2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix - Yas Marina, Dec 10 - 12

[kenshi_blind]

It should be pretty clear by now that you've been engaging with someone who's arguing in bad faith, every time the flaws in their arguments are pointed out , they revert back to something alone the line of yeah it was Mercedes fault and they somehow saw the possibility of the race ending the way it did

[Big Tea]

Or

You haven't seen it's alledged RB, through Horner, for MV, proposed ignoring the rules.

It does not matter if it was or was not. That was this time it could be any other car or team next time or the same teams the other way around. What any team does (or does not) should have no effect on what happens under the rules of a particular incident. ( I suppose there could possibly be exceptions when all parties are notified well before hand, but even then only in exceptional circumstances.)

Should have might do and whataboutary is the irrelevant bit. It does matter, they may be cuplable and benficiary.

The irrelevant bit is that there is not going to be anything changed this time and no one is going to benefit from proceedings. The important bit is that it should not happen to any team again

[diffuser]

That would create suspicion. Therefore they had a Mercedes powered car do it for them.

Yeah...maybe Toto asked for it as Verstappen was catching Hamilton, and Toto thought that the race would be stopped !
At the end of the day, it was serious mismanagement of Mercedes that caused the problem. They were out thunk ! if they mirrored RBR, they would have won.

You have no idea in how the strategy works if you think Mercedes could mirror what RedBull did.

Or is this just an attempt to troll? Either way, for a mod its pretty poor fella.

Just a note to Aral - At that point in the race, Lewis had started to pull away again on Verstappen.

[alexx_88]

If you believe for a second that, that race would've been restarted the exact way it had been, when Lewis would've been on new soft/meds in 2nd place, and MV on very used hards, I have a bridge to sell you

You're making a ridiculous argument that's contradicted by what happened this year. If Verstapen was the chosen one then:
1. Lewis would've received a much bigger penalty for Silverstone
2. Verstapen would've been allowed to keep the first place from the overtake in Jeddah.
3. Lewis would've been asked to give the place back after the first lap incident on Sunday.

If we're in the realm of stupid conspiracy theories, Max would've had a better story considering the above than Lewis

the fact that you managed to write these points with a straight face is

Try to think with your brain, not just side with your favorite driver

There were a million MUCH MUCH easier ways to give the championship to Max months ago if that was desired. Also, it's hilarious to think that a corporation worth 80B like Mercedes would be totally powerless and oblivious to such a conspiration.

Masi wanted to have a race, but chose the totally wrong way to do it. Red flag and then 6 laps to the finish on the same tires would've been a better way to handle the situation. If he would've let it end under safety car it would've been maybe more outcry, but from the RB camp and other fans as well.

[kenshi_blind]

You're making a ridiculous argument that's contradicted by what happened this year. If Verstapen was the chosen one then:
1. Lewis would've received a much bigger penalty for Silverstone
2. Verstapen would've been allowed to keep the first place from the overtake in Jeddah.
3. Lewis would've been asked to give the place back after the first lap incident on Sunday.

If we're in the realm of stupid conspiracy theories, Max would've had a better story considering the above than Lewis

the fact that you managed to write these points with a straight face is

Try to think with your brain, not just siding with your favorite driver

There were a million MUCH MUCH easier ways to give the championship to Max months ago.

The projection is pretty strong on this one . i very much think with my brain thank you. that's why i won't waste my energy engaging with you and your alternative realities .
my post was regarding the 3 points you made and not some galaxy brain ways to explain how they could have found better ways to give Max the championship
Edit : according to you following the rules and finishing the race under SC would have led to an outcry lol , i guess 2012 never happened then

[Wouter]

That would create suspicion. Therefore they had a Mercedes powered car do it for them.

Yeah...maybe Toto asked for it as Verstappen was catching Hamilton, and Toto thought that the race would be stopped !
At the end of the day, it was serious mismanagement of Mercedes that caused the problem. They were out thunk ! if they mirrored RBR, they would have won.

..
You have no idea in how the strategy works if you think Mercedes could mirror what RedBull did.

Or is this just an attempt to troll? Either way, for a mod its pretty poor fella.

You really have no idea what you're saying here.

Aral who doesn't understand how the strategy works?!

[Ryar]

Yeah...maybe Toto asked for it as Verstappen was catching Hamilton, and Toto thought that the race would be stopped !
At the end of the day, it was serious mismanagement of Mercedes that caused the problem. They were out thunk ! if they mirrored RBR, they would have won.

..
You have no idea in how the strategy works if you think Mercedes could mirror what RedBull did.

Or is this just an attempt to troll? Either way, for a mod its pretty poor fella.

You really have no idea what you're saying here.

Aral who doesn't understand how the strategy works?!

Anyone that can talk a different perspective to the current emotional flow is an antagonist right now. So let's agree on that.

[Roo]

It does not matter if it was or was not. That was this time it could be any other car or team next time or the same teams the other way around. What any team does (or does not) should have no effect on what happens under the rules of a particular incident. ( I suppose there could possibly be exceptions when all parties are notified well before hand, but even then only in exceptional circumstances.)

Should have might do and whataboutary is the irrelevant bit. It does matter, they may be cuplable and benficiary.

The irrelevant bit is that there is not going to be anything changed this time and no one is going to benefit from proceedings. The important bit is that it should not happen to any team again

A strange circle

[Starkblood80]

..
You have no idea in how the strategy works if you think Mercedes could mirror what RedBull did.

Or is this just an attempt to troll? Either way, for a mod its pretty poor fella.

You really have no idea what you're saying here.

Aral who doesn't understand how the strategy works?!

Anyone that can talk a different perspective to the current emotional flow is an antagonist right now. So let's agree on that.

Only a select few.

[alexx_88]

the fact that you managed to write these points with a straight face is

Try to think with your brain, not just siding with your favorite driver

There were a million MUCH MUCH easier ways to give the championship to Max months ago.

The projection is pretty strong on this one . i very much think with my brain thank you. that's why i won't waste my energy engaging with you and your alternative realities .
my post was regarding the 3 points you made and not some galaxy brain ways to explain how they could have found better ways to give Max the championship
Edit : according to you following the rules and finishing the race under SC would have led to an outcry lol , i guess 2012 never happened then

I think you have comprehension issues. I replied to another post that was suggesting the whole thing was orchestrated to give Max the championship.

To turn this into something constructive, you replied to a message that wasn't intended for you, what are you trying to say?

2012 had no perspective of getting a direct fight between the two protagonists, no matter what the safety car did. Totally baseless comparison.

[aral]

That would create suspicion. Therefore they had a Mercedes powered car do it for them.

Yeah...maybe Toto asked for it as Verstappen was catching Hamilton, and Toto thought that the race would be stopped !
At the end of the day, it was serious mismanagement of Mercedes that caused the problem. They were out thunk ! if they mirrored RBR, they would have won.

Please elaborate on how they would have won by mirroring RB.

Also, any strategy decision made by Merc OR RB, have NOTHING to do with the race director flouting the rules. Frankly this is a bit troubling coming from a mod.

Why is it troubling? it is an unbiased viewpoint from someone who has actually raced. nothing to do with being a mod....a golden rule of racing (and also mentioned by brundle) is to do what your competitor does. this means that they get no advantage . Had Merc called in Hamilton for a set of softs, he would still have been in front of Verstappen and held him off. Had Hamilton stopped and Verstappen not stopped, then their positions would have been reversed at the restart.....Verstappen out on older hards, and Hamilton on new softs. Result would then have been similar....Hamilton sweeping past Verstappen to win.
That is my PERSONAL opinion, like it or not.

[Poleman]

I have a question, and this time I want to speak up, after lurking for years.
So why doens't red bull use the following strategy:
Whenever Lewis pull up enough of a gap in front of Vestappan, a Tauro Rosso car would intentionally crash to create a safety car, preferreably after Lewis missed the pit entry ,
In this case, Vestappan had at least 2 chances of jumping on Lewis with fresh tire, or even without fresher tire, he'd defend like crazy. I thought this was the ultimate weapon for a desperate win.

Just saying.

I think it would be a very see through tactic- particularly in light of Piquet jr and Alonso for Renault, and generally something that's just frowned upon out of principle by the teams- particularly because of the safety aspect of such things. I cannot see a team ever stooping so low.

I thought that it would be funny to see the faces at RedBull on lap 57 if Bottas parked it at the track with a mechanical "issue" and force the SC to stay out. I would honestly do that if i was Mercedes because it was clear what was about to happen.

[NathanOlder]

Yeah...maybe Toto asked for it as Verstappen was catching Hamilton, and Toto thought that the race would be stopped !
At the end of the day, it was serious mismanagement of Mercedes that caused the problem. They were out thunk ! if they mirrored RBR, they would have won.

..
You have no idea in how the strategy works if you think Mercedes could mirror what RedBull did.

Or is this just an attempt to troll? Either way, for a mod its pretty poor fella.

You really have no idea what you're saying here.

Aral who doesn't understand how the strategy works?!

Go on then Mr expert, explain how Mercedes could have mirrored RedBull. And remember that at no point would Mercedes give up track position and run the risk of having to pass max on track.

[kenshi_blind]

Try to think with your brain, not just siding with your favorite driver

There were a million MUCH MUCH easier ways to give the championship to Max months ago.

The projection is pretty strong on this one . i very much think with my brain thank you. that's why i won't waste my energy engaging with you and your alternative realities .
my post was regarding the 3 points you made and not some galaxy brain ways to explain how they could have found better ways to give Max the championship
Edit : according to you following the rules and finishing the race under SC would have led to an outcry lol , i guess 2012 never happened then

I think you have comprehension issues. I replied to another post that was suggesting the whole thing was orchestrated to give Max the championship.




To turn this into something constructive, you replied to a message that wasn't intended for you, what are you trying to say?

2012 had no perspective of getting a direct fight between the two protagonists, no matter what the safety car did. Totally baseless comparison.

i know the message was not intended for me . my point is the 3 points you choose to base your counter argument on were not relevant no matter what tin foil hat theory the poster you were replying to came up with.
Edit : now 2012 is not relevant because there was no direct fight between two protagonist ? i see the goalposts have moved again .

[El Scorchio]

I have a question, and this time I want to speak up, after lurking for years.
So why doens't red bull use the following strategy:
Whenever Lewis pull up enough of a gap in front of Vestappan, a Tauro Rosso car would intentionally crash to create a safety car, preferreably after Lewis missed the pit entry ,
In this case, Vestappan had at least 2 chances of jumping on Lewis with fresh tire, or even without fresher tire, he'd defend like crazy. I thought this was the ultimate weapon for a desperate win.

Just saying.

I think it would be a very see through tactic- particularly in light of Piquet jr and Alonso for Renault, and generally something that's just frowned upon out of principle by the teams- particularly because of the safety aspect of such things. I cannot see a team ever stooping so low.

I thought that it would be funny to see the faces at RedBull on lap 57 if Bottas parked it at the track with a mechanical "issue" and force the SC to stay out. I would honestly do that if i was Mercedes because it was clear what was about to happen.

Can you imagine!? Although I'm pretty glad they didn't. That would have been the height of cynicism!