Monaco GP 2010 - Monte Carlo

[andrew]

so what IS the name of the hotel now it isn't called loew's ?

I think it's called The Grand Hotel.

[WhiteBlue]

so what IS the name of the hotel now it isn't called loew's ?

I think it's called The Grand Hotel.

Nope, currently it is called Fairmont. I saw the brand name in the F1 race footage.

http://www.mediterraneeonline.eu/stays- ... tay--.html

[mep]

Nope, it is the same place but at 3:08 and it is repeated from Alonso's car at 3:37.

I am not whining, I am just saying that perhaps Di Grassi's move was not very clear and coudl have caused accident, hence Alonso's weaving......

heee, what are you telling there...
DG did nothing else than driving up that hill. In fact its almost impossible to overtake there because the road is not straight lined it is zig zaged but one car can drive straight when it is in the middle. Only Kimi somehow managed to overtake somebody there, I am still wondering how.

I am affright you are one of the guys who blame Schumacher being a cheater when he manages to overtake your Fernando meanwhile you defend Fernando who whines when he can’t overtake a car who is 3-4 seconds slower a lap.

[vall]

Nope, it is the same place but at 3:08 and it is repeated from Alonso's car at 3:37.

I am not whining, I am just saying that perhaps Di Grassi's move was not very clear and coudl have caused accident, hence Alonso's weaving......

heee, what are you telling there...
DG did nothing else than driving up that hill. In fact its almost impossible to overtake there because the road is not straight lined it is zig zaged but one car can drive straight when it is in the middle. Only Kimi somehow managed to overtake somebody there, I am still wondering how.

I am affright you are one of the guys who blame Schumacher being a cheater when he manages to overtake your Fernando meanwhile you defend Fernando who whines when he can’t overtake a car who is 3-4 seconds slower a lap.

nope, I would not say he was a cheater simply because that (it did not happen many times anyway).But it is proven beyond any doubt that Schumacher is a cheater, no? And Alonso did overtake those guys.

[nipo]

Sorry if this has been discussed, but, the fact that FIA is now trying to clarify the rules and the signals involved mean that the rules and the flags hadn't been clear enough, right?

Then what is the basis for Michael's punishment?

[mep]

Haa compared to Alonso he is an innocent sheep.
Alonso just always gets away without punishment meanwhile Schumacher gets punished for things which don't even exist.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Sorry if this has been discussed, but, the fact that FIA is now trying to clarify the rules and the signals involved mean that the rules and the flags hadn't been clear enough, right?

Then what is the basis for Michael's punishment?

The basis of Schumacher's punishment was he contravened rule 40.13

However, The lights of the safety car were off coming out the tunnel, indicating that the race would in fact restart at the saftey car line as per new directive for 2010. Not only did this occur, but there were waving green flags to indicate yellow conditions were over and race conditions were aplicable.

In the end, Micheal Schumacher and Mercedes got done over by Steward and Marshall incompetance.

[lebesset]

rule 40.13 clearly states that , on the last lap only , if the safety car pulls in there can be no overtaking after the so called safety car line

schumacher was wrongly advised by his team ; the re-wording of the rule is completely unnecessary , it is a sop , no more

and green flags indicate that the track is clear , not that racing can commence ; which is why the race director can order them on the parade lap if he wishes ..or is racing on the parade lap permitted now ?

[vall]

Haa compared to Alonso he is an innocent sheep.

you must be kidding, right?

Alonso just always gets away without punishment meanwhile Schumacher gets punished for things which don't even exist.

for doing what? What he has done wrong and was not punished for it? He did not do many wrong things anyway. I would say compared to MS, Alonso is a innocent sheep.

Well, I understand perfectly well that the Schumacher fans would never forgive Mikka and Fernando for what they did to their idol, but please, try to be a bit more realistic....

[alberto222mx]

Haa compared to Alonso he is an innocent sheep.

you must be kidding, right?

Alonso just always gets away without punishment meanwhile Schumacher gets punished for things which don't even exist.

for doing what? What he has done wrong and was not punished for it? He did not do many wrong things anyway. I would say compared to MS, Alonso is a innocent sheep.

Well, I understand perfectly well that the Schumacher fans would never forgive Mikka and Fernando for what they did to their idol, but please, try to be a bit more realistic....

Totally off topic, but I can remember a couple of things, well, I guess everyone here remembers.

In 2007 when he turned his back to McLaren he got away with 109 points and almost won the WDC, meanwhile his team was severly punished.
One year later, again, in the middle Briatore-Piquet scandal he was the only one who hasn´t any trouble, having being the beneficiary of Piquet´s Crash.

At least, Schumacher make his moves on the track at the sight of everyone and taking the risk of being punished.

[nipo]

At least, Schumacher make his moves on the track at the sight of everyone and taking the risk of being punished.

Lovely point there!! +1 =D> =D>

[mep]

No I am not kidding, I am really convinced of that.
I am not even a Schumacher Fan in fact during the time Mikka was driving I was supporting him later I became big Fan of Kimi and still are.
You could have guessed from my avatar but.....

Its racing not little childrens birthday party.
Schumacher is a hart racer on track this causes soft racers to pull back and whine after the race (last time seen in Barcelona).
Well at least FIA is not as stupid now to punish him for that too.
Somethimes they punish him (and others too) in a very stupid fashion. The problem is it seems like they don't use any lawful way to do so.
They have full books of rules but still miss the simplest things we already know since ancient times:
1) in dubio pro reo
2) nulla poena sine lege/ nullum crime sine lege
3) nulla poena sina culpa

The problem is they rule book has a loophole because it’s not written what happens when the safety car drives into pits when the track is clear and there is last lap at the race.
It only says what happens when there is last lap meanwhile the SC is still deployed because the track is not clear. It’s obvious that you can’t race when the track is not clear, but there is no reason why you shouldn’t be allowed to race when track is clear. So this is a questionable situation and therefore handled for the accused.
They did several mistakes:
1 They made rule book which has loopholes and is lacking fixed punishments for every insult
2 They declared track to be clear and pulled safety car in under unclear conditions for the teams
3 They punish a team/driver right after the race based on unclear regulations and own mistakes
4 They don’t submit the possibility for the team to make a proper appeal against the decision
5 They miss other incidents on that race like Barichelo throwing the steering wheel right in front of another car.

I don’t understand why they must decide right after the race what to do. They could at least sleep 1 night and give everybody a proper change on Monday to clarify their point.

[DaveKillens]

Geesh, I really dislike people who believe they are "entitled" to something. It's a freaking car race, and due to his own actions, Alonso found himself behind a much slower car who wasn't going to just lay over. Di Grassi is paid to race, so is Alonso. If Alonso wants past, he has to earn it. And yes, I have no problem with a defending driver making his car as wide as possible, as long as it's within the regulations. And if a driver allows his back end to dance around and make the driver behind nervous, then he's doing his job. If the defending driver can control the speed of the car behind, he will do it. Alonso did that very thing when he masterfully defended his lead to win the 2005 race at Imola.

In Trulli's case, I am of the opinion he allowed Alonso past for quite different reasons. Trulli knew that eventually Alonso would get past, it was only a matter of time. But as long as he defended against Alonso, the car he was really racing was closing up from behind. So he allowed Alonso past, and maintained a healthy gap to the car behind.

It's a shame I have seen so many fans turning on each other over this Schumacher issue. Without a doubt, Michael Schumacher is the most ruthless and aggressive driver in Formula One, would it be foolish to assume he wouldn't try to steal a move on some drivers, believing he was technically within the regulations? The problem the real problem are these darn vague regulations.

Many years ago, these regulations were controlled by no less than a lawyer who deliberately allowed massive amounts of grey areas. And why did he do this? Easy, he did it so that there would be lots of issues such as we witnessed, but he would be the one in power to make a decision based on his personal interpretation. This is a legacy that will take many years to correct, many years to clean up deliberately vague regulations.

I've read a lot of posts on this subject, and each argument is valid and intelligent. It's not that anyone is in the wrong, it's that the way the darn regulations are written, it sucks. And we the fans suffer because things are so unclear, so much is open to personal interpretation.

[Ray]

Did race control ever explicitly state that the race was to be restarted? Was any team notified of this over radios, through the email system they have to talk to the teams, or by onscreen TV indications?

[nipo]

I don’t understand why they must decide right after the race what to do. They could at least sleep 1 night and give everybody a proper change on Monday to clarify their point.

I think they were actually MADE to come out with a verdict quicker since the last season or the one before. Please correct me if I'm wrong

For Schumacher's case, I can just say that the rules were not clear enough, and any reasonable doubt should benefit the defendant, NOT up to the interpretation of the stewards! Funny thing they now "vow to clarify the rules" after interpreting them to punish MS. [-X

Alonso, on paper, is more innocent. Turning his back against McLaren and benefiting from the crash scandal at Renault do not make him guilty. He got away in one piece, so be it. But given this track record of wrecking teams Monte still hired him which was unbelievable (was the Santander investment that lucrative?).

Schumacher wrecks other cars on track and he wrecks his teammates' careers (bar Massa). Alonso wrecks entire teams. Pick your favourite.