2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix - Yas Marina, Dec 10 - 12

[foxivan]

exactly what I feel and want to say. actually hugely unfair to both drivers, coz they will receive criticisms and others will say 'if. I would rather want to see the red flag and let them race for a few laps.


I like the sound of that rule

You could also just say no unlapping after 70% of the race. But I'm ok with standing start. It would have to be a percentage cause of varying number of laps at different tracks.

I'd have preferred a red flag in this situation. Both on Fresh tyres and the fight is more equal. Still a bit unfair on Hamilton but at least it isn't massively unfair to Hamilton. As it is Masi chose a way that made certain that Hamilton would lose.

This kind of situation makes me think of the tour de france and the processional final stage, in which the winner is allowed to ride it home unchallenged.

This would have been the sporting thing to do, the ethical thing to do and the fair thing to do.

As it was, they just decided to choose their own champion. It wasn't Verstappens good luck because they chose to not let anyone unlap initially. That decision was changed (possibly by coincidence, to give the benefit of the doubt) after a Red Bull protest.

It's ugly, really ugly and I don't like F1 right now. I support Mclaren and have not been fond of Hamilton for a long time, he just tells people what they want to hear and who's favourite fans are whatever country he happens to be in at the time and his driving just inspires nothing in me. But what happened is revolting and unfair and it has put me off this sport. I'm sick of F1 and I'm sick of Horner. He and Verstappen have been win at any means possible with little respect for the sport. Weaving, forcing off the track, crying like babies as if they are the victims of the world if they are punished for indiscretions. I'm surprised Hamilton hasn't retired, this has to tear your heart out to see something like that done to you.

[ringo]

The safety car rules are fine. They just need to be followed as we have known them to be for decades.
Masi simply broke the rules to manipulate an outcome.

I do not consider Mercedes to be sore losers.
The sport they were playing got shifted right under them despite them performing and deserving to win that race.
Max did not deserve an equal go at Lewis in the end. he and checo got destroyed. Giving him a handicap on 4s a lap faster tyres to race a car that strategically gained his dominance through using his tyres for 40 laps is by no means a race between two rivals.
This championship will always be remembered as the day the FiA gave redbull a title.

Also on another note. I disagree with those who think Max had the best season.

Maybe there can be another thread for this. But looking on all the races, Max made more errors and bad decisions than hamilton over the season and lost more of the head to head.
He also yeiled less wins for all the laps lead.

But objectively Hamilton had the better season despite suffering long Covid.

Feel free to respond with data and not vitriol.

Max has been on the podium every race in which he did not retire (by own means or due to actions out of his control) with the exception of the one race where he was hit by another driver but could continue in half a car (Hungary). The gap between Max and his teammate was larger than between Lewis and his teammate - which hints at Max being able to extract relatively more from his car (or at Bottas being a much better driver than Checo?). Max has been able to extract stellar pole-gaining or pole-worthy laps in the last races, while being in a much worse car in these last races (which is why Max and Checo were 'destroyed' in recent races - but a championship is not awarded for performance in the last race only). Both drivers excelled this season, but all in all Max managed to excel just a bit more. He had higher highs. But admittedly, lower lows, too.

I dont think he had many stand out drives this year or as many as Lewis. We can list them, but he hasnt really driven any amazing races. I think he performed as expected from the car's earlier dominant pace, but no amazing racing to rememeber.
COTA was maybe his best drive to me.
France second.

Hamilton did more amazing things in his car this year and i think reminded most fans that his racing tool set is more complete.


As for the stats. 10 wins is more like 8. Spa was not driven and was gifted. And abudhabi was also gifted. These 2 had nothing to do with luck. Just pure regulator interference.

For races driven, even including luck. It's more like 9 to 8 in Hamilton's favour.

[radosav]

I don't get it how members here can't see obvious : this will be either Merc accepting FIA verdict or a divorce, and if Merc stays in F1 it will be very bad marriage.

[f1jcw]

Maybe we can switch gears and rail on godlameroso for once again making himself look like a complete buffoon with his "guaranteed" tyre predictions. I guess time to work on some AC tyre model mods and calibration in the offseason.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

I presume if it was accurate, teams would ditch multi-million pound simulators and just go and buy a £300 PS4

[ringo]

I don't get it how members here can't see obvious : this will be either Merc accepting FIA verdict or a divorce, and if Merc stays in F1 it will be very bad marriage.

No they wont leave the sport.
Neither will Lewis.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

[f1jcw]

I don't get it how members here can't see obvious : this will be either Merc accepting FIA verdict or a divorce, and if Merc stays in F1 it will be very bad marriage.

No they wont leave the sport.
Neither will Lewis.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

This is why it needs to go to CAS,unless it is being delt with beind the scenes Ferrari style.

[Gothrek]

The safety car rules are fine. They just need to be followed as we have known them to be for decades.
Masi simply broke the rules to manipulate an outcome.

I do not consider Mercedes to be sore losers.
The sport they were playing got shifted right under them despite them performing and deserving to win that race.
Max did not deserve an equal go at Lewis in the end. he and checo got destroyed. Giving him a handicap on 4s a lap faster tyres to race a car that strategically gained his dominance through using his tyres for 40 laps is by no means a race between two rivals.
This championship will always be remembered as the day the FiA gave redbull a title.

Also on another note. I disagree with those who think Max had the best season.

Maybe there can be another thread for this. But looking on all the races, Max made more errors and bad decisions than hamilton over the season and lost more of the head to head.
He also yeiled less wins for all the laps lead.

But objectively Hamilton had the better season despite suffering long Covid.

Feel free to respond with data and not vitriol.

Max has been on the podium every race in which he did not retire (by own means or due to actions out of his control) with the exception of the one race where he was hit by another driver but could continue in half a car (Hungary). The gap between Max and his teammate was larger than between Lewis and his teammate - which hints at Max being able to extract relatively more from his car (or at Bottas being a much better driver than Checo?). Max has been able to extract stellar pole-gaining or pole-worthy laps in the last races, while being in a much worse car in these last races (which is why Max and Checo were 'destroyed' in recent races - but a championship is not awarded for performance in the last race only). Both drivers excelled this season, but all in all Max managed to excel just a bit more. He had higher highs. But admittedly, lower lows, too.

I dont think he had many stand out drives this year or as many as Lewis. We can list them, but he hasnt really driven any amazing races. I think he performed as expected from the car's earlier dominant pace, but no amazing racing to rememeber.
COTA was maybe his best drive to me.
France second.

Hamilton did more amazing things in his car this year and i think reminded most fans that his racing tool set is more complete.


As for the stats. 10 wins is more like 8. Spa was not driven and was gifted. And abudhabi was also gifted. These 2 had nothing to do with luck. Just pure regulator interference.

For races driven, even including luck. It's more like 9 to 8 in Hamilton's favour.

According to your logic, Silverstone is then also gifted to Hamilton?

[radosav]

I don't get it how members here can't see obvious : this will be either Merc accepting FIA verdict or a divorce, and if Merc stays in F1 it will be very bad marriage.

No they wont leave the sport.
Neither will Lewis.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

This is why it needs to go to CAS,unless it is being delt with beind the scenes Ferrari style.

maybe, but FIA makes F1 rules , and they will not care if those rules hit Merc badly, it wouldn't be first time in F1 history, so everything will calm down next week , Wolf and Hamilton already congratulated Max, so...

[f1jcw]

No they wont leave the sport.
Neither will Lewis.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

This is why it needs to go to CAS,unless it is being delt with beind the scenes Ferrari style.

maybe, but FIA makes F1 rules , and they will not care if those rules hit Merc badly, it wouldn't be first time in F1 history, so everything will calm down next week , Wolf and Hamilton already congratulated Max, so...

Thats the point though, the rules didn't hit Merc bady, ignoring the rules hit Merc badly.

Do you not have concerns that the race control can disregard their own set out rules and decide who should win.
At that point it stops being a competition.

[f1jcw]

Max has been on the podium every race in which he did not retire (by own means or due to actions out of his control) with the exception of the one race where he was hit by another driver but could continue in half a car (Hungary). The gap between Max and his teammate was larger than between Lewis and his teammate - which hints at Max being able to extract relatively more from his car (or at Bottas being a much better driver than Checo?). Max has been able to extract stellar pole-gaining or pole-worthy laps in the last races, while being in a much worse car in these last races (which is why Max and Checo were 'destroyed' in recent races - but a championship is not awarded for performance in the last race only). Both drivers excelled this season, but all in all Max managed to excel just a bit more. He had higher highs. But admittedly, lower lows, too.

I dont think he had many stand out drives this year or as many as Lewis. We can list them, but he hasnt really driven any amazing races. I think he performed as expected from the car's earlier dominant pace, but no amazing racing to rememeber.
COTA was maybe his best drive to me.
France second.

Hamilton did more amazing things in his car this year and i think reminded most fans that his racing tool set is more complete.


As for the stats. 10 wins is more like 8. Spa was not driven and was gifted. And abudhabi was also gifted. These 2 had nothing to do with luck. Just pure regulator interference.

For races driven, even including luck. It's more like 9 to 8 in Hamilton's favour.

According to your logic, Silverstone is then also gifted to Hamilton?

Lewis served a penalty for the incident. The rules were followed and not put aside.

[Just_a_fan]

Maybe we can switch gears and rail on godlameroso for once again making himself look like a complete buffoon with his "guaranteed" tyre predictions. I guess time to work on some AC tyre model mods and calibration in the offseason.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

[barten]

Looks like Masi won't need to worry too much about his job (for now).

Ross Brawn didn't know whether to be pleased or annoyed: "The decision in the last round is a highlight that can't be topped. Unfortunately, the protest takes a bit of the shine off this final." The Englishman defends race director Masi: "It's not acceptable that team bosses put Michael under such pressure during the race. Toto Wolff can't demand that there should be no safety car, and Christian Horner can't demand that the cars have to lap back. That's at the discretion of the race director. We will stop this contact next year."

Translated with DeepL

Source: https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... iert-2022/

[radosav]

This is why it needs to go to CAS,unless it is being delt with beind the scenes Ferrari style.

maybe, but FIA makes F1 rules , and they will not care if those rules hit Merc badly, it wouldn't be first time in F1 history, so everything will calm down next week , Wolf and Hamilton already congratulated Max, so...

Thats the point though, the rules didn't hit Merc bady, ignoring the rules hit Merc badly.

Do you not have concerns that the race control can disregard their own set out rules and decide who should win.
At that point it stops being a competition.

you all take this too much to your heart, it will not be overuled in my opinion

[Tvetovnato]

Someone needs to be punished for this for real. This has destroyed the whole championship. Mercedes are in a very difficult situation. They have all the right in the world to appeal this shambolic rule breach and might well succeed, but by doing so they will portray themselves as bad losers in the public eye, and Hamilton will have his rightfully earned eight title tainted. All through no fault of his own. So the best way for Mercedes is to drop this now, but at the same time, from a justice point of view they simply can’t let it slide.

And it’s not only they who are losing. Max is already losing because of all the controversy around this. Not something you want for your first title. All through no fault of his own this race.

F1 is losing because it has become an embarassment as a sport, if you can even call it that anymore, with all the mess-ups by race control on many occasions this season.

It’s just a shitty, shitty situation that should not have been allowed to happen in the first place.

[Poleman]

After reading all the posts and shared opinions and as much as i respect everyone i want to get an answer with some kind of logic.I keep reading that Masi was in a tough spot and he had a difficult decision to make.Either you are a Hamilton fan or Verstappen fan or anyone else for that matter,i want to ask this:

Why is it a diffucult decision? Yes its the last race of the season with the two main protagonists making there at equal points.In my eyes it doesn't make it different than any other race of the season.Hamilton worked his ass off to build the gap and totally dominated the race on merit and pure pace alone.Now comes a driver that bins it with some 5 odd laps to go and safety car needs to be deployed.Excellent,follow the procedures let the lapped cars overtake and then follow the protocol.Oh you ran out of laps?Tough luck then, just finish behind the safety car whats the big deal? It has surely happened before.If it was the second or third race of the season noone would make a fuss about it.Doesn't make it any different if its a showdown finale or a casual race,its still A RACE and rules should apply as per usual.So Mr.Verstappen you ran out of laps?? Tough luck! You were not meant to be in that posision anyways after how you performed this race.Same goes with Hamilton if the situations were reversed.Whats so difficult to decide as a governing body of the sport? Unless you are hung by the balls of Horner and Toto.

There was no difficult decision to be made.The race didn't go as they planned and since Latifi crashed they grabbed the opportunity to manipulate the ending.I don't believe any of the BS that they did it for the show.Who in their right mind and racing knowledge brings the driver behind on fresh soft tires behind the race leader on 44 lap old hards? Did he really expect Lewis to defend that realistically and provide a "show"??? If yes then they are really naive and they dont even deserve to sell ice cream at the gates of the circuit,let alone rule a Formula one race.

As much as you hate Hamilton his comment was correct,it was manipulated and its just sad.He won't miss this championship he has another seven in the bag but to be shafted in such a blatant way its a worlds first.A new low for F1. Just my 2 cents fellow forum members.