. He seems to be enjoying himself although the car is by no means competitive.

Let's review the turn one events by sequence:



They arrive at the corner Schumacher ahead on the outside, Alonso on the line and Button behind.



It is clear that Kubica is behind Alonso and Button could have braked much harder and earlier without endangering him.



Button still far behind while Alonso and Schumacher are looking like making the corner.




Alonso and Schumacher turning in while Button holds his line although being far behind Alonso.

Button's left front tyre hits Alonso's right rear wheel and starts to swing him around.



Alonso power sliding through the turn. Button manages to stay clear with Kubica also clear on the brakes.



Button obviously starts to brake stronger in order to avoid making another collision.



Alonso starts to loose the tail that whips out towards Schumacher.



the tail comes round some more while Schumacher turns in further unaware of Alonso's problem



Schumacher is being hit by Alonso's left rear wheel.



Schumacher forced off track, Alonso swings further around. Button and Kubica stay clear by turning or even braking.



Alonso still swinging while situation evolves.




Schumacher escapes gravel.




Hamilton also forced on the grass by the previous collision of the three cars in front.



Button stays on track.



Alonso comes to a stop against the driving direction



Schumacher and Hamilton making their way back towards the track.



Schumacher back on track



Hamilton back on track

[vall]

A popular prediction was that Schumacher would use unfair driving tactics as soon as he realized that he was in no position to win a race.

A fair expectation given his record I personally doubt it unless he is the fight for WDC, which is likely not going to happen

[Mysticf1]

I remember seeing him storm to the back of the garage after FP1 in bahrain, obviously not happy with the car...now i think he has decided not to take things to seriously and actually enjoy himself...his body language in Melb post race interviews definitely gives me that impression...props to him for that, not at all what id expected.

[Ganxxta]

That hole Schumacher bashing is funny, nobody seems to see that Rosberg wasn't as good as the final table shows, without the Webber/hamilton accident he would have finished 7th with no chance to get Webber or Hamilton.
So thats 3 Positions better than MS, without additional stop, broken car etc.
I doubt Rosberg would have finished better on MS's place...

Nice Pics WB, clearly to see that Rosberg is 8-9th after the start and MS fighting for P4/5 while started behind him.

[Pup]

Interesting analysis, WB, which completely falls apart at this frame...

...when seconds later, four less experienced drivers in exactly the same relative positioning somehow manage to fit their four cars into the same corner without creating an accident.

I call it a racing incident - no more, no less. But there seems to be an attitude among many fans that whichever car is an inch in front somehow has a god-given right to take whatever line they want into the corner. That's not right. If the driver on the outside is aware of the car on the inside, he needs to give room. Button was alongside Alonso down the entire straight, so Alonso either was aware of him, or should have been.

Blame the mirrors if you want, but you can't blame Button.

After all, by your logic, Schumacher would have been in the right if he had cut straight across both Alonso and Button.

[WhiteBlue]

Interesting analysis, WB, which completely falls apart at this frame...

...when seconds later, four less experienced drivers in exactly the same relative positioning somehow manage to fit their four cars into the same corner without creating an accident.

Which entirely caused by a much slower cornering speed and not having a kamikaze approach like Button. I have already said that it was a racing accident. We are agreed on that. If you try to analyse who could have done better you unevitingly arrive at the conclusion that Button was less than cooperative, but he was the one most lucky from the two collisions by not having any damage, not leaving the track and not having to turn as Alonso had to do.

[RacingManiac]

There is reaction involve though....the cars that were there at that point is already reacting to what is happening up front. Likely have braked more/earlier, which you would have to do anyway in a mass start with the accordian effect into a corner. Not the same situation....

[dumrick]

not having a kamikaze approach like Button.

I'm aware of how pointless it is to try and change other's views in situations like this, but it gets a bit ridiculous to blaim the only of the 3 drivers that fully acknowledged the presence of the cars around him - Button satisfied himself with the least possible space on the inside of the turn.



On this image is obvious that Nando just slammed the door in Jenson's face. Probably got scared by Schumacher on the outside and forgot that had a car on the interior. This logical conclusion was also Tiago Monteiro's on portuguese TV, looking at the replay from Button's car.

[WhiteBlue]

not having a kamikaze approach like Button.

I'm aware of how pointless it is to try and change other's views in situations like this, but it gets a bit ridiculous to blaim the only of the 3 drivers that fully acknowledged the presence of the cars around him - Button satisfied himself with the least possible space on the inside of the turn.



On this image is obvious that Nando just slammed the door in Jenson's face. Probably got scared by Schumacher on the outside and forgot that had a car on the interior. This logical conclusion was also Tiago Monteiro's on portuguese TV, looking at the replay from Button's car.

Alonso had very little room to give to Button. Schumacher almost certainly wasn't able to see Button way back on the other side of Alonso. This is why it was judged as a racing incident. All I tried to communicate here is that Button was showing the most aggression of the three drivers. When he hit Alonso he still had some room towards the inside and there wasn't a car directly behind which would have been in trouble if he had braked earlier and stronger.

[dumrick]

When he hit Alonso he still had some room towards the inside and there wasn't a car directly behind which would have been in trouble if he had braked earlier and stronger.

I think you are failing to see the dynamics of the event: Alonso and Button are both pointing at the apex of the turn in the picture. Button had no more room, since he was already going for the least space on turn-in. If he was more on the inside, he would have to go to the wet astroturf (which would have less grip and probably cause an incident anyway), or open the trajectory on the exit, which would make him contact the Ferrari anyway, only later.

Furthermore, there's no point in saying Button should have braked earlier - where you brake in the approach of the first turn is the big gamble in starts. After you commit to braking, you brake as hard as possible, if there's no free space available ahead of you, like in this case. That's why a driver must mind the situation of the cars around him, Alonso failed to do so and suffered the consequences.
It's a pity that Schumacher, who left plenty of room on the inside, aware of the presence of other cars there, was an innocent victim of Alonso's failure of judgement.
Also, it was particularly dumb to dive for that first apex, when the sequence would see any driver going for the outside of the first turn to be on the inside of the next one - Schumi was set for 4th place, if everyone around him behaved the way they should have.

[marcush.]

There is reaction involve though....the cars that were there at that point is already reacting to what is happening up front. Likely have braked more/earlier, which you would have to do anyway in a mass start with the accordian effect into a corner. Not the same situation....

+1

reading the situation correctly.
those four chaps ar not fighting for position (as they should do ,opportunity to gain places here!)but trying to save their lives or watching the spectacle or whatever..

those who do not want to see that MS was and is a pure RACER never ever doing something else in his life are simply blind .

there were some incidents he should have avoided but he was surely not any worse
than Senna in this who is still and rightly so considered as the all time greatest .
but to say one is expecting unfair things from the guy is just absurd he was dominating a whole decade because of his alround talent and not because he was
an unfair sportsman.
and he paid a price for being overambitious all the time ,one has to remember:
he was docked allpoints and his Vicechampionship when he turned into Villeneuve,
he got punbished for monaco parking .

[Aryoh]

+1
After the Bahrain i decide to support only MS because it seams that he attacked by the all F1 world, and marcus you said the great thing "MS was and is a pure RACER" and"he was dominating a whole decade because of his alround talent and not because he was an unfair sportsman" , it is great that more people see that in MS.

There is reaction involve though....the cars that were there at that point is already reacting to what is happening up front. Likely have braked more/earlier, which you would have to do anyway in a mass start with the accordian effect into a corner. Not the same situation....

+1

reading the situation correctly.
those four chaps ar not fighting for position (as they should do ,opportunity to gain places here!)but trying to save their lives or watching the spectacle or whatever..

those who do not want to see that MS was and is a pure RACER never ever doing something else in his life are simply blind .

there were some incidents he should have avoided but he was surely not any worse
than Senna in this who is still and rightly so considered as the all time greatest .
but to say one is expecting unfair things from the guy is just absurd he was dominating a whole decade because of his alround talent and not because he was
an unfair sportsman.
and he paid a price for being overambitious all the time ,one has to remember:
he was docked allpoints and his Vicechampionship when he turned into Villeneuve,
he got punbished for monaco parking .

[vall]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xBJoW7X-pY[/youtube]

look at this video, LH passed Massa right after Webber did it. Webber wanted to do the same thing when LH was attacking Alonso. But Fred closed the door and LH had to brake, so Webber smashed into LH.