McLaren MCL39 Speculation Thread

[Shader]

It's about time we start a speculation thread for the new McLaren challenger

For starters... what do you people think? With one year left within current regulations, will the team do a refinement of current design, or will they go flat out with new concept? Reduced wind tunnel time might also play a part in choosing a direction for next years car...

In a recent interview, Stella suggested they will take "a brave route" with focus on innovations... I suppose that means they will try to remake certain technical solutions which does not necessarily mean they will change the fundamental concept of the car.

[MrGapes]

Could we see a S duct??

[Macklaren]

It's about time they got in top of the weight issues so we can see a full livery again with all the new sponsors. It was encouraging to see all the special liveries in 2024 be a full color car

[mwillems]

I would imagine they will put a lot of work into the chassis and suspension and this is where there is possibly more time to be found. The weight will be a part of it, but also the way the chassis and suspension work with the tyres. Yeah I'm sure there is outright Q pace to be found, but I'm not sure how much. Finding a way to help the car run to a race delta that is a couple of tenths quicker and keep the tyres in the window has to be a big target. This was the first year we ran a suspension that leans more, as the RB did this and last year. I'm sure this area will be ripe for some fine tuning with perhaps even some small wheelbase changes to the car.

As for the aero, who knows. Can't imagine there's much more they can do, but with their learning from this year, hopefully they can reconfigure the internals to help create a more efficient shape.

That said, I do get the impression the team have some ideas that they chose not to release on this years car and this was part of the reason they didn't bring as much as some would like, preferring to hide some of it until next year to hit the ground running.

[_cerber1]

Maybe it makes sense to start by identifying the strengths and weaknesses of the 38 chassis? Because the data is very contradictory from source to source. The most obvious thing is the high drag, and Stella once said that this is one of the points they are already working on, the Brazilian wing was the first step.

[mwillems]

Maybe it makes sense to start by identifying the strengths and weaknesses of the 38 chassis? Because the data is very contradictory from source to source. The most obvious thing is the high drag, and Stella once said that this is one of the points they are already working on, the Brazilian wing was the first step.

Higher drag and tyre management, for me, are the areas that you can see teams like Ferrari have a good advantage. Vegas is a great example of where other teams can do so much more than us, as well as general cold and wet conditions.

[organic]

Maybe it makes sense to start by identifying the strengths and weaknesses of the 38 chassis? Because the data is very contradictory from source to source. The most obvious thing is the high drag, and Stella once said that this is one of the points they are already working on, the Brazilian wing was the first step.

Higher drag and tyre management, for me, are the areas that you can see teams like Ferrari have a good advantage. Vegas is a great example of where other teams can do so much more than us, as well as general cold and wet conditions.

Ferrari's superior tyre management quite clearly came at a large cost though, and with such a tight grid the great tyre management at a cost to qualifying pace (and wet weather performance) is just not a good tradeoff.

Dragginess, cold conditions and general performance at stop-go circuits are the main weaknesses I'd say

Also: similar to comparing tyre wear against Ferrari who themselves probably went too far in that direction, we should be cautious not to judge teams too harshly in how they dealt with cold conditions because in this Merc are the yardstick. However we know they got their working window completely wrong, so perhaps one should be wary of unrealistic targets

[f1316]

It's about time they got in top of the weight issues so we can see a full livery again with all the new sponsors. It was encouraging to see all the special liveries in 2024 be a full color car

I would love the Austin livery - with a bit more of the chrome at the front - to be the actual livery. I think it’s really beautiful and merges the main eras of McLaren’s identity into a cohesive single livery.

[mwillems]

Maybe it makes sense to start by identifying the strengths and weaknesses of the 38 chassis? Because the data is very contradictory from source to source. The most obvious thing is the high drag, and Stella once said that this is one of the points they are already working on, the Brazilian wing was the first step.

Higher drag and tyre management, for me, are the areas that you can see teams like Ferrari have a good advantage. Vegas is a great example of where other teams can do so much more than us, as well as general cold and wet conditions.

Ferrari's superior tyre management quite clearly came at a large cost though, and with such a tight grid the great tyre management at a cost to qualifying pace (and wet weather performance) is just not a good tradeoff.

Dragginess, cold conditions and general performance at stop-go circuits are the main weaknesses I'd say

Also: similar to comparing tyre wear against Ferrari who themselves probably went too far in that direction, we should be cautious not to judge teams too harshly in how they dealt with cold conditions because in this Merc are the yardstick. However we know they got their working window completely wrong, so perhaps one should be wary of unrealistic targets

I felt Ferrari did quite well out of it in the back end of the season to be fair. I'm not sure that improving the way we interact with the tyres means we have to lose performance elsewhere either, but I'd say we seem to be 3rd or 4th in those adverse conditions so it does feel like there is work to be done. Some of it could be weight, and if it were possible to shed a decent amount then this would aid the graining and general pace on all areas of the track.

In terms of cold and wet, who knows. Perhaps it is too much to ask to get better tyre management in all conditions. But not in some conditions. Let's see.

[Zaamy]

I would love the Austin livery - with a bit more of the chrome at the front - to be the actual livery. I think it’s really beautiful and merges the main eras of McLaren’s identity into a cohesive single livery.

I noticed the Formula E guys have silver/chrome accent on their team top instead of the blue we've been using lately, and their kit seems to be a hit as to what the F1 gear is like

[the EDGE]

Higher drag and tyre management, for me, are the areas that you can see teams like Ferrari have a good advantage. Vegas is a great example of where other teams can do so much more than us, as well as general cold and wet conditions.

Ferrari's superior tyre management quite clearly came at a large cost though, and with such a tight grid the great tyre management at a cost to qualifying pace (and wet weather performance) is just not a good tradeoff.

Dragginess, cold conditions and general performance at stop-go circuits are the main weaknesses I'd say

Also: similar to comparing tyre wear against Ferrari who themselves probably went too far in that direction, we should be cautious not to judge teams too harshly in how they dealt with cold conditions because in this Merc are the yardstick. However we know they got their working window completely wrong, so perhaps one should be wary of unrealistic targets

I felt Ferrari did quite well out of it in the back end of the season to be fair. I'm not sure that improving the way we interact with the tyres means we have to lose performance elsewhere either, but I'd say we seem to be 3rd or 4th in those adverse conditions so it does feel like there is work to be done. Some of it could be weight, and if it were possible to shed a decent amount then this would aid the graining and general pace on all areas of the track.

In terms of cold and wet, who knows. Perhaps it is too much to ask to get better tyre management in all conditions. But not in some conditions. Let's see.

Are we saying top teams are still running cars above the minimum weight limit, or the additional ballast would help with balance?

[mwillems]

Ferrari's superior tyre management quite clearly came at a large cost though, and with such a tight grid the great tyre management at a cost to qualifying pace (and wet weather performance) is just not a good tradeoff.

Dragginess, cold conditions and general performance at stop-go circuits are the main weaknesses I'd say

Also: similar to comparing tyre wear against Ferrari who themselves probably went too far in that direction, we should be cautious not to judge teams too harshly in how they dealt with cold conditions because in this Merc are the yardstick. However we know they got their working window completely wrong, so perhaps one should be wary of unrealistic targets

I felt Ferrari did quite well out of it in the back end of the season to be fair. I'm not sure that improving the way we interact with the tyres means we have to lose performance elsewhere either, but I'd say we seem to be 3rd or 4th in those adverse conditions so it does feel like there is work to be done. Some of it could be weight, and if it were possible to shed a decent amount then this would aid the graining and general pace on all areas of the track.

In terms of cold and wet, who knows. Perhaps it is too much to ask to get better tyre management in all conditions. But not in some conditions. Let's see.

Are we saying top teams are still running cars above the minimum weight limit, or the additional ballast would help with balance?

I'm saying there might be ways to improve but I don't actually know the weights . I'd assume that we are above the minimum weight otherwise paint wouldn't be an issue.

But I'd think that the suspension and other areas of the platform will get greater input from Rob Marshall and his team too and for there to be some improvement here which would feed into aero and tyres.

[the EDGE]

I felt Ferrari did quite well out of it in the back end of the season to be fair. I'm not sure that improving the way we interact with the tyres means we have to lose performance elsewhere either, but I'd say we seem to be 3rd or 4th in those adverse conditions so it does feel like there is work to be done. Some of it could be weight, and if it were possible to shed a decent amount then this would aid the graining and general pace on all areas of the track.

In terms of cold and wet, who knows. Perhaps it is too much to ask to get better tyre management in all conditions. But not in some conditions. Let's see.

Are we saying top teams are still running cars above the minimum weight limit, or the additional ballast would help with balance?

I'm saying there might be ways to improve but I don't actually know the weights . I'd assume that we are above the minimum weight otherwise paint wouldn't be an issue.

But I'd think that the suspension and other areas of the platform will get greater input from Rob Marshall and his team too and for there to be some improvement here which would feed into aero and tyres.

I'd assumed that by now teams would have got on top of the weight issue, but that's an interesting point, is the (still) bare carbon livery by choice or necessity? Obviously we don't get to hear about any mechanical upgrades but we know they happen just as frequently, if not more so, tham aero upgrades, so I'm sure Rob & Co. have been chipping away at weight for some time now

I think it goes without saying that the MCL39's chassis will be evolved from this years learning, and I'm pretty sure when Stella talks of being brave, this will extend to the chassis as much as the aero. Drag reduction has to be a major focus for the team. In that regard, I would say reducing bulk is just just as important as reducing weight, if not more so, for example, reducing the size of the airbox or sidepod inlets would be a big benefit with drag, and of course to do this the cooling system will have to become more efficient

Will we therefore start to see McLaren following in the route of additional openings/exits/coolers such as what RB & Ferrari have done here... I certainly expect so

[Emag]

From the perspective of clever “ductery” if we can call it that , McLaren actually has plenty of room for development. Ferrari and RedBull were both exploiting the effects of S-Ducts whereas for McLaren it was probably not even a consideration in the chassis planning of the MCL38. The sidepods were as wide/big as they needed to be for aerodynamic and cooling purposes and that was it. Didn’t really have much room for more.

RedBull was also utilising the centerline extensively for cooling as well, but there are compromises to consider with that approach so it’s not so clear cut on whether we’ll see something like that on other teams or not.