The late race incident of Kubica and Vettel at the Australian Grand Prix has already caused a lot of discussion, even before a penalty was handed. Although in some cases useful, I think a penalty in this occasion is outright inappropriate.
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Kubica caught Vettel so easily he should have known that he didn't need to pass him in that tiny window of time that is that corner.
A drvier who was thinking more would have used his extra grip to turn in a little earler (behind Vettel), and use that grip to get a better launch off the corner, and pass on the straight or at the next corner.
While there was very little Vettel could have done, Kubica could and should have exercised a touch of patience.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
djos wrote:Kubica didn't leave enuf room and caused the accident.
So who didn't leave enough room?
I hope you won't say that Kubica dragged Vettel's car to the left after crashing into him?
Vettel simply was too fast to hold on to the inside line and understeered into Kubica.
Go hit that Kerb in fRactor, and see how far it kicks you to the left.
I know it is a game, but that was the first words out of my friends mouth when he saw the incident. "I know that kerb very well, it has put me into the wall a dozen times or so!"
So, Kubica forcing Vettel onto the kerb caused the understeer to the left.
Kubica could have easily stayed to the left, passed on the outside, and possibly hunted down Jenson for the win.
Instead, he got to eat a concrete wall again, and get zero points.
Kubica set up the crash, no doubt. He put his car in a position that gave Vettel no choice or room.
It is true that Vettel collided with Kubica, in that Kubica had control of his car and his line and Vettel did not (wheels sliding, steering wheel sawing back and forth looking for grip). The overhead shot confirms that Vettel's car slid into Kubica's, but this was all due to the manner in which Vettel entered the corner. Kubica only left enough room for Vettel to take a very early, very oblique apex, resulting in Vettel's post-apex line moving all the way across the track. Unfortunately, this line intersected with Kubica's cleaner line.
Plain and simple, Kubica did not have the position to make the pass where he attempted. Certainly not against a driver unwilling to be passed. Perhaps if he had pulled a Glock, gone wide after forcing Vettel in shallow, then cut backwards across and behind Vettel as he slid across the track, he would have been able to pass Vettel cleanly in the next turn. Glock did it perfectly. Twice. Once on Alonso...
I believe that the blame should be placed on the person who caused the accident. Kubica put his car in a position to get hit, and hit it was.
Kubica, having outbraked Vettel prior to the turn, managed to get his car about a meter ahead. In doing so, he was able to apply pressure on Vettel to force him to the inside. Note that Vettel was in the very center of the track prior to the turn, with Kubica all the way to the left. After an initial turn-in, forcing Vettel to the inside of the turn and up onto the kerb, Kubica straightens out, travels for about 4 or 5 meters across the track, and then follows up with the rest of the turn.
Prior to the turn, Vettel had no choice but to move onto the kerb and ruin his line or to collide with Kubica. His post-apex trajectory was up to physics, set in motion by Kubica's pressure. Up until this point, Kubica had set himself up for a glorious pass. Imagine the the path Vettels car would have taken had Kubica's car not been present. He surely would have careened all the way across the track, perhaps even onto the opposite kerb, losing tremendous speed. After forcing Vettel inside, Kubica merely had to slow a bit more, set his car up on the left side of the track, enter with an extremely late apex, wait for Vettel to slide across the track and pass him on the right....a simple exercise in patience.
An analogy: Kubica and Vettel are walking next to each other. Kubica kicks out Vettel's feet, pushes him over, and then quickly runs around to the otherside, only to be squashed as Vettel falls on top of him. All he had to do was wait for him to fall over.
I stand by my point, both men wanted to be ahead, and that's what we get. I see no point at all for a penalty here. Dropping out of the race was harsh enough.
The only thing Vettel was truly guilty of was accepting blame. That showed his lack of experience. He'll soon learn why all F1 drivers are ruthless bastards - because they have to be.
What was Vettel gonna do with a badly damaged three wheeled car ? It looked like the tyre would fall off anytime amd the race was far from over .
But o see no point in penalizing the guys as both were wanting to be ahead of the other , and took that decision in the heat of the moment .
We give dogs the time we can spare , space we can spare , and love we can spare . In return dogs give us their all . Its the best deal man has ever made .
Sawtooth-spike wrote:However Vettel was right to be fined for driving around the track with the car so badly damaged.
Not sure... The whole bar including myself gave him standing ovation for doing that. That was a piece of something oldschool that we miss in F1 nowdays. He could have finished the race under SC on 3 wheels and gone into history books with that.
In this accident, either driver could have avoided each other. Both are at fault. But this was a racing incident. Both equally guilty, both innocent.
This is the result of two drivers (under great pressure) fighting for the same spot of pavement, and neither giving ground. If Bernie ever gets his way in this medal thing, expect this kind of thing to become a very regular occurance.
Maybe Vettel could have done the right thing and parked his car as soon as the severe damage became obvious. But to me, this speaks volumes of determination, the refusal to be beaten, keep going, to fight to the very end, no matter how desperate. I can think of other drivers who have been described in such a manner. Michael Schumacher. Gilles Villeneuve. Tazio Nuvolari.
Racing should be decided on the track, not the court room.
DaveKillens wrote:In this accident, either driver could have avoided each other. Both are at fault. But this was a racing incident. Both equally guilty, both innocent.
This is the result of two drivers (under great pressure) fighting for the same spot of pavement, and neither giving ground. If Bernie ever gets his way in this medal thing, expect this kind of thing to become a very regular occurance.
Maybe Vettel could have done the right thing and parked his car as soon as the severe damage became obvious. But to me, this speaks volumes of determination, the refusal to be beaten, keep going, to fight to the very end, no matter how desperate. I can think of other drivers who have been described in such a manner. Michael Schumacher. Gilles Villeneuve. Tazio Nuvolari.
Exactly the same thoughts!
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna
Vettel failed to stay on the inside. Even he admits that he should have given way to Kubica and be satisfied with 3rd.
So they should have disqualified JV in Jerez '97 when MS hit him? It was JV who placed himself into position to be deliberately hit.
