2008 Japanese GP

[myurr]

Yeah the only way Bourdais could have avoided that avoidable accident would have been to not bothering to turn up to the race that morning. Our only hope for F1 ever being a fair sport is for the teams to force out the FIA. Maybe all the threats of a spec series will force the manufacturers to do just that.

[Sawtooth-spike]

Oh my God, can Somebody plese explain to me how in this reality that Seb Gets done for what can only be seen as Massa crashing into him?

Lewis this weekend proved 2 things. 1 He is Very quick (saturday) 2. He is a total Numpty and can throw away a great position better than anybody else within errr 1 corner.

Gratz to Alonso Fantastic drive!

But back to my main point..... how can Seb be done for what he did? Should he of drive off the track?. Maybe some diagrams may explain how Seb was at fault for Massa hitting him.

[axle]

Anyone got a copy of the ruling and exactly what Bourdais is "guilty" of??

[vs331]

After turn 1 Hamilton was behind Alonso. How did he end up behind Massa by turn 8?

[wesley123]

Anyone got a copy of the ruling and exactly what Bourdais is "guilty" of??

Formula1.com says that he did clash with massa and made him spin, which was massas own fault.

[Rodzilla]

I dont know what is wrong with the fia, i guess there is a rule that doesnt allow overtaking. Massa hits Hamilton on purpose and wins by that 5 places. Hamilton is in a same situation in belgium and is avoiding a collision but gets 25 seconds penalty.
if massa wins the championship he wouldnt deserve it as he got enough help by the fia to win it.
Massa gets a low penalty for hitting hamilton on purpose wich was clear.
Now hamilton knows what he gotta do in the next 2 races, just eliminate himself and massa then he is world champion.

careful, schumacher tried that and lost ALL his points for the season

and by the way, massa's penalty was worse then the 25 seconds that lewis got, around 25 seconds for the drive through itself plus the time lost behind the slower cars

this penalty cost felipe a much bigger points haul

[racshot65]

What on earth is Bordais being punished for?

Massa turned in AT him what did they want him to do? Dive onto the grass?

Bad decision.

[wesley123]

I dont know what is wrong with the fia, i guess there is a rule that doesnt allow overtaking. Massa hits Hamilton on purpose and wins by that 5 places. Hamilton is in a same situation in belgium and is avoiding a collision but gets 25 seconds penalty.
if massa wins the championship he wouldnt deserve it as he got enough help by the fia to win it.
Massa gets a low penalty for hitting hamilton on purpose wich was clear.
Now hamilton knows what he gotta do in the next 2 races, just eliminate himself and massa then he is world champion.

careful, schumacher tried that and lost ALL his points for the season

and by the way, massa's penalty was worse then the 25 seconds that lewis got, around 25 seconds for the drive through itself plus the time lost behind the slower cars

this penalty cost felipe a much bigger points haul

That was 1997, then it want like this. now ferrari will never lose their points, dont matter what, even if they copy mclarens car on detail they will still keep their points adn are still allowed to race.

[shir0]

Anyone got a copy of the ruling and exactly what Bourdais is "guilty" of??

As far as I know, no copy of that official ruling is available to the public at this point...in fact, I can't find any copy of ANY official ruling for this GP at all. Same thing with the Singapore GP.

[myurr]

and by the way, massa's penalty was worse then the 25 seconds that lewis got, around 25 seconds for the drive through itself plus the time lost behind the slower cars

this penalty cost felipe a much bigger points haul

WTF!? Massa spun Hamilton forcing him to wait until ***EVERY*** other car had past, and you think Massa was hard done by!?

[i70q7m7ghw]

Another race and yet more crap penalties. Hamilton and Massa both deserved the penalties they got, I do think Massa's should have been a stop go though.

Hamilton bodged an overtaking move and caused mayhem, a mistake on his part and it resulted in Kimi being forced off the track - Hamilton was penalised with a drive through. If Kimi hadn't lost so much ground I doubt a penalty would have been issued, but anyway I think we are all agreed a drive through was fair.

Massa was being overtaken and was too stubborn to yeild even though he had already lost the place. He didn't have the racing line and he made contact punting Lewis out of the way and damaging his car. IMO - stop and go should have been issued to be fair, since this incident wasn't caused by a lock up, he had the chance to actually slow the car down.

So far I can live with that, atleast both drivers have been penalised so it's mostly fair. Hamilton was close enough to Massa to race him, but he didn't have the pace - possibly due to damage?

Bourdais? Inside line coming out of the pits, he wasn't lapped, Massa drove in to him.... so what did he do wrong exactly? Absolutely f****** rediculous decision! Excuse my french. If anyone should have been penalised it should have been Massa! To be honest though I think it was just one of those incidents and no penalty should have been given. (If anyone has some alternate angles of this incident that incriminate Bourdais please share).

As Martin Brundle rightly said we've now got this "nanny" culture where everyone is now paranoid about penalties and penalties seem to be getting handed out left, right and center inconsistantly. It also seems the decisions are based purely on if a driver lost ground in some way, not who actually causes the incident. For example, it seems Bourdais was penalised because Massa spun and lost some time - the fact that Massa looks mostly too blame for the incident has been totally ignored.

At the end of the day theres nothing we can do about it, it's just a shame championships seem to be shaped and engineered by penalties these days.

[myurr]

Totally agree Diesel.

I'd also like to point out the potentially dangerous precedent that the FIA have set by allowing cars to dive into the pit lane exit in a bit to overtake - and Massa wasn't even investigated for this.

In this instance I don't think Massa should have been penalised, unless there was a breach of the rules (I have no idea on this). However the FIA should have investigated and issued a statement stating that from now on this will not be allowed and will be punishable by a drive through penalty.

He went off the circuit, through hatched areas (presumably hatched because it's f'ing dangerous to enter them!!), all to pull off an overtake. He should have had to have taken the outside line and tried to make it stick out there.

I can't help but feel that if it had been any other team overtaking like that then there would have been a penalty, and the Bourdais incident isn't helping that opinion.

[icef1mkd]

You can't help but think that someone is protecting someone here.

It's very sad for Bourdais - his seat unsure, he's fighting to
prove he's worth of it, and after that blip in Singapore now
he manages to outperform hot-shot Vettel, just like he did in Spa.

Anyway, his recent drives under pressure to perform leave no doubt
that he deserves to be in F1.

Hope Berger feels the same way.

[i70q7m7ghw]

Totally agree Diesel.

I'd also like to point out the potentially dangerous precedent that the FIA have set by allowing cars to dive into the pit lane exit in a bit to overtake - and Massa wasn't even investigated for this.

In this instance I don't think Massa should have been penalised, unless there was a breach of the rules (I have no idea on this). However the FIA should have investigated and issued a statement stating that from now on this will not be allowed and will be punishable by a drive through penalty.

He went off the circuit, through hatched areas (presumably hatched because it's f'ing dangerous to enter them!!), all to pull off an overtake. He should have had to have taken the outside line and tried to make it stick out there.

I can't help but feel that if it had been any other team overtaking like that then there would have been a penalty, and the Bourdais incident isn't helping that opinion.

Ah yes I forgot to mention Massa's move on Webber. It was a fair move in my opinion, but as you say there needs to be clarification about overtaking in the pitlane exit. If someone had been just exiting the pitlane at the time Massa darted in to it - just after the wall ends - it could have been a very nasty crash.

[shotzski]

I cannot believe this! People were saying that Mclaren are cheats, Lewis is a dangerous driver. But look at what Massa did: he overtook Lewis and shunted him literally, and he's not even on the track. Wasn't that supposed to be illegal? Yes he was on the inside of the corner, but his car was also off track while fighting with Lewis. Now whose being a danger on track, banging on everyone? Ferrari should lose this championship