2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

[Manoah2u]

"German automobile giant Daimler has abandoned the development of internal combustion engines. From now on, electric vehicles will take precedence for the brand with ICEs being put on the backburner. According to a report published in a German motoring magazine Auto Motor und Sport, Daimler's development chief, Markus Schaefer said that the brand's main focus will now be on electrification, in the arena of electric powertrains as well as batteries. The resources, which are currently used in the development of internal combustion engines will be directed accordingly."
Source AMuS.

Will that affect F1? Is there any point for a works team? They could just remain as engine supplier, capitalizing on the massive R&D they conducted so far. Do they want to have the best engine if they are only engine suppliers? Probably yes. If they don't, could they blame their customer chassis for not reaching the superiority of their works team? Probably yes.

More politics & ideology in EV than economic reality and/or common sense. On the basis of cost, charging time and lack of infrastructure, the EV is just a footnote. Hybrid tech. will rule for a long time to come and that means ICE is still nesessary. Governments world wide pocket a lot of cash from taxing fossil fuels, this revenue pays for a lot of stuff in society. The EV has no propulsion road tax imposed on it anywhere, rather it enjoys taxpayer subsidy on a large scale and is still unviable. How long will this game be played until ALL realize that we were all lied to and CO2 is not the problem, ....and more CO2 is better than less CO2?

well, if you concider the 'Mercedes-Benz' department that was/is responsible for F1 engines in all it's essence really is 'Ilmor', but labeled Mercedes since the early 90's (as Merc 'took over' the brand), then i don't really think there needs to be any worry. Mercs F1 engines only recently got passed by Ferrari and it remains to be seen the legality in that, and i'm pretty sure Mercedes will figure out sooner or later the 'trick' and implement the same and then they're back in the first position.

that means they're still in a hugely favourable position, and the V6 engines will continue for a while.

Mercedes now focusing on their 'street' department on more electric will influence - positively - Mercedes' presence in Formula E in the future, and perhaps in other racing classes where there will be 'hybrid' or full electric.
It could very well mean they will find valuable improvements on their 'ERS' systems, which would then further boost Mercedes' capabilities in F1.

All in all, it won't have any negative impact to Mercedes' F1 participations. Whether that be with the AMG Mercedes mothership team or through Mclaren, Williams, etc. doesn't really matter.

[proteus]

"German automobile giant Daimler has abandoned the development of internal combustion engines. From now on, electric vehicles will take precedence for the brand with ICEs being put on the backburner. According to a report published in a German motoring magazine Auto Motor und Sport, Daimler's development chief, Markus Schaefer said that the brand's main focus will now be on electrification, in the arena of electric powertrains as well as batteries. The resources, which are currently used in the development of internal combustion engines will be directed accordingly."
Source AMuS.

Will that affect F1? Is there any point for a works team? They could just remain as engine supplier, capitalizing on the massive R&D they conducted so far. Do they want to have the best engine if they are only engine suppliers? Probably yes. If they don't, could they blame their customer chassis for not reaching the superiority of their works team? Probably yes.

More politics & ideology in EV than economic reality and/or common sense. On the basis of cost, charging time and lack of infrastructure, the EV is just a footnote. Hybrid tech. will rule for a long time to come and that means ICE is still nesessary. Governments world wide pocket a lot of cash from taxing fossil fuels, this revenue pays for a lot of stuff in society. The EV has no propulsion road tax imposed on it anywhere, rather it enjoys taxpayer subsidy on a large scale and is still unviable. How long will this game be played until ALL realize that we were all lied to and CO2 is not the problem, ....and more CO2 is better than less CO2?

Electric cars will never ever replace those which run on fossil fuel. Unless mankind is reduced from current 7,7 billion to less than a 1 billion....

[AfzMoha]

sainz' q3 lap 1.33.289 (P6)

https://streamable.com/bdeof
https://streamable.com/bdeof

Car looks really stable and drivable.

[RonDennis]

I don't even understand why people are suggesting Mercedes will leave F1. It's probably their cheapest sponsorship campaign they ever had. Just look at the numbers, they're only spending tens of millions. It's important for Mercedes to get a better benchmark and McLaren is clearly a better target than Racing Point and Williams. Let's not forget that McLaren made incredible progress in 2019 and it's likely they will close the gap further in 2020.

[zeph]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

[the EDGE]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

You really think starting again with another new engine manufacturer is a viable option?

[Macklaren]

I think there is a deep backstory to this. Sounds like this was primarily Siedl's decision. It's a little too soon after he joined for him to make a huge decision like this. I wonder if he joined McL with the understanding from Zak and Toto that McL would become a defacto works team by 2021. With Lewis coming back.</fantasy>

[diffuser]

I don't even understand why people are suggesting Mercedes will leave F1. It's probably their cheapest sponsorship campaign they ever had. Just look at the numbers, they're only spending tens of millions. It's important for Mercedes to get a better benchmark and McLaren is clearly a better target than Racing Point and Williams. Let's not forget that McLaren made incredible progress in 2019 and it's likely they will close the gap further in 2020.

I agree with you on that. Plus what I added earlier, Liberty Mutual is gonna turn these money pit teams into Billion dollar teams. The stan to earn Millions by getting in on the ground floor. Why get out now?

[diffuser]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

My fear is that this means Renault is leaving the sport at the end of 2020....
They did say that is they don't get the PU R&D development freeze, they were leaving.

[diffuser]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

You really think starting again with another new engine manufacturer is a viable option?

Getting tired of telling people that works team doesn't hold the same value that it once did.

The regs prevent the works team from having an advantage over the customer teams.

[Ground Effect]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

The fact that Mercedes is now significantly behind Ferrari in power, (qualifying, at least, top end speed) shows there’s still scope to improve. I’d personally have more confidence in Mercedes catching Ferrari and probably exceeding quicker than Renault.

[SmallSoldier]

The decision was Seidl’s to move to Mercedes and no, Mclaren has no intention to manufacture their own Power Unit... From an interview with Seidl:

McLaren team principal Andreas Seidl decided to delve into the process of the engine deal with Mercedes from 2021 coming together. The German began working with the team in full charge earlier this year in May, and one of the effects of his vision is already tangible, as it emerged that the decision to revert back to Mercedes engines was prompted by himself and backed by McLaren CEO Zak Brown.

“My task is clearly being in charge of the F1 team and put together as quick as possible all the key elements, in order to be successful again in the future, also things like driver line-up and selecting the power unit suppliers.

“To me Mercedes being clearly the benchmark in this hybrid area was the main reason why we wanted to make this decision. The best thing is to have the same power unit from the best team in the paddock, because there is no way to hide for us it’s shown how Mercedes is working with its customers, and I have no worries that we will get the same treatment from Mercedes as their works team.”

Seidl explained that negotiations with Mercedes started ‘just before summer’, and as it shines through his declarations McLaren was the one that called first. “We need to be successful in the future -he said- it was our task to look for possible options so that is why we decided to approach Mercedes and Toto to see if there was the possibility to work together again, and we took it from there.”

The German also stressed that McLaren’s aim is to remain an independent team, and the options of putting up their own PU or partnering with a new manufacturer were simply not realistic enough to take place on the short term, especially for budget-related reasons.

“We want to stay as an independent team, we want to be a major player in the sport and not just because of our history but also hopefully because of the success that we will have again in the future.”

“It was never a topic to put up our own F1 power unit, we have to invest a lot of money, we’d need a lot of running budget and you would need a long time to catch up. We are really happy with the agreement we’ve reached with Mercedes”.

“There were no other options around or any newcomers on the horizon, as I said before it is not realistic that anyone new will come into the sport at the moment, because there is simply too much money you would have to invest” he added.

Although the decision was taken ahead of time (almost one year and a half before), Seidl believes it was the right one, since the 2021 regulations will not alter the current situation concerning power units. Therefore, manufacturers are likely to catch up on one another even more than we are witnessing at the moment.

“I think as Toto said today it was clear that with the regulations staying as they are on the power unit side there is convergence between all the different power units that are around. We can see that right now they are all quite close, which is good for us as an independent team not having our own engine.”


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[diffuser]

I’m not sure how the 2021 changes will reshuffle the pecking order; for all we know Mercedes’ PU could only improve marginally and Renault might build a warp drive.

Even so, if things remain as they are, McLaren might get a better PU, but they will still only be a customer team.

If they’re satisfied with that, fine, I guess. But if they’re not gonna invest in building their own PU’s, I think they need to find an exclusive partnership with another manufacturer.

The fact that Mercedes is now significantly behind Ferrari in power, (qualifying, at least, top end speed) shows there’s still scope to improve. I’d personally have more confidence in Mercedes catching Ferrari and probably exceeding quicker than Renault.

I agree Renault may time warp.

I think a Customer team can win. The advantages of being a works team is that they can design the PU around the car but at this point they're not gonna change the PU dimensions at all and the rest of the stuff is manufactured by the customer team anyways. As far as cheating, with the Fia looking over your shoulder do you really want to get caught cheating? Why risk it? Is the publicity of a Customer team beating the works Merc team bad for Mercedez propper?

1 - No proof that Ferrari has more power. If could be they just carrying less DF/drag.
2- Just because Merc have had more power in the past, doesn't mean they'll catch up faster. The odds are against Honda and Renault but the odds are also against flipping a coin 5 times and get heads every time. yet it does happen. That plus, this has nothing to do with luck and more to do what's on the respective manufactures drawing boards.

[Lucky]

[SanchitHitman98]

So sainz is good in fast corners which is good to see